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Sonic AYII

Discussion in 'Fangaming Discussion' started by Lapper, Mar 18, 2012.

  1. Blue Emerald

    Blue Emerald

    Teleportation, yeah! Member
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    Elaborating on this, I had an idea for my Sonic game where with one or two of the bosses, they would launch themselves into the air or underground, and you would need to duck or look up to see where they are and where they intend to attack; the attacks would seem random to those who don't think to do that. This way, looking up and ducking to move the screen would be a lot more useful. I wanted to be one of the first (if not the first) to do something like that with a boss, but I think maybe you could put this concept somewhere in your game.
     
  2. jasonchrist

    jasonchrist

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    That's a great idea for something like Sonic 1. But murder in 2 and 3 where it there's a delay before the scroll. Love it though!
     
  3. Deef

    Deef

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    That look up/down idea is nice!


    I can never think of a new move for Tails that would be fitting in a classic game. I do however think his flight and swimming motion need a bit of an overhaul to be more fun.

    Regarding the idea of Knuckles diving, I would say be careful with extra moves whose reward is about killing badniks. Simply because killing badniks in a classic Sonic is not actually a strong focus of the gameplay; you (well I) kill them when they get in the way or might provide a handy rebound. Such a move sounds nice on paper but I think it's important to think more about what it does for the player in terms of motion.

    Regarding wall jumping, personally I think it's quite a pokey move.
     
  4. Blue Emerald

    Blue Emerald

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    That makes sense why they did that, though, since you had to duck first to use the spin-dash in 2 and 3, so having the camera move like that would be annoying; the delay for looking up would only make sense where the Super Peel-Out is concerned, though.

    I just thought of something. You know how in Smash Bros., if you double-tap the analog stick, you can dash? What if the controls in this game were made so that if you double-tapped up or down, that would allow you to immediately pan the camera above or below you? That would solve the issue of the camera delay, if this game were to have some use for looking up or down. Also, that way it would still perform normally when you're just regularly ducking or charging a spin-dash.
     
  5. Effexor

    Effexor

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    I don't know if you'd feel up to it, but I liked Sonic 3k's Knuckles only routes that were blocked off by the other characters with walls only Knuckles could break. Maybe that could be his third "move": passive wall-breaking. I also think he should keep his lower jump.

    As for Tails, I know this would go against how he's typically seen, but maybe a "Peel-out" like move where he uses his tails to build up speed before dashing off?
     
  6. LordOfSquad

    LordOfSquad

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    I figure, why not just rip-off Advance's "new" techniques? They did just fine.
     
  7. Lapper

    Lapper

    Lappering Tech Member
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    I have updated the plan a bit:
    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27349627/S4%20AYII.rtf

    It now includes more depth with the levels and what shields there will be, but nothing is complete or certian. I wanted to include the original because I think it is always good to have the crap one somewhere :v:
     
  8. Rosie

    Rosie

    aka Rosie Member
    Would you consider shield-specific paths? Such as a lava or electricity path that you needed the respective shield to cross it safely, or something like a lightning barrier in a base level, that you could only get through if you had the electricity shield. You could put these paths a good distance away from the shield monitor, and reward players that had the skill to keep that shield with a quicker path and/or rings and extra lives. All these paths would be completely optional, of course.
     
  9. Lapper

    Lapper

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    I really like this idea, thanks! :)

    I am wondering whether to put another shield in there too, but to go along with he pattern, it'd need to be another elemental shield, and I don't think there is one.

    By the way, I have the graphics done for the first two shields completely, and am compiling a little demo to show them, and the later ones off. I'm rather proud of what I have done with them.
     
  10. Rosie

    Rosie

    aka Rosie Member
    Well if you're going along the elemental theme, you've got the Greek classical elements: Air, Earth, Fire, Water. Or the Five Japanese elements: Earth, Water, Fire, Wind, and Void, of course there are more, but these are probably the most relevant, and I can't really see a wood shield or the like working.

    You could have a void shield that lets you go through certain walls and stops badniks from noticing you. (Except that idea sucks)

    Or maybe a metal shield which lets you stick to magnetic surfaces, and possibly allows you to walk over spikes.

    I dunno. It's a tough one, I'm out of ideas XD.
     
  11. Lapper

    Lapper

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    You come up with some really good ideas! Not that you are the only one, but you have some rapid fire with them :v:

    I'm not sure how it would work visually, but maybe an earth shield would prevent you being crushed.

    ...and maybe the electricity/magnet shield could act like the spike wisp and let you stick on metal walls, as well as all it's usual functions.
     
  12. dsrb

    dsrb

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    If we were to conveniently say that the lightning shield represents air (since electricity can [in a way] travel through air, and an actual air shield would really suck), that would make the options earth or void.

    An earth shield could be handy if you decide to incorporate environmental hazards such as rockfalls, earthquakes, etc. You could also, perhaps, make this the only shield that reflects projectiles and debris, although perhaps that would seem a bit too much like a downgrade from S3&K for the other shields. Besides, if that were a feature you'd consider, it'd be more appropriate to reinstate the normal (blue) shield and give it to that.

    This isn't a bad idea, but will there be many magnetic surfaces in Sonica's levels?
    Reversing things, I quite like the idea of a magnetic shield, but there wouldn't be many more metal surfaces either; and this would have quite a bit of overlap with the lightning shield, which might cause confusion and/or redundancy.

    As for a new element not mentioned above, I'm pretty clueless! As I am overall. :v:
     
  13. Tiller

    Tiller

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    You could just give new attributes to the old shields if nothing really comes to mind for new ones. Bach got me thinking about shield specific paths, but how you could get away with that without throwing a player into a deathtrap if they try would be tricky. You would need the shield to activate some sort of path otherwise inaccessible if you didn't have it, else someone is going to try and they are going to die every time. The lightning shield for example could be used and to power up a door or generator in a factory level and open a new path and when hit causes an emp that disables badniks for a moment. Bach already suggested magnetics which could easily be another addition to the lightning shield. The fire shield could pass through walls of lava or ride lava currents, melt frozen objects, and could also be used as a lighting gimmick to light a darker cave path. You could expand the bubble shield's projectile protection into projectile reflection so that they bounce back at enemies that tossed them. Maybe even have the bubble interact with walls when you slam into them at high speed, causing you to ricochet off walls like a pinball. That could lead into unique stage puzzles to access some other path.

    As for different shields, I like the idea of a swirling air shield gusting around Sonic, though I don't know what you could do with it. Maybe provide slightly faster acceleration and allow full aerial movement control when in the air? Though that kind of tosses out momentum if you can turn around in the air on a dime. The shield attack in the air could cause a wind burst that pushes enemies away from you? It could also make Sonic immune to wind hazards like the fans in Starlight zone and similar to every non bubble shield it would die out in water.

    For an earth shield I really have no idea what this would do. Give it Espio's ram things at full speed without taking damage? Spindash makes you a boulder and can slam into harder walls to break them down for alternate paths? Air attack shoots pebbles out in a circle around Sonic before coming back? Earth isn't really a hazard for Sonic aside from being crushed. I don't think this one is nearly as viable as air.

    Or you could pull a Kirby 64 and be able to combine shield powers. That's even more out there though.
     
  14. dsrb

    dsrb

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    Some good ideas there.

    Your ideas are good considering how unintuitive this proposed shield is, but that's just the problem! I don't know whether it has much potential. Not that I wouldn't be interested to be proven wrong!

    Actually, good point! That could be a nice form of defence. The wall would just halt its fall until Sonic was out of the way.

    ORLY? ;) Nah, maybe you're right.

    Gunstar Heroes tiem!!!
     
  15. winterhell

    winterhell

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    as for obstacle, there could be quicksand, the more you struggle the faster you fall and you have to do something in particular to get out. Or perhaps on some quicksands you just drop to lower path instead of dying. With the earth shield you can walk right on top of the obstacle.
     
  16. TheInvisibleSun

    TheInvisibleSun

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    I think your ideas of expanding the elemental shields' attributes and purpose is brilliant.

    However, the danger with creating new elemental shields is that they inevitably break away too far from the conceptual simplicity of the original ones Since each one is tied to a double-jump direction (up, forward, down), any new ones would have to deviate from this (because there are no more directions). The new ones could become too reliant on gimmicks and events, and differ too much from the originals. A way to possibly avoid this could be to have "stage-specific" ones that would act as ways to reach new paths. Even still, the expanded originals can somewhat accomplish this already.
     
  17. Tiller

    Tiller

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    Indeed. Throwing out the air shield and earth shield ideas was supposed to highlight that. I couldn't think of anything that wasn't loaded with gimmickry or covered by the other shields. The only thing that seems appropriate is wind hazard resistance, but how many stages posses wind gimmicks beyond a token 1 or 2 where water, fire, and rings will show up in the majority of stages. The Lightning covers a double jump, Fire covers a burst of speed forward, bounce covers jump height. There isn't anywhere to really go direction wise as you pointed out. Simply adding a few new mechanics to the existing shields seems like the best route to go.

    I'm actually wondering how far you could push it before it goes too far. I really do like the idea of the bubble shield and the electric shield applying different physics properties in certain contexts. Magnetism could yank you around and stick you to walls, or it could repel you, making other sections of a level more difficult or give you the ability to reach one of the special paths. Imagine setting up a round level object that only pulls in Sonic when he has the shield, then abusing the attraction with a skilled jump creating a magnetic slingshot via the physics that will speed your way into upper paths and through the acts. Making The bubble shield act like a bouncing bubble when you slam into walls at high speeds could prove to be a very fun mechanic if handled right. You could do something like implement a wall jump of sorts by bouncing side to side up a small chasm section with it given proper set up and level design. It would serve to make Sonic feel more like a pinball, though if you over do it Sonic would become unwieldy.
     
  18. Lapper

    Lapper

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    Ok, sorry to throw the subject askew, but I haven't had much to show lately and thought I'd show you this for fun:
    http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27349627/Sheilds.zip

    I compiled an Exe to show off the graphics and animations I have been making for the first 3 simplest shields, normal, invincibility and bubble.

    I've been making these for ages (since my canceled sprite topic a while ago) and never thought I would get them this good, so, naturally I am eager to show them.


    Use arrows (up, down, left or right :thumbsup: ) to move Sonic, and use the buttons on-screen to play around to your hearts content.

    I am still clueless on how to do the fire, earth (if we have one) and electricity type shields.



    ...Anyway, continue! You lot are steaming with ideas, so thanks!
     
  19. Deef

    Deef

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    The water shield is awesome.
     
  20. Elratauru

    Elratauru

    Little Shiny Emurralds Member
    Oooh water shield is bubbly :3

    Well, the Fire Shield in S3 was pretty much a fireball burning up, kinda like when you lit on fire a torch.

    [​IMG]

    I believe you're gonna need some CG or hand-draw animation for that one, maybe add some fire-ashes trail like on this video torches:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uCP1XnW70Xk#t=114s