don't click here

Sonic 2 (Movie) Spoiler/Discussion Topic (Stay away if you don't want to be spoiled)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Sonic Warrior TJ, Mar 30, 2022.

  1. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    Metal Sonic will probably debut on the same movie as Amy, so I guess it's either both or none of them. Stone working with Shadow to bring the doctor back to life is a possibility, but Shadow having its own agenda and Robotnik creating Metal Sonic to help him dealing with both hedgehogs is possible too.
     
  2. The Joebro64

    The Joebro64

    SAY HELLO TO MY CHOCOLATE BLEND Member
    2,028
    1,336
    93
    My only real criticism of the movie, aside from some cliche writing and exposition dumps that could've been executed a bit better, was that there were a few instances of some wonky CGI, like Eggman and Knuckles on the Egg Mobile in IceCap. It was few and far between and didn't ruin the movie but it did take me out of the moment a smidge.

    Other than that, this movie was fantastic. It reminded me of The Batman in how it picks and chooses from the source material's history and remixes the elements in ways that feel simultaneously familiar and fresh. I especially enjoyed how it recontextualizes the first movie as the first part of a larger Sonic narrative and takes little things you didn't notice and builds upon them. The dynamic between Sonic and Tails was fantastic, Knuckles was a lovable doofus, and the ending with the Wachowskis being parents to all three of them was so wholesome.

    I still think Jim Carrey's just pulling the "say I'm not doing the next one so they'll pay me millions to do the next one" card, but if he doesn't, I think his performance here would be a fantastic finale to his career. He's in peak form in Sonic 2, his Eggman blending maniacal insanity with goofy comic charm even better than he did in the first one. Lee Majdoub wasn't in it as much but I really think it's impossible to hate Agent Stone. I did miss a few of the other side characters from the first movie (I was hoping for a Crazy Carl cameo) but that's a minor quibble.

    And goodness there were so many cool moments in this movie. Seeing IceCap and Labyrinth in live-action was surreal in the best way. GUN was introduced perfectly. The Master Emerald and the Chaos Emeralds were done so well. I'm HYPED to see Shadow in the next one. I just found this a thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyable experience from start to finish. And there were so many deep cuts. There is now a live-action Sonic movie that contains references to Sonic 4. Let that sink in for a minute. The people who made this (I want to name you all but there are too many - just know that I thank and appreciate you!) show so much reverence for the source material and it warms my heart.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2022
  3. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    That's why I want a list of the references to games (or other media) present in this movie. While I can't get something I've never had in front of me, your example of Sonic 4 makes evident there were things there I didn't get and could have. I watched the movie primarily trying to get all the references I could, so you could say I was playing my own game while I was there, and I want a results panel to check out my performance.
     
  4. corneliab

    corneliab

    Isn't it about time you played some VIDEOGAMES? Member
    1,583
    140
    43
    Zero Mortals
    Got a chance to see the movie again today. God, that last act is just so strong. Overall I am very impressed at what they were able to execute here, doubly so considering all the chances these movies had to completely drop the ball with such a property as Sonic.

    Really love that Knuckles both knocked the Master Emerald (and the Chaos Emeralds, by association) out of "Super" Eggman (similar to how he knocked the emeralds out of Super Sonic in S3&K), and that he reforged the broken Master Emerald. I find the lore in this movie to be fascinating, particularly with the Master Emerald being used to absorb the Chaos Emeralds (literally "unifying the Chaos"). I wonder if they'll explore the implications of that in the next one... I can imagine them going in a few directions with this. My impression is that the Master Emerald was used to filter the Chaos Emeralds' power into a usable state by the echidnas, but it resulted in a weaker overall power. This would track with Eggman in S3&K attempting to weaponize the Master Emerald but abandoning it afterwards in favor of the Chaos Emeralds again.

    I saw that they're gonna be selling a Jim Carrey Dr. Robotnik figure and I want it. This movie makes me feel like a kid again lol.
     
  5. The Joebro64

    The Joebro64

    SAY HELLO TO MY CHOCOLATE BLEND Member
    2,028
    1,336
    93
    I could be wrong but I think I noticed one of Sonic and Tails' combo moves from Episode II and the massive spike ball in Labyrinth looked like a reference to Lost Labyrinth in Episode I.
     
  6. Fadaway

    Fadaway

    Member
    276
    61
    28
    I saw it earlier. I loved a lot of things about it. I thought the ending was weird. I dunno. I will come back with more thoughts on it later. But, I will say a lot of it was really fun. The Rachel scenes were uproarious. I wasn't a big fan of some of the jokes and pop culture references but there were quite a few damn hilarious moments. I'll say a lot more later. Very fun movie for what it is worth.
     
  7. Something pointed out to me that @The Joebro64 reminded me of, the first scene in the first movie changes entirely. The Echidnas were never after Sonic's power, they were after LongClaw's knowledge. Shit like that just tickles me.

    THough I did think it was weird how the Map didn't activate when Sonic touched it in the first movie in hindsight of this movie.
     
  8. jman2050

    jman2050

    Teh Sonik Haker Tech Member
    634
    4
    18
    If one of you madmen in Fangaming Discussion isn't making the credit sequence of this movie into a real game right now then what good even is this site?

    Also the movie was absolutely amazing, a pitch perfect adaptation of the characters and style of the games, even moreso than the first film.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 2
    • List
  9. jubbalub

    jubbalub

    Sonic Mania fanboy Member
    583
    535
    93
    Sonic Mania: The Misfits Pack, The Binding of Isaac: Deliverance
    I'm gonna go against the grain here and say I actually liked the humans MORE in this movie compared to the first. Especially how Maddie ACTUALLY had a role pivotal to the plot with saving Tom and the gang. I thought the whole sham wedding thing being a cover for GUN capturing Sonic was hilarious. I didn't expect to actually show the Chaos Emeralds, and I liked how they were utilized here. As soon as I saw them break out of the master emerald I knew exactly where it was going.

    Knuckles is just so good. His voice is perfect and his characterization is on point. He's gone from being a complete dumbass meathead to a stoic, gullible, honor-bound warrior. And when he got "stupid" it wasn't just because he's unintelligent, he legitimately just doesn't understand because it's an alien planet with completely different customs. Good way to introduce the slightly duller portion of the character.

    I disliked a couple things in particular. The bar scene in Siberia, of course. I also didn't like Eggman quite as much as in the first movie. It felt like he phoned it in at some points. However at other points he was even better and more ridiculous than the first movie. Kind of a mixed bag here, but I like how the ending leaves his fate ambiguous so if he decides to retire they can use a new antagonist.

    My biggest complaint, unfortunately, is Tails. His characterization is mostly fine, maybe a little too obsessed with Sonic, but he DEFINITELY feels phoned in. It feels like the movie could've gone the exact same way without him, minus the finale. He was just introduced with very little fanfare. I wish the movie expanded more upon how Sonic and Tails become friends, maybe introduce him to Sonic a little less abruptly, and just give him more screentime.

    I totally expected Shadow to be teased, but I WASN'T expecting them to just spell it out and show him outright. That was nice. I do wonder how he came to be, though, as Sonic just came to Earth under a year ago. Did they have knowledge of Sonic's existence 50 years ago? Who is he going to team up with? Is he a robot? WHO KNOWS

    Overall, very good movie, would watch again. It's definitely less "traditional", but as a Sonic fan it was candy. They really could've just thrown some slop together and called it a day, but this is an unabashed Sonic movie, and my inner child is super giddy.

    Also the poster is dope
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • List
  10. Fadaway

    Fadaway

    Member
    276
    61
    28
    I didn't bother with the post-credits scene as I had to piss badly and knew it was on YouTube and already knew what was going on thanks to spoilers.
     
  11. Fadaway

    Fadaway

    Member
    276
    61
    28
    Best scene in the movie was the dance-off in Siberia. But, it was a bit weird that it was in Siberia. However, as somebody who already has a fascination with Siberian history, I could accept it.

    The worst scene in the movie was the Death Egg Robot doing dance moves. That wasn't exactly intense or humorous imo. It could have been more intimidating. Also, the Tornado scenes were over with too quickly. There were pretty much zero locations from the games while we're at it. Well, aside from the Labyrinth Zone/Hidden Palace Zone Emerald shrine. Places that may have looked similar but weren't the same don't count.

    However, what they were able to bring in from the games is satisfactory for now and is a lot more than many video game movies can do. So, I give this lots of credit. Overall, the entertainment value matters most and I'd say there is a lot to love here. I am the type of person who is very critical of CGI in films but with a movie about anthropomorphic characters, one does have to suspend disbelief before stepping foot into a cinema and what they did have was solid.

    I abhor the inevitable children's movie framing with James Marsden as a surrogate wholesome dad and the ending with them playing baseball. I hate sports in general so maybe I'm biased. Is baseball even big in Japan? I dunno.

    It seems very American-ised. However, I do give James Marsden credit because he is an enjoyable character usually. More often than not at least and it could have been so much worse. I even noticed something that seemed like a Mania reference if I am not mistaken.

    But, no animals being used to power Badniks. At least not that I saw specifically. That was a bummer. But still, the scene where Rachel was fucking shit up was genuinely funny.

    The weight of them bringing in this much game lore, how little they did, is still astounding for a feature film. Jim Carrey was good. I thought a lot of that was fairly great. The comedy of the Eggman character itself was there and the games were hardly comedy based. But, he did a very good job in my opinion. I even liked the animation segment (not the end credits which looked great themselves but the part during an exposition dump).

    I'd give it a solid 898,731.869 gangstalker capybaras out of forty-two FBI informants. Cheers!
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2022
  12. Frostav

    Frostav

    Member
    602
    183
    43
    I've seen people say the wedding scene drags things down but...I dunno, that joke where it gets revealed that EVERY person there is a GUN agent was honestly pretty damn funny. The priest opening the bible to reveal it's a fake with a gun in it got by far the biggest laughs from the theater where I saw it. Frankly, I think they did a perfect job with balancing the humans with the Sonic cast. The former are just there enough to be fun without bogging down everything.

    Now, the Siberian bar scene? Absolutely unbearable an-out-of-touch-executive-demanded-this-be-put-in-because-kids-like-WACKY-MUSIC-AND-DANCES-AMIRITE dreck, except for the extremely adorable ending (Tails sleeping might actually be the cutest thing ever). Cut THAT shit out.

    (my overall thoughts on the movie were that I adored it, though!)

    There was also a water truck with "Splash Hills" on it in the scene where Sonic and Tails are escaping Knux with a police car
     
  13. Mana

    Mana

    Good! Great! Awesome! Outstanding! Amazing! Member
    633
    228
    43
    It's weird. I both think this movie was great while also feeling like it was just okay?

    I think Jeff Fowler is a great director. No element of the movie felt underutilized. It tried to appeal to multiple and wildly different demographics and succeeded. I thought the slice of life stuff with the weddings had some really funny parts. I think Sonic and Tails journey across the world was fun. I think all the characters got a moment to shine. I really liked the action sequences too. It was a great movie from beginning to end. I think it goes unstated how much polish and competency can go a long way in making something basic into a memorable experience and he did it.

    I just wish it wasn't afraid to be more of a Sonic movie.

    In a world where we have films like Into the Spider-Verse, X-Men Days of Future Past, Guardians of the Galaxy, The Suicide Squad, and The Batman which are films that take their source material and present it as closely as possible in live action with VERY few changes to make it work, I wish Sonic could do the same.

    Like, no matter how funny it was, is a Sonic movie the place where you'd expect a vagina wax, implied to be done for sex during a honeymoon, joke? Like I said the wedding part was well written but it was out of place. It felt like they filmed it for a different movie and placed it here for whatever reason. It had no place in a Sonic movie. It helped make it feel like they were writing a family movie WITH Sonic and not a Sonic movie for the family.

    Ben Schratz isn't playing Sonic, my true blue hero who's cocky, never gives up, and is fully of self confidence. He's playing himself in a blue fur suit. Silly, full of relevant pop culture references, and cool and casual with it all. That's fine. Just not what I really want.

    That ties into my feelings about Jim Carrey as Eggman. He steals the show. He's hilarious, full of energy. and is evil and loves it and I love seeing him on screen. But that's not Eggman. That's not the round angry old man who wants to make a world where machines take care of every aspect of our lives (but for our own good he promises!). And that's FINE. Just not what I really want.

    The sort of doesn't for for the others. Knuckles is great in this movie as this ultra literal tribe man with extreme power. But even though he's not the stoic serious guardian of the master emerald who's always wondering about his purpose in the grand scheme of things, I REALLY like this change. They've been trying to give his character new purpose in other medias for ages and I think this has pulled it off. Idris did a great job.

    Tails is basically 1:1 to the games except for having a more detailed origin so not much to say there. Coleen hit it out the ball park and I loved how she made his voice a little deeper. I still feel like the changes to the other 3 might trickle down to the games and I really don't want it for Sonic or Eggman.

    I love the Sonic OVA because it knew how to do this sort of adaptation well. It had several changes and differences from the original games but it was not afraid to let the characters be themselves and the world to be as Sonic like as possible while not tying completely to game canon. That's my ideal adaptation. Not sticking to the original like a bible but also not afraid to let the characters be who you loved from the source.

    I want a Sonic movie that treats the established lore we've known for years with dignity and respect. A movie that makes me feel like I'm in the world of Sonic. With all the lore and characters we've come to love and appreciate having a role. I think it's possible to do. They just need the faith to commit to it.

    You can name the army GUN, you can have Mean Bean Machine and Sonic 4 references galore but ultimately if it fails to feel like the games it's borderline lip service to me. It's unfortunate because I know the guy is writing this to Paramount's specifications and working hard to get in the references we DO have but it is what it is.


    Overall, it was a good movie and I would watch it again. I just can't wait for the day a studio is confident to give us a Sonic experience that has faith in capturing the tone of the games rather than having to hide itself under slice of life honeymoon plots, no matter how well written they might be. I've just also accepted that won't be anytime soon.

    I'd like to be wrong and the Sonic movies keep getting better and more like the games each time but I just don't see it happening. Would love to eat my words though!
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2022
  14. Fadaway

    Fadaway

    Member
    276
    61
    28
    I will add that the movie is very enjoyable no matter what critics are saying. It was a fun, very enjoyable ride through and through. I have a conspiracy theory that a lot of the critics are just trying to bash this (especially in headlines) for ulterior motives. The movie itself is a blast.
     
  15. Linkabel

    Linkabel

    Member
    I thought the GUN wedding scene was funny as well, my issue is that the whole segment with Rachel going back to get revenge on Randall is longer than it needs to be.

    Siberia is the same, even as a kid I'm always been whatever about dance scenes in these kind of movies. But there a came a point when it felt it was going too long.

    In both situations the time could've been used to better establish the bond between characters instead.

    In Siberia, Sonic & Tails could've have a longer moment to bond, and even addressed the relationship between Sonic and Longclaw that he just saw in the hologram. (And it would've tied nicely with the feather scene at the beginning of the movie.)

    Same with Hawaii, Sonic could've had a longer moment with Tom and Maddie like we saw before he runs off to the temple.

    I think that's what reviewers were complaining that the charm/heart of the first movie disappears during the middle part of this one.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  16. Guys, I loved this movie. Seeing Super sonic on screen brought me right back to 1994/95. Sitting in the living room playing the copy of Sonic 3 my dad got me for my birthday. I had played Sonic 2 and knew there was a "gold sonic" in it but I was too young to be any good at the game when I came out (although I did play sonic 1 and 2 in 1992. Sonic 1 was the first cheat code i ever learned from a game, hence my username. Id played mario before sonic but sonic stole my heart). Or at least at getting the emeralds. I beat the main campaigns of 1 and 2 but only after getting super in 3 did I go back to 2 and do it. And at the time I didn't know there was a "doomsday zone" i'd only barely beaten the giant robot boss in DeathEgg act 2, so I replayed S&k after that...and my mind was blown, literally changed forever. Then I went looking in every sonic game id ever played or owned, looking for the emeralds.
    This movie brought me back to that feeling I had when I unlocked super for the first time, and I think my wife had a better time seeing my stupid damn face than even I did. I was roariously happy. Getting the chaos emeralds and fighting to save the world impacted my life so much, especially the ending to S3k, it influenced my career in studying the cosmos. I'm still cheesing as I type this, wondering if I'll spend money just to see the last 1/3 of the movie again. I totally would, it did it for me.

    The middle of the movie dragged though, that was the only "bad" part. The post wedding scene was stupid, fun but stupid. Couldn't wait for them to get back to sonic and Tails.

    Lol Tails was so cute, just like he was originally. Sonic and Tails sleeping by the fire, my wife was like "awwwwww".

    Knuckles was done so proper, I'd forgotten why he was so popular in the 90s. I can't express how well Idris did it for me, a very welcome surprise that he committed to the character and reminded people that knuckles was not 'stupid', he was just a fish out of water like goku was is DragonBall. I hope this continues.


    I completely expected shadow at the end. I'm more of a mecha sonic guy, so the fact that metal isn't showing (that we know of) doesn't bother me. I hope they make Sonic movie 3's plot make more sense than the game did lol, they can't go full anime. But also, I have a soft spot for shadow because he is the embodiment of my little brothers era of sonic. My little brother, when he was born, automatically became the designated Tails and loved sonic as much as me. He respected the games that I loved and loved them as much as me, especially S3K and SA1. SA2 I played on the dreamcast and I didn't love it as much as others who started on the Nintendo. My little brother felt the same as me.....but the kid loved shadow, everything about the emo edge lord stuff. So every time I see shadow and I think "God, that's really where the series started its decline"....I also simultaneously think..."you know, shadow isn't so bad. I see why my brother thinks he's so cool, he's got a really cool design." And that's exactly what I thought seeing him in the post credits scene. If I can, I'm gonna get a plane ticket and meet my brother to see Sonic 3 together.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2022
  17. ItsBrieDude

    ItsBrieDude

    my brain is the spinning seal gif Member
    First impressions from my viewing:

    * Pacing felt all over the place. Much of the wedding scenes could have been cut down.
    * They struck a really nice balance between referencing the source material and doing their own thing.
    * Knuckles is a doofus and I love him.
    * Simplification of Chaos and Master emerald lore feels very good for a film setting.
    * Fanservice game was on point.
    * I said this about the first film, but I would have liked if they introduced musical motifs from the games, even if orchestrated. Feels like a wasted opportunity given the rich musical history.
    * I’m being critical, but the film was overall great for me. I had higher expectations so it hit lower, but the inverse was true last time.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  18. Flare

    Flare

    Member
    886
    152
    43
    I liked Rachel... BUT... what annoyed me was I was expecting more with Maddie. I would have loved if they trimmed a lot of the wedding (the 'wish Sonic had a gang' and the ring stuff was cute but... was a bit slow) and instead had much more with Maddie. She got the gadgets then it cuts to her breaking in. Felt a bit abrupt.
     
  19. Linkabel

    Linkabel

    Member
    Yep, we spent some so much time in that segment that Maddie's time to shine passes in a blink of an eye.

    I do hope that she gets more attention in Sonic 3.
     
  20. MykonosFan

    MykonosFan

    MODE CHANGE. Moderator
    3,645
    402
    63
    ...or they just don't have an attachment to the series and for them it's yet another live action + CG animal movie that didn't do anything for them. How on earth would there be an ulterior motive for this movie?

    People are allowed to not enjoy things.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Like Like x 2
    • List