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Sonic 06 PC Remake

Discussion in 'Fangaming Discussion' started by S0LV0, Dec 8, 2015.

  1. TimmiT

    TimmiT

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Member
    You can criticize without being a dick. And it's already generally accepted here that Felik's a dick as well. :v:
     
  2. Mr Lange

    Mr Lange

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    So it's okay for Felik to be a dick because it's already established...?
     
  3. Jimmy Hedgehog

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    Difference is Bubsy 3D (and Superman 64) are far worse.
     
  4. TimmiT

    TimmiT

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Member
    I was half-joking. It's of course up to the people here with mod powers to decide if that's okay or not.
     
  5. Mr Lange

    Mr Lange

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    Yes and no. Point being is that 06 has some really nasty janky controls and movement and this is a wasted opportunity to improve upon them.

    Then what do the rules matter if every response is arbitrary?
     
  6. TimmiT

    TimmiT

    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Member
    Look man my basic point is don't be a dick. No need to try to make the creators feel bad for making what they make.
     
  7. Mr Lange

    Mr Lange

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    Okay though I think the creators have made it pretty clear they don't give one iota of a shit what anyone has to say about what they're making.
     
  8. winterhell

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    Guess I'm calling dibs on Prince of Persia 3D Remake before someone else snatches that gem.
     
  9. For crying out loud, the guy's only got one level being worked on so far, right? That's rather far from a finished project, and there's lots of room to adjust things. Yes, he said he wants a 1-1 remake with the glitches and load times fixed. Nobody ever said that had to end there. At the very least, there's a PC version of the game that can make an easy starting point for somebody to adjust how they'd like. If it gets finished, I'm sure somebody will come up with a mod to fix the animations and swap character models with Unleashed. I'm sure somebody will figure out how to swap out levels, or adjust physics and controls to be more like the Adventure games, or tweak enemies to have 1 HP so it doesn't take a half-dozen Homing Attacks to kill them. At the very least, it's a good starting point.
     
  10. BlazeHedgehog

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    Not to focus on it too much, but I did think what Mr. Lange said was a bit too mean.

    For what it's worth, this "remake" does seem to be changing things. Maybe changing is the wrong word -- maybe it's more like "restoring." But this is not a straight, 1:1 remake of Sonic 2006. The changes are subtle if you aren't intimately familiar with what the real Sonic 2006, but believe me, they're there.

    The score bonuses, for example. "Double!" "Triple!" Hunter!" etc. were all dumped from textures for the game, but were never actually implemented (but here, they are.) The mission objective displaying during the score tally was something present in the TGS 2006 demo, but not the final game, and that's implemented here. In both the demo and the finished game, dynamic lights coming from the torches flicker and blink out of existence, but they don't do that here. The crab robots crawling on the wall near the fallen bridge would often have their collision bug out, but that doesn't seem to be a problem in this remake.

    A fixed Sonic 2006 does have merit, for no other reason than simple curiosity. Imagination will only take you so far in that regard.

    What's more, implementing too many fixes (like changing game physics to more closely match a different game) might actually start breaking the game in unintended ways, which would then require redesigning parts of levels, and that's a big, long, slippery slope. What Gistix is doing still definitely has merit in its own right, and will probably require less overall work (which, in fan project terms, means there's a much larger chance that it'll actually get finished some time before we all keel over dead).

    It's fiiiiine.
     
  11. Gistix

    Gistix

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    The project is yet very young, basically things just started coming out correctly now. I read each and every comment, nothing gets ignored.

    The idea of making a 1:1 representation is because it's easier, no assets are imported directly, everything needs work. If I we're to do something with a different level design, art style and/or story then I'd prefer to create an entire new game other than editing an existing game's asset, creating something that deviates from the original ideas.
    I'm trying to make as much more alike as possible, but without the game feeling broken, so far we have only changed little from the original game, but much more is planned.

    I haven't posted this here yet (or in any other forum) because I wanted it to be complete first, to avoid wrong ideas about the project's direction.
     
  12. Lilly

    Lilly

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    Any chance of splitscreen co-op making it in? :specialed:/>

    The biggest question I have is whether SEGA would shut down this down for copying an existing game, (Instead of being a new fan game entirely.) like Nintendo has with the SM64 HD remake? I have this gut feeling they won't do a thing, since they have no plans to port '06 to the PC, or to ever resell it again in any capacity; it's completely de-listed. Letting a fan finish what Sonic Team started with their rushed alpha wouldn't do any harm to the brand that I could see.

    If anything, the conversation could finally shift away from the game's technical problems. I'd prefer reading more debates about '06's design choices than its hilarious, trailing list of bugs.
     
  13. S0LV0

    S0LV0

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    Lange, I'm going to say this right now. Yes, you are being a dick, and no, pointing at Felik does not excuse you. First of all, that was your second post contributing basically nothing to the discussion other than mockery. Second, Felik's language may have been inflammatory, but at the very least he was expressing optimism for the damn project instead of pissing on people for liking it. Pull up your grown-up pants and stop being a douche. Thanks.
    Also, sorry about that, Gistix. Didn't know you had an account and all, just wanted to share it.
     
  14. Retroman

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    Pretty freaking awesome!
     
  15. Harmony Friends

    Harmony Friends

    it's the whole gang Oldbie
    I think this is cool. I mean, I think Sonic 06 is a big stinking pile of crap, but there's something inherently fascinating about it because of it's unused potential.
    I personally don't think that just fixing the glitches would fix it, but don't take that personally. It's still super interesting as a project! So I'm totally in support of this if you can pull it off.
    I'm going to go out on a limb and say: Gistix, if you're serious about this, you should open source it. People would probably contriubte to it. I would, if I got the chance.
    And besides, the potential for modding or building stuff off of it is maybe the coolest thing about the project. Keep the project vanilla faithful for 06, but open the source so that people can do interesting stuff with it.
    Pretty much every Sonic fan has their own ideas for what they'd do with 06 - it'd be fascinating to see all kinds of different creative people get to mess around with something like this.
    I can almost guarantee that if we got the chance, Melpontro and I would do something cool with it.
     
  16. 360

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    Awesome of the creator to post in here. It's enlightening to read some additional insight direct from the source. I also agree and think this project does hold merit. Sonic Team did indeed push out a rushed alpha and it's absolutely inexcusable that previous builds of the game (like the TGS demo) were superior to the original product. That just shouldn't have happened. I think Naka's exodus during its development in tandem with Sega's long-held policy of rushing everything out to make the holiday season when this clearly needed about six more months of development time - that is what resulted in such an inferior product. More development time may not have resulted in an amazing game but would have resulted in a better one. This is why it's refreshing to see Sega's new strategy directly address this. It has been a problem at the company for years. Even Sonic Team's Billy Hatcher suffered the same fate.

    As for that potential cease and desist although this project is directly recreating an actual game and therefore should theoretically be more open and vulnerable to legal attack - I still think Sega are unlikely to do anything. Sonic fangaming has existed since the Dreamcast days and been quite prevalent and noticeable and Sega have intentionally turned a blind eye and even professed in certain statements that this is their policy for Sonic to presumably preserve the Sonic fanbase so in this regard Sonic has been completely immune from legal action for almost two decades now. There's not a single precedent where a Sonic fan-created work has been given a cease and desist from Sega. If it happens to this game it would literally be the first time it has ever happened. There is the precedent of the Streets of Rage Remake but my point still stands. To this day Sonic specifically remains unaffected. I think the creators will be fine.

    So godspeed to them. I'm going to be following this and look forward to hearing more about it.
     
  17. SpaceyBat

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    This isn't true, technically. Sega shut down Sonic Fan Remix, presumably because it was getting a lot of attention right before they announced Sonic 4.
    Most game companies will try to exercise plausible deniability with fangames, but if a fan project results in brand confusion or has become notable enough to where plausible deniability will no longer hold any weight, they will have no choice but to shut it down for the sake of protecting their IP.


    Anyway, '06 remake: Personally I'm along the same train of thought as BlazeHedgehog - It does have its own merits, and making any significant changes (I.e. gameplay, level design) would defeat the purpose of a remake (which is why so many people who think about doing it ultimately decide that their time is better spent making a new fangame altogether). I'm morbidly curious about how the game would feel with all of the bugs and loading times fixed, particularly since I never played the original and can judge it from a fresh perspective.

    Once this is done, I'd like to see a mod that swaps out all the Sonic characters with human counterparts to better fit with the setting. :v:
     
  18. Mr Lange

    Mr Lange

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    That wasn't to excuse me. That was pointing out a double standard.
    And if you want to get technical, optimism for something doesn't excuse dickery either. Being a dick is being a dick, whether you're pissing on people for liking something or not liking something.

    While a near 1:1 recreation of something so large is admirable, it should go without saying that a large amount of 06's problems have to do with janky motion and poor control. At the least, remedying this would make the game much more playable. It's a tremendously wasted opportunity to go as far as recreating the game like this and doing nothing to work out the problems it's infamous for.
    If you are set on having this recreated as it was, then I strongly recommend dual gameplay. Providing options for a mode faithful to the original, and a new mode with much nicer movement and control, preferably working with fluid momentum.
     
  19. S0LV0

    S0LV0

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    This is an unfortunate truth as I've seen it. While we don't technically have confirmed word, the popular rumor is that Project M was shut down due to the creators being informed Nintendo was preparing to hit them with a lawsuit if they kept going. If this is true, it would explain a lot; the sudden nature of the cancelled development (especially considering the amount of content they were working on), the removal of all site and download-related content, and so on. Considering Nintendo's change of staff recently and some upcoming announcements regarding Smash 4, it's no surprise to me they would consider Project M a threat.

    Okay, that was a giant tangent just to give an example, but the point I'm making is that this is how it tends to go. If SEGA shut down Sonic Fan Remix right before Sonic 4, I can guarantee it's because they were worried about fans showing up their "hard" work. This seems to be how most companies treat the matter with fan projects, some to a stricter degree than others.

    As for this particular situation, I don't foresee any situation in which SEGA would see this project as a threat. They tend to ignore 06's existence altogether from what I've seen, aside from Ruby's occasional jokes on their Twitter and such. Maybe if they announced another Sonic Adventure style game sometime soon or god forbid an actual Sonic 06 remake they might have motive to C&D the thing, but I don't see either of those happening.
     
  20. Sparks

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    Is that really what happened with Sonic Fan Remix? That'd be kind of sad if SEGA shut it down because they felt it threatened Sonic 4... of all things. :psyduck: