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Should the Sonic remake train keep running and how?

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by E-122-Psi, Jul 27, 2022.

  1. RDNexus

    RDNexus

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    SA1 deserves a remake, maybe with a bonus of extra features related to how they planned it to become as a Saturn title xD
    Other than that, I'd rather see them revamp the Classics as one story capable of connecting properly to SA1.
    And from SA2 onwards, build a proper continuity of games around the original philosophy of the franchise.
    Nowadays, I can see how much they tried to turn Sonic into a shounen anime-like series (and how it may've hurt it overall).
    So they could return the franchise's basics to its roots and adjustt all the rest into it (Humans, Creatures, Aliens, Deities, etc)

    Of course, given SEGA's current track record, I know this is a tall order, almost to the level of a fairy tale... ^^"
     
  2. soulsera

    soulsera

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    Yeah, agreed. The realistic thing for Sega to do is probably port the old PC/PSN/XBLA widescreen version of SA2 again with maybe higher framerates and Switch and stuff, and that's even if Sega wants to touch anything from the 2000s with a ten-foot pole, including Unleashed, which they seem pretty averse to. I wouldn't be too mad if they just did a port, though, especially for the Switch potential alone.
     
  3. Mr. Ksoft

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    Chaotix is just such a fascinating game in terms of audiovisual direction and has a lot of cool ideas (and plenty that didn't make it in), but definitely fell apart due to a combination of the rubber-band and the short turnaround to get it going on the 32X. Re-imagined as a traditional sidescroller with Sonic and Tails back as well? I think it could do a lot better. However, dunno if Sega could pull it off any more unless they hired fans again.

    And at that point, why not just do a fangame re-imagining? Honestly I've been toying with taking that on myself due to an unhealthy obsession with what could have been regarding the game...
     
  4. As long as we get cool & fun paid tiers for pre orders then I'm happy

    Jokes aside, seeing Chaotix fully realized with non shit level design would be awesome. There's something really mystical about that game's art & music that pulls me in. It reminds me allot of CD in that respect.

    Seeing a 'remake' to SA1 would be cool though to fix some of the jank. Bumping into corners whilst running has always been awkward and should have never been released like that.
     
  5. Ritz

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    To be honest, I think the very concept of a remake is regressive. It's the lowest common denominator of entertainment: Businesses love them because polishing an existing product that people already love is a risk-free investment that requires no innovation. Consumers beg for them because, not being creators, they're literally incapable of imagining anything more than what they've already experienced and can only ask for more of the same. They always feel inauthentic because the spirit of the times in which these things were created is decades gone, and it was only the initial innovation that made them as exciting as they were to begin with.

    Remakes should only be reserved for those special cases where potential was wasted, but those are exactly the sort of projects that can NEVER be remade, because they were never successful to begin with. The desire for remakes of things you already loved is the very first symptom of old age.
     
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  6. MathUser

    MathUser

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    I want knuckles chatix a lot.
     
  7. We are a bunch of old men at this point to be fair.
     
  8. Algo922

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    I'm in the camp where I think Knuckles Chaotix would benefit a remake more than SA1 imo. Atleast with SA1, there is some consensus that Sonic & Tail's levels are still enjoyable to some degree; the remaining cast's play-styles are still contested, some more than others.

    With K Chaotix, I think a large sum of people agree it needs a major revamp in all levels of game-play to be more palatable for a 2022 or beyond release.
     
  9. Taylor

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    I sympathize but the thing is with video games, they're still a very young medium with a lot of growing pains to deal with. A lot of stuff can genuinely be polished up, its like how a lot of silent films got remade with audio once theatres were capable of that. A lot of very iconic films are like, the fourth attempt at adapting an old story into a movie :V

    I do agree though that most Sonic games really just need like, widescreen support and a good saving system.
     
  10. kyasarintsu

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    When I think of a Sonic Adventure remake, I mostly just want the surprisingly-inspired level design and environments for Sonic's levels to be expanded. I'm really not interested in the other campaigns unless they're redone entirely.
     
  11. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

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    hey wiki you're so fine
    Can we not have new ideas?



    Also this bizarre idea of Chaotix minus the combi rings - isn't that just normal 2D Sonic with different characters?
     
  12. Ritz

    Ritz

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    Actually, can we make this the Chaotix thread for a bit?

    I've spent years trying to come up with zone ideas that would fit the theme, with limited success- for a theme park, they've already covered all the bases. What else is there to add? A planetarium? A food court? And honestly, the concept of designing a game around a theme park always seemed tacky to me, even when they pulled it off so successfully. But now that I'm thinking about it, I think it was the most perfect setting for a Sonic. Actually, I think Osaka's Expo '70 was inexorably linked to the concept for the game, and that the event itself probably played a seminal role in the creation of Sonic.

    [​IMG]

    Expo '70 was a 183-day world fair with the theme of "Progress and Harmony for Mankind," with sub-themes like "Design a better everyday life" and "Utilize nature in more prosperous ways." Pavilions included carnival rides, gardens, theaters, a "water stage," and a "Symbol Zone" with a colorful Tree of Life exhibit (Amazing Arena?). The Tower of the Sun was the centerpiece for the whole fairground. The retro-futuristic, geodesic architecture was almost certainly an influence.

    It sounds like a stretch, but interviews with Osamu Sato where he talks about how the expo influenced his style really got me thinking about a potential connection. He's an artist whose shape language and music is totally Sonic-adjacent. It's fair to assume a good chunk of Japanese creatives during the 80s and 90s had a brush with the fair, whether through attendance or just media saturation and the outsize effect it had on the country's design trends going forward.

    I just think it's neat. This utopian vision of a synthetic, geometric world where nature and technology coexist smacks of Sonic, and a game even subconsciously based on the fair is really the apotheosis of everything Classic Sonic stood for. It's really, really upsetting that it got fucked up so badly. I think everything that came after is symptomatic of a deep spiritual curse that can only be excised by realizing their opus correctly.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2022
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  13. RDNexus

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    Well... Square-Enix's LIVE A LIVE could tell you a tale or two. Or eight, I guess xD
    While a commercial failure at its time, now got a 2D-HD remake, and looks great.
    And that Alex Kidd remake looked awesome, I really enjoy seeing such passion projects get realized.
     
  14. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    Just as soon as I get my R and Adventure 1 remakes. :P

    Really I think the reason remakes are considered so recurrently with the Sonic series is because so many of those games were rushed or had potential that was JUST not met, as in just enough to show a good/decent game that COULD have been great.

    Actually it's one of the reasons that, maintaining accessibility of the game aside, the Sonic 3K remake was the one I was least interested in, since that game was already more or less fully realised due to the clever way they circumvented the time crunch in the first place.


    Side note, but I've just realised we've had FIVE Sonic games rereleased with mission modes and, tacky execution in SADX aside, it really kinda works with Sonic. I'd actually be interested in some Chaotix missions making clever use of the combi system, or a Mario Kart DS style mission mode for Sonic R that takes advantage of its semi-platformer mechanics. How about Mean Bean Machine with another Nazo Puyo mode?
     
  15. Londinium

    Londinium

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    Realistically, I could only ever see the Adventure titles ever being remade. Games like Chaotix and Sonic 3D are simply not profitable to Sega. Why spend resources remaking a game that, truthfully, not a lot of people know about?

    Those games simply cannot stand on their own, no matter how much polishing Sega puts in. The most I ever see Sega doing is buying a fan project or getting the creators of said project to work for them and build upon their work.
     
  16. Pengi

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    I completely disagree with your assessment. Sonic 3D was profitable at the time. It would be a harder sell today, because that style of isometric platform game didn't catch on, so it probably wouldn't be worth remaking today, but it was a successful game.

    Chaotix and the 32X in general weren't successful. But the advantage of remaking Chaotix is that they'd be able to create a new classic-style 2D Sonic game by re-using existing graphics and music, ala Sonic Mania. It could be even more efficient than Sonic Mania, since the graphics already have a 32-bit 2D look, and wouldn't need touching up as much, if at all. If they hired as much of the Mania staff as possible, and used the Retro Engine, then they could potentially make something of comparable quality to Mania.

    It would also be a cheap and efficient way to have a Knuckles-centric game released around the time of the Knuckles TV series.
     
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  17. Londinium

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    Never thought of that, a tie in game with the Knuckles show.

    Marvelous, I'd love to see a new era of Knuckles.

    Though the only thing I'd see potentially holding it back is that Chaotix is fundamentally flawed. The game's mechanics really need a rework. But then again, knowing Sega, I doubt they'd have problems with rushing things out to meet deadlines.
     
  18. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    We haven't heard anything about that series in a while. Can we be sure it hasn't been Pendered? :P

    One could argue that CD was in the same state as those games before it was remade. It was largely a side game on an obscure add on, if with some notable effect on future titles and with a sizable fanbase. I'd argue CD was less renowned than 3D was at the time the latter was made.

    Granted you make the fair point. The difference with CD is that, while still gimmicky, many believe it is a solid game almost on par with the main trilogy after it got the usual polish. Most other games are more a mixed bag and would need a lot more tweaking to be on that level, likely more than SEGA would approve.

    I'd argue Sonic 3D in its "Director's Cut" format is a rather decent if much more aged game (even more so if they added the choice of Saturn extras like the special stages), but Knuckles Chaotix as mentioned, is fundamentally flawed. It's not so much the tether for me (at least not to the extent it couldn't be shrewdly polished like the other remakes have) but more the actual level design, and you change that too much and it basically becomes a new game.
     
  19. Pengi

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    A Retro Engine Chaotix re-imagining wouldn't be beholden to the mechanics of the original. They could use the Sonic Mania physics. They could ditch the rubber band entirely if they wanted to, and make something more like Mania's Encore Mode. They could rearrange the level layouts like they did in Sonic Mania.
     
  20. Londinium

    Londinium

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    Personally, I cannot see Sega ever ditching the rubber band mechanic. Sega usually aims to keep remakes as close to the source material as possible, that's why levels like Desert Dazzle and Final Fever never made the cut. Those two would've completely changed the mobile Sonic CD. The most wild thing they've allowed is Hidden Palace, but even then Hidden Palace wasn't a brand new idea, it was an already existing level that was turned into a secret zone that wouldn't have a major impact on the rest of the game.

    To completely remove a fundamental mechanic, as flawed as it is, which is the game's unique selling point, in favour of an Encore-style mix, which includes changing entire level layouts, would simply not fly with Sega.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2022