Sega Ages: Sonic the Hedgehog 2 - Any info on this?

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Taylor, Nov 17, 2019.

  1. Agobue

    Agobue

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    Sonic the Hedgehog 2 for Nintendo Switch adds new features to the classic game
    https://www.polygon.com/2020/2/7/21...tendo-switch-release-dates-puyo-puyo-2-launch

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    By Owen S. Good Feb 7, 2020, 1:30pm EST
    Sonic the Hedgehog 2 is coming to Nintendo Switch next week, courtesy of the Sega Ages series that has been bringing retro Sega Genesis hits to present day since 2017.

    Sonic 2, available Feb. 20, will feature characters and gameplay not seen in the 1992 game — most notably, Knuckles the Echidna, whose first appearance came in 1994’s Sonic the Hedgehog 3. Sega says players will also be able to use the “drop dash” technique that was introduced in 2017’s Sonic Mania; that’s where players can spin-dash in mid-air to boost their speed. It will be interesting to see the feature put to good use by the game’s speedrunning community, among others.

    Players can also start up a game as the fully powered Super Sonic, a kind of new-game-plus feature available from the start. Sonic the Hedgehog 2 also supplies a time-trial mode with online leaderboards.

    Puyo Puyo 2, Sega Genesis’ landmark puzzle game work, launches for Nintendo Switch alongside Sonic 2 on Feb. 20. Both games are available for $8.
     
  2. DreamsComeBlue

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    Well, that's depressing. Taxman gave us Hidden Palace Zone, and what do we get from SEGA's own team of ROM-hacking/porting pros? Knuckles and Super Sonic. Yippee.
     
  3. Agobue

    Agobue

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    Please, don't be so ungrateful. Just be happy Sonic 2 is on the Switch at all.
     
  4. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    Game, set and match for Puyo Puyo 2.

    "Be grateful and happy"? For not adding anything that makes this worth the whopping $8? Wtf.
     
  5. "Ungrateful"? Sega isn't a charity giving out its games for free; paying customers are entitled to their grievances. To suggest otherwise is corporate bootlicking.
     
  6. Agobue

    Agobue

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    Well, those boots aren't gonna lick themselves!
     
  7. TheOcelot

    TheOcelot

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    Sonic 2 is already playable on the switch via the SEGA Mega Drive Collection :V

    As for being ungrateful? Lets see:

    We're getting an emulation of a 27 year old game with virtually no improvements to the original gameplay (aside from the drop-dash), adding extra content "Knuckles in Sonic 2" which was already playable 25 years ago, a time-trial mode which will probably only consist of Emerald Hill act1 (Sonic 1 SEGA Ages only had Green Hill act1) and an all chaos emeralds instant Super Sonic mode which you could replicate in the original version using debug-mode...

    Now lets compare the SEGA Ages release to the StealthTax mobile version of Sonic 2 which has; 16:9 widescreen, a boss rush mode, debug-mode, tweaked physics (air-cap removed), playable Knuckles, Tails has his flight, post-game stage select, Hidden Palace reimagined, Proto Palace, new ending visuals (the death egg landing on angel island).

    No contest. The mobile version completely destroys the SEGA Ages release and then some. The mobile version set a new standard of how this game can look and play on modern technology. It's 2020, not 1992 and fans have every right to expect all future releases of Sonic 2 (or any of the classics games for that matter) to aspire to emulate the quality of the mobile version, whereas the SEGA Ages Switch version falls way short.
     
  8. E-122-Psi

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    It's not BAD, it's still probably the SECOND best version of the game, it's just disappointing considering it's supposed to be the enhanced version they spent over a year on vs the bare bones ROM already available on Genesis/Megadrive collection with several other games.

    I'm not gonna complain about it not having every damn extra in the Taxman version because let's be fair, that project was lavish, but it is a shame they didn't include some of it's more integral quality of life improvements, especially since they heavily implied there would be some BIG ones throughout production. Stuff like two easy modes where you start with some rings or Super Sonic feels kind of esoteric, especially for people who completed the game at normal difficulty beforehand anyway, not to mention these were extras they just ported from the DS version.

    Oh well, technically this is the first Sonic and Knuckles content on the Switch so there is that, and Drop Dash is cool (I'm guessing it will be as buggy as their Sonic 1 version though). Flying for Tails seemed like an obvious choice since their DS release however, also feel like they could have used their emulation tricks to enhance two player as well.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2020
  9. Pengi

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    They're two different approaches. The goal of the Whitehead/Thomley version was to have a widescreen version of Sonic 2 with all new bells and whistles (several hidden behind a cheat code).

    M2's approach is always to have an accurate emulation of the original game and its variants, with some optional extras.

    With Whitehead/Thomley's Sonic 2, I don't believe there's an option to turn off the widescreen, the new style Special Stages, Hidden Palace Zone, etc. For anyone who wants to play the game in as close to its original form as possible, the Sega Ages release is the better option.

    Ideally, it would be nice to have both approaches in one package, along with Sonic Jam's Special Stage gauntlet and "Easy" and "Normal" modes. (They could go further and add "Easy" versions of the skipped Acts.)
     
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  10. Yash

    Yash

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    If I recall, Jam already has easy mode layouts for the levels that get skipped over, you can still play them via level select.
     
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  11. The Claw

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    Isn't licensing a reason the mobile version haven't been ported to more systems? I thought Sega doesn't own the 'Retro Engine'.

    Anyhow, yes, the whole philosophy is different. M2 tries to (mostly) resemble what's possible on Genesis hardware.

    The remake doesn't concern itself with the original console. The resolution is greater than a Genesis can render, and the 3D special stages are too smooth.
     
  12. big smile

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    The only thing that is not optional is the widescreen and the 3D special stages (although if the player plays on a 4:3 device the widescreen will not activate). For everything else, the player can skip over it.

    M2 put a lot of effort into these games. There’s a blog post about the crazy lengths they went to get the spin dash working.

    They could have put all that effort into porting the mobile versions and probably had resources left over to add new features (such as Ray & Mighty, buddy mode, 4p split screen and options to disable widescreen). I wasn’t a fan of Ray and Mighty in Mania, but they would give an excuse to play Sonic 2 again.

    That way we could have had both philosophies, in one package like you said.

    It’s just dumb planning on Sega’s part.
     
  13. Agobue

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    For those who don't know, this is the blog post that "big smile" is referring to:

    https://web.archive.org/web/2014011...nic-the-hedgehog-interview-with-developer-m2/
     
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  14. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    Sounds like a pretty sloppy and out of touch way of implementing something that can be easily found in the "hacking" guides.

    That right there might be the exact point when M2 stopped being a synonym of quality...
     
  15. Agobue

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    Begs the question as to why SEGA don't just rehire Yuji Naka to port Sonic 1 and 2 to modern platforms, especially as the guy apparently knows more than the people who SEGA are employing to do this. Surely it'd be a worthwhile investment instead of having to re-emulate every time and employing these roundabout methods in getting the games just to work properly.
     
  16. E-122-Psi

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    The thing is ALL emulations should aim for console quality. The fact SEGA Genesis/Megadrive Collection has sloppy emulation doesn't speak well for M2, it speaks badly for SEGA's other divisions. We shouldn't need to pay extra just for serviceable quality.

    At the end of the day, SEGA AGES titles are priced about the same as the Taxman remake, while the Megadrive Collection, in spite of poorer quality it shouldn't have, gives you it and about 20+ games for the price of about five or so SEGA AGES games. It is understandable why some think the SEGA AGES versions should offer more to justify an individual purchase, since on paper it's charging more for less.

    That said it does seem we are maybe the wrong people for this perspective. The blog above indicates that M2 are rather novice at ROM modifying, having to put extensive effort just to program a semi competent spin dash that is so buggy it's barely worth using, while us here pretty much make a fully functional one for one of our first lessons in hacking. In that sense, stuff like new characters, Tails flying, Hidden Palace and what not seemed almost certainly out of the question, at least not without adding tons more bugs and thus tainting the pristine accurate quality of the game.

    It feels like M2's better forte is optimising the actual emulator, with stuff like display/interface customisation and rumble, or setting the emulator to activate to specific requirements for these challenge modes or work online. I feel like if they offered more than one or two challenges per game, something like a unique mission mode or even just a full Time Attack selection, this would be capitalised on better. Again I am disappointed they seemingly didn't use this approach to enhance two player mode.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2020 at 10:09 PM
  17. They have nothing to do with that title. It was developed by Sega and D3T Limited.

    M2 was responsible for the emulation on the Genesis Mini, which is actually praised.
     
  18. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    I know, but the fact SEGA's other units do BAD emulation doesn't mean M2 is exceptional just for giving out good quality emulation. It just means the bar has been set so low we think serviceable emulation is special for SEGA. Good emulation should be the standard.
     
  19. M2 is not part of Sega. You're probably thinking M2 is Sega AM2, but they are unrelated.
     
  20. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    My mistake. It is ultimately irrelevant to my point however, since as said, ALL companies should aim for good emulation. It should count as a special bit of polish just have the game working at the same standard it was originally.

    In that sense, paying extra just for one game (okay technically two) in good emulation because the budget compilation of 20+ games is badly emulated is sad reality but NOT a good deal.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2020 at 5:39 PM