<!--quoteo(post=380367:date=Dec 2 2009, 07:51 PM:name=Shoemanbundy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shoemanbundy @ Dec 2 2009, 07:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380367"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380358:date=Dec 2 2009, 04:27 PM:name=iojnekns)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (iojnekns @ Dec 2 2009, 04:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380358"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->@ the shoeman We appear to be reading two different threads. It's a discussion I've enjoyed and I think that numerous people have brought numerous points to the table, which have certainly made me look at things differently. I don't know where this "same reply" of "if we can prevent bad hacks, then why not?" has come from, but thats definitely not what I've got out of it. That's a fragment of a point that Tweaker made many many posts ago. The focus since then has moved to how the tool might affect the hacker rather than the hack. I don't think voicing the opinion that you value hard work is particularly elitist, nor would it matter if it were. There are very few people who are under the delusion that the results of this discussion will affect the tool in any real way. This is such a pointless response I'm barely sure why I'm giving it, since it doesn't contribute to the topic in any way. I just object to asking "how elitist does the whole site need to be" when the "whole site" isn't even united on the idea (not to mention the fact that "whole site" encompasses you as well) and if anyone discusses the matter and comes down on a certain side of the fence they get compared with disgraced ex-leader of Germany, Adolf Hitler! For having an opinion! Anyway, I'm dropping this as of now.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> When I say the whole site, I'm generally talking about the admins or techies, mostly anyone who is experienced in more advanced hacking. That's the way it feels anyways. And the Hitler thing. Come on, people make exaggerated comparisons sometimes. It's not meant to be THAT serious of a comparison, especially considering this is just a hobby. Don't look into it much :p My feeling is just that the fact this is a continuing discussion shows that there's obviously problems with this thing for some people that don't like seeing others cheat their way doing something they learned on their own, and it's a problem that really doesn't need to be there unless that person feels they deserve more recognition just because they did more stuff on their own, which most players won't care about(I for example could care less about who coded what for how long in any hack, I just want a freaking game that looks good). I think most problems with this program would well apply to the hacking guide section though. How many people do you think just copy and paste what they need to without figuring out what any of the code does? I'm one of those examples, all I care about is getting all the behind the scenes stuff done as quick as possible since I care more about the presentation of my hack, which is mostly art oriented than anything else. So who cares how something is done behind the scenes? I don't see why anyone should care at all. If it sucks then just ignore it, it shouldn't matter. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I'm a little saddened towards this attitude honestly. Firstly I've never denied anyone help before, if someone needs help and they're willing to learn I'd never refuse. Secondly coding is a huge part of the piece as well, and to have it dismissed so abruptly is just discouraging to see from someone who plays others' hacks. Honestly, I think the program is a neat idea, it is going to cause others to use it without learning how, yet the great hacks will still be separated from the hacks that just use this. And really I believe anyone (without any sort of disability) can learn to code if they have the will to understand and take time to learn. Took me a good year or so of hard work and learning to get the basics of Motorola 68k and programming concepts in general down and I'm still learning every day.