Obscure, irrelevant things you find odd in Sonic games

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by _oliver, May 16, 2022.

  1. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

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    Well, the same as if they put "Area" instead. It's a defined place separate from the close ones. Of course it works better with the abstract nature of the classic games, because you can feel Casino Night is a zone, where as Casinopolis, despite the surreal pinball tables, feels like a rather small building with the sewers resembling a short act at best. of course, places like Windy Valley and Final Rush/Chase look quite like an standard zone in my book. Oh, and it was a nice way to not say "level" or "world", "zone" feels a lot more like a place next to another place that would be the following zone.
     
  2. pkderbar

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    I always liked it, it was something unique to Sonic. Not a fan of Sonic CD using Round instead of Zone (and Zone instead of Act.)
     
  3. Blue Spikeball

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    I recall them stating that they opted to use the word "zone" in CD in reference to timezones. Which makes no sense to begin with, seeing how that game used it in place of "act" like you said, rather than applying it to the different eras.
     
  4. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

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    I'm not sure how hard Sega were thinking about these things, but during the 1980s and 1990s, they consistently called levels in their games "stages", as in, "here is a character on a stage". Sonic 1 is comprised of six stages (and a finale), each with a three "act" structure, just like a play*.

    (it's also why you get Special STAGE and Bonus STAGE)

    So I think the idea is "Stage 1" is called "Green Hill Zone", rather than "Zone 1" is called "Green Hill"... but this thought process has probably been lost over time... if it even really existed.




    *except for when they didn't

    because the Japanese arm in particular was also fond of calling levels "rounds" (which is probably why Sonic CD is how it is)

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Streets of Rage 3 is one such example - "Rounds" in Japan, "Stages" in the West. I think "level" was used to describe "difficulty"... until it wasn't. Chaotix has levels. Although they're "attractions" with multiple levels and yeah there is no pattern
     
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  5. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    Even comparing with Oshima's other non-SEGA games - BLiNX has "Rounds" split into "Stages". Balan has "Chapters" split into "Acts".

    For how I'd personally interpret these words devoid of context of the game they're in:
    "Stage" and "Act" represent a period of play without interruptions from score tallies, cutscene etc.
    "Round" and "Chapter" represent a collection of stages and acts that can be collated together as a unit.
    "Zone", "Area", and "Scene" represent a location upon which any of the above can take place.

    So Green Hill Zone is the location, it's Round 1 of the game, and it has three Stages. Sonic 1 in total would have 7 rounds with 19 stages (plus 6 special stages).
     
  6. Gryson

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    Linguistics nerd chiming in on this whole silly debate: Japanese does not have word stress. There is only one way to pronounce 'Hydrocity' (ハイドロシティ) in Japanese. Focusing on the /o/ vowel, it is closer to English 'Hydro City' than 'Hydrocity' (as in 'velocity'). So Japanese listeners will find a closer match to the English 'Hydro City' due to that /o/ vowel. When stressed in English (as in 'Hydrocity'), the vowel becomes /ɑ/, which then becomes a poor match for the Japanese word.

    That said, none of this has any bearing on the English pronunciation. When words are loaned from other languages, native phonological rules such as word stress are applied to adapt them. This debate is really about whether or not 'Hydrocity' should be pronounced as one word or two in English. If one word, then it follows '-city' suffix rules and stress falls on the syllable before the suffix (e.g. 'velocity', 'atrocity'). If two words, the standard 'hydro' pronunciation is used.

    So why the debate? The zone name is written as one word, suggesting it is intended to be pronounced as one word. However, 'hydrocity' is a meaningless word. Many other zones have two-word names ('Angel Island', 'Marble Garden'). Did the creators intend it to be two words?

    Given the pattern with other zone names, I think it's safe to say that yes, they did intend "Hydro City". Ultimately, this debate is about whether to use the actual (likely mistaken) form or to use the intended form. The 50/50 split shows how divergent native speakers are.

    (I'm reposting this from Twitter in response to Yuji Naka saying it is 'Hydro City').
     
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  7. Londinium

    Londinium

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  8. Gryson

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  9. foXcollr

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    [​IMG]

    Let's discuss this to death for another 10 pages before ultimately reaching the same conclusion, that there is obviously one intended way to say it but nobody cares because you can say whatever you want and there are no camp counselors or linguistic police who can come to your house and arrest you for Having Fun (tm) or sharing cool experiences with other people.

    As another linguistics nerd, prescriptivism has no place in a conversation where we all understand the exact word and place the other people are talking about. Prescriptivism is useful in situations like telling a kid it's pronounced "specifically", not "pacifically" (this is pretty common among children), because nobody would understand them in certain contexts if they said the latter.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2022
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  10. _oliver

    _oliver

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    Might as well rename this thread to "HYDROCITY DEBATE CENTRAL BAYBEE" lmfao
     
  11. Londinium

    Londinium

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    Wait, this wasn't a thread dedicated to discussing Hydrocity's pronunciation in the first place?
     
  12. foXcollr

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    I don't know, I think this was a thread dedicated to discussing those weird little birds in Sky High Zone Act 1.



    On the "Zone" topic, I've always loved it specifically because it does sound a little like these are little places that exist in the matrix, kind of like the early Archie use of "zone" often to describe a separate dimension. It doesn't make much sense once you see that there's an actual world map and these places are geographical locations, but Sonic is surreal and obviously still just a video game, and I like that "Zone" kind of references "yes, this is just a level in a game". Same with "act" separating the level into 2-3 distinct sections. It's wacky and fun and it makes the stages more memorable IMO when you use some kind of level naming convention
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2022
  13. Blue Spikeball

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    Does IceCap count as one word or two?

    Either way, it makes more sense for Hydrocity to be one word if it's supposed to be the place's name in-universe. Just like Gigalopolis or Casinopolis. I don't think it's a mistake.
     
  14. Gryson

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    Agreed. It's fun to see how these disagreements occur, but I'll never understand how people can become so committed to the idea that only they are right. Both pronunciations are fine.
     
  15. Pobert-Eii

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    They're afraid to admit they're "wrong".
     
  16. Childish

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    One thing that I still don't know the answer to is why knuckles has Lego studs on his shoes.
     
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  17. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

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    Those aren't lego studs, are metal plates with "joints" (well, not really joints, but I don't know their name) that keep the plate on the shoe. I wouldn't say such an obvious thing if it wasn't because I've seen that kind of apparel on real life shoes, but don't ask me about it because it was very long ago.
     
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  18. _oliver

    _oliver

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    This Sonic render has always just bugged me.
    [​IMG]
    What exactly is Sonic doing with his hand here? My instinct is to think that he's pointing at the viewer, but his index finger isn't even pointing exactly at the camera, and his other four fingers aren't even made into a fist like someone would normally do when pointing. I see this particular render everywhere, and everytime I see it, it just bugs me for some reason. Not to mention that it's an extremely old render from 16 years ago yet gaming journalists seem dead set on using it for some reason, despite it not even matching up with Sonic's current design.
     
  19. Josh

    Josh

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    Hmm... it would've been one of the earliest renders of the HD era, so it's had the longest time to proliferate. Plus if it's in companies' assets and they're sorting by date, it might show up first.

    Regarding Hydrocity, I remember someone noting that every O in a Sonic 3 title card actually connects to the letter next to it, and theorizing that the lack of space might have something to do with the font.

    I doubt that had anything to do with it. But if a tech member would be so inclined to check... what WOULD that title card look like with a space, within the original ROM?
     
  20. Pobert-Eii

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    It's like they tried making Sonic do the weird pointing thing he had a strange predilection for in SA1,
    Untitled.jpg
    but failed miserably and now the hands just look aimless.