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Music Remastered

Discussion in 'Sonic 2 HD (Archive)' started by Athelstone, Apr 24, 2008.

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  1. legareal

    legareal

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    Wow guys, this is some fantastic feedback so far... Exactly the kind I was looking for!

    I updated the bass and other parts of the CPZ track, it is still WIP and hasn't had a decent mix yet.

    Here it is for you guys to listen:

    http://www.sendspace.com/file/0697zg - mp3 versions (EDIT)


    Also included is an example of my drums for "Metropolis Zone". I was bored so had a go at those, let me know if its the right kind of vibe or not...


    Now I have this great feedback I'll go away and make even more tweaks and changes to CPZ!!

    Thanks!
     
  2. Canned Karma

    Canned Karma

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    I've liked what I've heard from the instrumental versions, but different people prefer different types of sound.

    32 megs for an audio file is a little on the crazy side... Winamp pegged it at 2304kbps. Even WIPs can be dialed down a bit for ease of downloading. That said, the bassline on that latest CPZ mix is sounding very good legareal. It felt like there was sort of an 'empty' area it near the end where the track would typically build up for the next loop.
     
  3. legareal

    legareal

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    haha! sorry, I must have forgotten to convert it to mp3!

    I'll edit the post once some mp3s are uploaded! - DONE

    Oh and if you think 32mb is crazy.. You should look at some of the 5.1 feature audio we occasionally churn out :)

    it would be more like 32gb for a single file lol

    Thanks for your feedback! I wouldn't worry too much about the empty bit at the end it sounds like where I've just chopped things out early.
     
  4. nineko

    nineko

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    That's insane, considering that CD quality (44100Hz, 16 bit, stereo) is 1411200bps (1378.125kbps). Even if you wanted to use 48000Hz, 16 bit, stereo, the bitrate would be 1536000bps (1500kbps). But 2304... I can't even imagine what could give birth to that o.ô
    A quick math gives either 72000Hz, 16 bit, stereo, or 36000Hz, 32 bit, stereo, or some other combination. Still, no reason for that, in my opinion. I was under the assumption that the audio quality was going to be 44100 (or 48000) Hz, 16 bit, stereo. But maybe I was wrong.
     
  5. legareal

    legareal

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    Hey there, maybe I can help explain!

    I always work at 48kHz, 24bit in Pro Tools because I'm usually set up for film.

    I don't convert to 16bit until the last minute with a bit of dither. That way it keeps my signal chain as clean as possible. :)
     
  6. LOst

    LOst

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    Hey legareal, do you have more of that Metropolis drum loop (like the whole song)? I like the 1991 Michael Jackson drumming sound it has to it!
     
  7. legareal

    legareal

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    Soon I shall yes.. The synth and basslines you hear at the end appear to lead into something more don't they?

    But alas they do not! Once I have got something up and running with some proper sounds I will post it up here. Thanks for the positive (I think!) comment!
     
  8. nineko

    nineko

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    Well, in this case, that's awesome! Thanks for explaining.
     
  9. scubaSteve

    scubaSteve

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    Well... the lead "instrument" is actually four instruments... a flute, oboe, clarinet, and a synth flute. Another flute also comes in an octave higher near the end. My main concern when constructing the lead was getting that nice phasing, detuned sound of the original, and I had no way to do that with just flutes (not enough different sample sets ;)) without applying chorus effects, which just sounded like crap. So I kind of sacrificed one quality of the original sound to get another.

    Tora - For whatever reason your mix works really well for me. I still think there are a few nagging issues though - First off, there's way too much compression. It sounds to me like you have a compressor strapped on the very end of your mix and the input levels are way too high, because it's really crushing the whole thing pretty badly (just listen to the cymbals -- they're always the first thing to get mangled by overcompression). Second, as CK said, your bass instrument is relatively uninteresting. I don't find it too bad during the majority of the song, but during the sustained notes at the end it just sort of drones on. Maybe you could just shorten a couple of the notes? Finally, I thought the snare drum sounded a bit weak as well. Something with a little more punch and a longer tail might do the trick (and you can always use a touch of reverb for more tail as well).

    Irixion - I don't want to make it seem like I have nothing to say, but trust me here: The massive reverb levels on the lead instruments make it very difficult to tell what needs improving as it's muddying your entire mix. If you could lower them by, say, 50%, it would make your mix sound 10x better and also make it 10x easier to properly critique :)

    legareal - The new bass on CPZ is going in the right direction - I think could use some more filter movement (I.e. a sharp decay phase) to sound more like a slap bass, though. The lead instrument needs more movement as well, as it sounds very repetitive after a short while... I think in this case some manual automation could greatly liven it up.

    And the Metropolis drums... very nice. That first scratch is absolutely perfect, too, so I must know, where did you get the samples?
     
  10. Tora

    Tora

    Member
    THanks for the feed back. I can go back and change the bass to something more fitting. I don't recall actually putting much though into that part.

    When you say "at the very end of you mix" how exactly do you mean? I'm still trying to balance out compression with mixing at the end of a track, because I had another friend tell me that another song I had sounded "overcooked." I'd be glad to get some more advice about this. :)
     
  11. Kirinja

    Kirinja

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    I have a qustion regarding the CPZ bgm. Who did the bgm that was included in the tech demo? I really like the tech demo one to be honest. It has this closeness that I think the other versions are missing right now.
    For example. legareal mix sounds wonderful, but at the same time it sounds as if Im like 10 feet away from the actual playing. It sounds a bit boring to be honest. No energy. I think we should stick to, or continue working on, the CPZ mix that was included in the tech demo.
     
  12. legareal

    legareal

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    lol, when it's mixed I think you might change your mind ;)

    Hey, as mentioned above I will sort things like automation when it comes to the mix! That's some good advise though.

    As for my samples, the majority of them I record and process myself. All of those used in MZ are original for example.

    With regards to the slap bass, that is just a temporary fix until I get some real slap recorded at the weekend :)
     
  13. LOst

    LOst

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    That's why you are so good! I almost knew it when I heard it, that you could create these stuff yourself. It requires a high skill but also the right hardware.

    And the MJ comment was a compliment. A mix of MJ pop style (hard beats and someone hitting very hard on acoustic instruments) and Nakamura orchestra style (not to forget the FM sounds that were used) is what this project needs, if you ask me. But I am not in charge of that :)
     
  14. scubaSteve

    scubaSteve

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    By that I meant at the end of the audio signal chain, usually right before (or very close to) the final output. Having a compressor there isn't a bad thing at all, but it should only apply a very light amount of compression. Without starting a huge discussion on mastering here, I'll just say that *in general* I've achieved the best results on my mixes by putting a multiband compressor right after the final mixer (which does the large majority of the compression), followed by a single-band compressor and finally a limiter/soft clipper combo to prevent any clipping. I'd say that by your final compressor you shouldn't be looking for much more loudness at all - maybe 1-2 db, if anything - otherwise, it'll start to compromise the quality of the entire mix. A mulitband compressor, on the other hand, can usually increase the volume of a mix pretty significantly with virtually none of the usual "pumping" artifacts. However, keep in mind that compressors aren't just for increasing loudness - they should also be used to shape the overall sound of your mix.

    The one in the tech demo is mine. Legareal's is still WIP though, so just give him some time :eng101:

    Ooh nice. I would do that myself if I weren't too cheap to get a decent recording setup...
     
  15. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    Sounds quite good, although I'd change those instruments that come up at the beginning, for something less orchestral and more.. gloomy?
     
  16. Kinichie

    Kinichie

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    EDIT: Got my arse in gear and sorted out these goddamn downloads.

    Aquatic Ruin

    Casino Night

    Wing Fortress

    I have tried to stay as true to the originals as possible while also making the songs feel new and refreshing. I still got to work on Aquatic Ruin alot as I feel some sections are too quiet/not enough going on as there is suppose to be.
     
  17. Powellman

    Powellman

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    Ok so I did a rough version of "Chemical Plant Zone" last night. Its probably a bit too close to the original soundwise, I.e. still quite 8-bit sounding. I still need to vary the drums a bit but that can prove slightly difficult when you have to repeat such a short phrase over and over. Since hearing the same drum fill will drive you insane :P I was thinking of using some rock organs for the lead but I have yet to find a decent vst that works for that (if anybody knows of one thats free that would be cool).

    Let me know if I'm getting even close to what you's want.

    Chemical Plant Zone Remake

    EDIT: I revised this earlier today, changed some of the instruments and made the drums a bit more interesting. I'm thinking I might change the lead to a saxaphone with this lead underneath as a bass though.

    Chemical Plant Zone Remake (Version 2)
     
  18. Canned Karma

    Canned Karma

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    Kinichie, great job on those submissions. You've nailed the samples incredibly well on all of those. The most nagging trend in Aquatic Ruin and Casino Night was the overemphasis of the bassline. It feels like the bass is way out in front overpowering everything else. I don't even know how to really critique the ARZ theme aside from that, as it's exactly what I'd be looking for in a great remaster. Casino night is also very impressive, but the quality is similarly distracted from by the extreme bass. Tone that down and let us hear the results! The bassline in WFZ is spot on for the most part. It doesn't quite work for me in the opening, but I'll have to listen to it a few more times to get a good reason behind that. Looking at the brass, it could stand to be punchier in general. Each of the repeated notes just sort of blends into the next; given the military theme of the zone, that's pretty counter-productive.

    Again, very nice work on those. Easily some of the best ones in terms of initial quality I've heard.

    Powellman, welcome. The first CPZ take is too techno for my taste. I know that's more Tweaker's style, so I'll leave commenting on that to him.

    Second version - awesome bass. Just the feel that CPZ needs. That said, the bass is too busy in the beginning. There's no anticipation or buildup with it - it sort of jumps on you before the main theme has even started. Your drums come in at a good time, and have a nice beat to them, but I'd like to hear what they sound like pushed into the background a bit as backup for your bass. The melody is great, nothing to nitpick there. I'm definitely liking the revised version leagues above the first one.
     
  19. Kinichie

    Kinichie

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    Thank you for the feedback, Canned Karma. I am currently in the process of toning down that Bass for ARZ and CNZ. As for the Bass at the start of WFZ, I played the single track in my left ear and the individual bass track from WFZ (FM Channel 4) downloaded from the S2HD Database and to me they sounded very much alike. I am putting staccato on alot of the notes for the Brass and the Clarinet.

    I should have a resubmission ready in 20-40 minutes tops, I will edit this post and add the submissions here.

    Aquatic Ruin (New Bass)

    Casino Night (New Bass)

    Wing Fortress (Staccato Brass)
     
  20. XavierCrow

    XavierCrow

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    Hey all,

    I'm working on a few tracks at the moment; Aquatic Ruin, Hill Top and Wing Fortress.

    I just want to show you Wing Fortress in order to get an idea of whether or not the style is a bit too different from the original sound. I should be able to post Aquatic Rune and Hill Top in a couple of days, if not tomorrow, but before I do, I need to know if it's going overboard or not.

    http://www.sendspace.com/file/4vm0qv

    Any comments are appreciated. If it's not right for Sonic 2 HD then I'll finish the tracks for my own enjoyment anyway. :v:
     
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