Music Remastered

Discussion in 'Sonic 2 HD (Archive)' started by Athelstone, Apr 24, 2008.

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  1. PC2

    PC2

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    Various Artwork & Music, :smug:
    I'd say the Casino Night rendition really rivals Cinossu's version. I love the extra swing and attitude you gave it, and the slight tweaks to the original notes make it sound more effective. :) It still seems very slightly lacking for some reason (...lead brass ensemble? A trumpet-trombone ensemble might sound kind of cool), but overall, you did an excellent job. The Chemical Plant rendition isn't exactly my favorite, but it's the first remix I've heard so far that makes really nice use of clavicords - they seem to fit perfectly in this song.
    I agree, the progressive volume really brings back the adrenaline rush of the original countdown... All it needs now is those high background strings.
     
  2. Now this is a project worth discussing! Much more productive than nitpicking prototypes ;)

    So far, listending to most of the remixes of the music, I personally prefer most of Tweakers stuff. Most of it stays true to the original. To me, remixes for this kind of game should keep everything the same about the music as far as tempo, notes and number and types of instruments, but with updated sounds. Tweakers Metropolis Zone is an ideal example. He didn't try changing anything about how it plays by adding extra notes or extras riffs. HE kept it like the original except for the instruments. Top notch stuff :)

    Not everyone will like whatever music is chosen, but as long as it stays true to the original tunes, it will feel genuine. I have no musical talent, otherwise I would give it a go :)
     
  3. mario

    mario

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    Absolutely :)
    I did the orchestral drowning just out of curiosity. Actually, in this specific case it is hard to determine which instruments should be used, so I tried something really different. Also, it can be widely enhanced with proper soundfonts.

    One more for you all:
    Timpani, brass, strings and a bright glockenspiel make you live longer: http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/6/12/1956908/1UP.mp3
     
  4. Tweaker

    Tweaker

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    Feel free to post your MIDIs if you wish—I should be able to make them sound much better.
     
  5. Jayextee

    Jayextee

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    Needs deeper, fuller timpanis; they're pretty much the backbone of that jingle, and without them being as epic as they should be, it sounds too light and cheap.

    I think also, the brass needs to be richer, possibly 'surrounding' the listener a bit more. Though, I do like the glockenspiel, it's understated enough to be noticed but not dominating.
     
  6. mario

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    Thank you very much. Once I have finished these few themes I'll post links to their midi versions. I stopped writing midi files before the soundfount breakthrough so, although I know music and midi stuff I'm still struggling to get it working properly. Struggling means I downloaded some soundfounds and when I finally got them working I realized they were terrible. :)

    Unfortunately I can't do anything to enhance the timpani right now. I'll try adding another octave or something like that and some french horns in the left section to give this surrounding effect you mentioned. Perhaps a piccolo alongside the glockenspiel will give it a happier mood.

    GYM2WAV couldn't help me much with the Continue Theme, which is very erratic. It may take some time to get finished. Drums and bass for now:

    http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/6/12/1956908/CONTINUe.mp3

    Any suggestions for the remaining instruments?
     
  7. Irixion, I like your chemical plant zone. I also like how you made the bass and other parts of the song louder. Eh, not too good with musical terms XD But you know, you highlighted the different melodies. I think I still like Blaze's more, but this one is my second favorite.

    Casino Night... eh... I don't know, man. It really seems off. ESPECIALLY the beginning. It doesn't seem very faithful to the original to me. Try to make it more like the original. The instruments are good, but it's like... the pitch or something is totally off :/
    The good news though is that it still captures that bustling and neon-light feel of Casino Night Zone well, unlike many of the other remixes. So that's definitely a plus. Just fix the notes so it's more faithful to how the original can be heard and I think it can sound really great ^^

    EDIT: A quick suggestion for Chemical Plant. Blaze's version used a saxophone or something for the lead (please don't slam me if I'm wrong on this X3 as I said, I don't know all this stuff about music) and I thought it fit PERFECTLY. If you could try changing your lead to that, I think it'd be excellent!
     
  8. mario

    mario

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  9. Jayextee

    Jayextee

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    That lead is far from correct, in my opinion.

    To me, the lead was always a sort of brass sound that mimicked the schoolyard taunt "Nyeh-nyeh-nyenyehhh-nyeh" (Say audibly whilst blowing a raspberry for best results), sort of goading you into another attempt, like "You're not giving up, are you?".
     
  10. I don't know. I just think the jazzy feel really fits in well :/
     
  11. Magitek

    Magitek

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    Irixion,

    I love the fresh perspectives you've taken on CPZ and CNZ. Great job!

    However, I can't help but call out that what you've done borders heavily on remixing. Over in the graphics dept., they've been freaking out over 1 pixel differences between the HD art and the original, and hold a high standard to what is allowed. Applying the same standards to music, I have to say that while it sounds awesome, too much liberty has been taken with the music by adding/changing enough little things to add up to sound different.

    You have some incredible talent, and I would love to see how it would turn out if you were able to use that talent while still keeping the original melody/harmonies/rhythms intact.

    To all the musicians on this project, forgive me for being so anal in my reviews, but I'm just trying to be helpful to make the music the best it can be. I know artists enjoy expressing themselves through the music, but too many liberties are keeping the remasters from reaching their potential. I would imagine that ideally we're looking to improve the sound quality, without changing any of the notes of the original.

    I guess I just see notes as music's pixels... :P
     
  12. I like the way you speak! =D I will try finding a good CNZ Midi, and guys even if it doesn't fit this project, it's still a good peice of music. I will now resume my search for a good CNZ Midi, stay tuned for another remake of an original tune.
     
  13. Flygon

    Flygon

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    I like the Casino Night Zone remix very much.

    Sounds better then the original in my opinion, but it is a bit "noisy" (As in being a bit full).
     
  14. Lostgame

    Lostgame

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    I could try to play casino night with my real alto saxophone, I used to be able to play it.

    Also, I've got to say, I'm really disappointed in what I'm seeing in the music so far - they still sound incredibly MIDI-esque and with today's music technologies, we don't need music that still sounds like it's from the 90's. We need to be using real instruments - real pianos, real brass, real percussion, etc.

    I may try casino night in this fashion, because, man, I can't help but be disappointed so far.
     
  15. Haha, I could too, If you can get good samples of each note I could use those in the song =P
     
  16. mario

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    Not a rant, just to clarify things to non-musicians: :)

    The artificial feel will surely be present in the songs unless they are entirely played and recorded by humans on real instruments, which I think is not an option (unfortunately!). It is also important to understand what is the music itself and what is music production. Good music is, to keep it simple, a bunch of notes which fit perfectly both rhythmically and harmonically. Then it has to undergo a careful production process, choosing the right tones/instruments and positioning them with stereo span and reverb to give it the "live" feel (I.e. never set high strings on the right side, it is jsut stupid from an orchestral point of view; timpanis and choirs are expected to have a bit more of reverb for they are far away from the listener, etc). The thing is: notes which are not harmonically/rythmically ok, which is the case of most midis, just won't turn out to be a good remix, no matter how awesome the production is.

    I have to say there are some high skilled musicians here who entirely understand musical theory and therefore don't need to rely on midis stripped from the game (again, they are innacurate). The last couple of CNZs show that people here are not afraid of jazzy harmonic stuff.

    So, to have everything going as expected (songs true to originals, with artistic expression from musicians and most of all keeping them up to players' expectations) I have an approach proposal:

    1. Write a midi from scratch by careful listening to the original, unless I'm not aware of a software capable of properly stripping songs from the game.
    2. Still in "midi style": choose tones, instruments and basic stereo span and reverb.
    3. Then finally, let the experts finish it in the production process.

    I am able to help with 1 and 2. So far I wrote from scratch the Drowning, 1-UP and Continue themes. I will fix some innacuracies and "artistic freedom stuff" and post links to the midis. Please let me know if there are any songs which are not done yet, I can't think of any right now.
     
  17. Lostgame

    Lostgame

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    ...why not?
     
  18. Overlord

    Overlord

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    Well, it depends. Random example - it'd be fucking AWESOME to have a full orchestra to do stuff like the final boss theme, but it's not likely to happen now, is it? =P
     
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