"Multiple" new Sonic games planned for 2021

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by TheOneAndOnlyJoebro64, Sep 7, 2020.

  1. Frostav

    Frostav

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    It is a sequel to Sonic 3 in name only. No one considers it an actual sequel. There is a reason Mania was called "the real Sonic 4".

    It's like how no one considers Federation Force to be a Metroid Prime game, even if it's branded as one. In fact FF is a perfect comparison because it too had a critically-acclaimed title slapped onto it to grab sales and only resulted in people hating even more for spitting on the name of a beloved series.

    Sonic 4 is legally a sequel to Sonic 3. it sure as fuck ain't a cultural sequel to it. Culturally, the entire Sonic fandom has near-unanimously repudiated it. That's what matters far more than its name, because in the end, a game lives or dies by how the culture it was designed for reacts to it. Our reaction has been near-unanimous disownment.
     
  2. Does Sega say it's the sequel to Sonic 3? Yes. So is it a sequel? Yes. That is an objective fact.

    Whether it's a worthy sequel is an entirely different discussion. But saying Sonic 4 is not a sequel to Sonic 3 solely based on its quality is like saying Alien 3 isn't a sequel to Aliens just because it isn't as good.
     
  3. Billy

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    I think what everyone is getting at is the two different definitions of the word sequel:
    I would argue that Sonic 4 doesn't continue the story or theme of S3&K.
    This is definitely true of Sonic 4. By this definition, even Sonic Adventure is a sequel to S3&K.
     
  4. Josh

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    Bereft of any substantial news, this is what we've resorted to talking about. :ruby:

    It's a game published by SEGA called "Sonic the Hedgehog 4." It could be a real-time strategy naval combat simulator, and it'd still be a direct sequel to Sonic 3.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2020
  5. If SEGA had just given it a different title, I’m 100% certain we as fans would not be wiping it under the carpet because those 2 games were not bad at all in my opinion.. a nice modern take on the 2D formula, despite the episodic approach and the Rush physics being implemented

    I would have called it “New Sonic the Hedgehog” but ofc that word was taken by another series :V
     
  6. It was actually supposed to be called “Sonic the Portable”, because it was supposed to be iOS exclusive. The home console versions weren’t started until later in development, which is when they changed the title and decided to tie it to the classics.
     
  7. Mana

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    This is another example of SEGA incompetence making the developers look bad just like Sonic 06 and Sonic Boom Rise of Lyric.

    It's funny because DIMPS showed us in 2001 that a Classic Sonic game with modern aesthetics and design COULD work with the first Sonic Advance but they slowly abandoned the Genesis-Lite style and became it's own thing for better or for worse. I bet if Advance had never came out and we got it in 2010 as Sonic 4 the game would have been praised and well received and we might have a 2D line running adjacent to the 3D games right now instead of Mania being a one off.
     
  8. Blue Spikeball

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    Eh, I don't think so. From what I've seen, fan consensus has always been that Advance is good for a handheld game that emulates the classic Sonic gameplay, but taken on its own, it doesn't hold a candle to the MD games.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2020
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  9. Dek Rollins

    Dek Rollins

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    So what you're saying is that Sonic 4 literally wasn't a direct sequel to Sonic 3 outside of a marketing decision made late in development. Might explain why many fans don't consider it a real sequel. Had they released it as a mobile game without the Sonic 4 title, I'm sure most fans would've been at best amused and at worst would say "wow, Dimps made a shitty Sonic spinoff" and move on.

    I wouldn't even consider Mania a direct sequel to Sonic 3&K. It's more of a spiritual successor to the classics (this is basically how I would define the Advance games and Sonic 4, Mania just does a much better job). The direct sequel to 3&K really is Sonic Adventure.
     
  10. Blue Spikeball

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    Heh, S3K is basically the series' Ocarina of Time, having multiple sequels and even branching off into separate timelines.

    Story-wise, its sequel is SA1, focusing on and expanding the Angel Island lore. Although one could consider Sonic 4 a sequel to the Death Egg saga, what with the Death Egg mk II.

    Title-wise, it's Sonic 4.

    Gameplay-wise, it's Sonic Mania.

    Chronology-wise, it's Sonic 4 in the modern timeline and Sonic Mania in the classic timeline.

    You could even throw Chaotix in there :V
     
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  11. Laura

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    This is a boring conversation topic, but I reject the idea that a sequel is purely defined by its title. Especially when game designers are often not in control of how a game is marketed and titled. I also think it's incredibly facile artistically to say that games which are not titled as sequels, such as Mario Sunshine, Majora's Mask, are therefore not sequels even when they clearly build upon the gameplay, tone, and storyline of past titles. You can think that Sonic 4 meets this criteria and therefore classify it as a sequel, that's fine, but to say that it's a sequel because it's called Sonic 4, end of debate, seems like an awful view to me.

    In my opinion. Sonic 4 is officially a sequel because it's called Sonic 4, but in every other aspect it's far more like a spinoff title than a sequel. It almost exclusively reuses levels and bosses from past games and its story is barely connected to Sonic 1, 2, or 3. To be fair, the story connection between Sonic 1 and Sonic 2 was also nebulous, but it's something to consider when calling it a sequel. For all intents and purposes, it serves as a spinoff title which is a spiritual successor to Sonic 1-3, in much the same way as Sonic Advance and Sonic Pocket Adventure was. I would similarly reject the idea that Sonic Pocket Adventure was Sonic 4 just because it held the title.

    Sonic 4 actually has a lot in common with Sonic Mania and the only real difference between the two is quality. Sonic Mania has a few more unique levels but it also leans heavily into the aesthetic of bosses of past games. This is also why I reject the idea that Sonic Mania is the 'real' Sonic 4. I think it's too clearly defined as an anniversary title and too deeply rooted in the levels of past games to be considered a sequel in the same way as Sonic CD, 2 and 3 were.

    But I also don't think it matters. The idea of a Sonic 4 always seemed pretty strange to me after decades of new titles which continued the storyline of the Sonic franchise. Especially now we are in this ill-defined mess of two dimensions.
     
  12. Man I really hope that Mania being a one off is not the case.. I’m going to remain cautiously optimistic that Evening Star will develop a Mania sequel with all original stages.. that is the dream and SEGA should capitalize on it.. give those guys the creative freedom to go nuts!! I’m sure if that’s the case, we may have a true game that will take over 3&K as best ever

    if that doesn’t happen then off to my little corner to cry lol
     
  13. raphael_fc

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    The true sequel to Sonic 3K will be Sonic 5.
     
  14. big smile

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    Mania was adored by the press and public alike. It did well both in reviews and sales. A follow up would be a no brainer, which is why it'll probably never happen.

    However, Mania's success won't have been completely lost on Sega. Expect to see more Green Hill Zone in future games.
     
  15. Laura

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    The more I think about it, the more I think it's possible that Evening Star might actually be working on a Sonic game.

    The name is a nod to Knuckles Chaotix but might not mean anything. Stealth has said he hasn't received any more invitations to work on Sonic. He's never spoken about Evening Star openly I don't think, so he might not even know what they are doing. Maybe Stealth isn't on the team could have something to do with his comments on DRM (big maybe). I find it odd that they would make a studio on their own and invite everyone but Stealth. Unless they all had a massive falling out (which doesn't seem to be the case on Twitter) or Stealth just had that much faith in Vertebreaker, it doesn't make much sense.

    I think most telling is that the CEO on Evening Star is Dave Padilla, who is credited on Sonic Mania Plus and was the CEO of Hyperkinetic Studio (whose logo is seen plastered on Sonic Mania Plus).

    upload_2020-11-15_12-23-6.png

    So maybe SEGA hired Dave Padilla to oversee Plus' development and then asked him to act as the CEO of their new Sonic Team since he had experience with them and Lola is working on something else.

    Then again, I'm not really sure how the business titles work. Can you be a CEO of a company while still being owned by SEGA? It's also possible that Dave Padilla was so impressed by Team Mania that he decided to hire them and start his own game studio with them, but I dunno, in some ways that seems even more unlikely. Who knows!
     
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  16. From now on, every Sonic game will feature the Nth iteration of Green Hill and Chemical Plant Zones, and when we all die, we just play those levels on infinite loops.
     
  17. Even better.. now we will get Emerald Hill and Labyrinth Zone for the next anniversary title :ruby:
     
  18. Frostav

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    Chemical Plant re-appearing in Forces was a trip. For so long we thought GHZ was the only classic stage they were gonna whore out!

    (I actually kinda liked the way they altered CPZ in forces, namely in turning it much colder and frostier with a turbulent ocean surrounding it and adding industrial areas, but it really didn't need to reappear, and those changes were pretty minor anyway)
     
  19. Xiao Hayes

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    And, still, neither Chemical Hill nor Green Plant have ever been levels in Sonic games. Such a shame.