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Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by The Taxman, Jul 28, 2009.

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  1. CyberKitsune

    CyberKitsune

    Never enough time. Member
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    <!--quoteo(post=336552:date=Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM:name=saxman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (saxman @ Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336552">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't get the Sonic CD hate... when I was younger, I remember EVERYONE liking Sonic CD. Now I'm 25 (crap!) and I see this hate emerging. Seriously, where the heck were you people 10 or even 15 years ago??<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    10 Years ago, I was playing Sonic CD, my First Videogame, the best one ever.
    (On Topic)
    If something happens to Nexus's site within the next few days, we know somethings up. Also, Taxman's Old Retro-Sonic site and Vid is still up, so the RSDK isn't completely under lockdown... yet.
     
  2. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    Was the RSDK ever even published? I think only demos were, but did the demos contain the SDK or something?
     
  3. Pelord

    Pelord

    Warning signs for hire Oldbie
    <!--quoteo(post=336552:date=Jul 30 2009, 11:48 PM:name=saxman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (saxman @ Jul 30 2009, 11:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336552">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't get the Sonic CD hate... when I was younger, I remember EVERYONE liking Sonic CD. Now I'm 25 (crap!) and I see this hate emerging. Seriously, where the heck were you people 10 or even 15 years ago??<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I like the game, actually (at least for 1992-93)... but I agree that most of the bosses were some of the worst... especially the final one. I never really understood why they went that direction with the bosses, though back then, a boss that could be defeated by simply running towards it wasn't exactly common. The system it was originally on probably doesn't help, either. I never considered it my favorite Sonic game, but I never considered it the worst.

    I used to recall people hating more on S3&K back then, but that seems to have completely changed now, as well.
     
  4. plushifoxed

    plushifoxed

    la gis sulva za celow Oldbie
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    <!--quoteo(post=336549:date=Jul 30 2009, 11:24 PM:name=Lostgame)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lostgame @ Jul 30 2009, 11:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336549">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why pick one of the worst genesis Sonic games to port? Makes almost as much sense as them porting Sonic 1 to start - where the fuck is Sonic 2 and S3K, I mean I guess Sonic CD's not that bad but the level design...ugh. And the bosses? Retarded. Meh.

    Also, why would you even think about picking the JPN soundtrack? It's like...shitriffic.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->What game were you playing?
    What SOUNDTRACK were you LISTENING TO?! :argh:
     
  5. Shoemanbundy

    Shoemanbundy

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    selling shoes
    <!--quoteo(post=336553:date=Jul 30 2009, 08:52 PM:name=CyberKitsune)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CyberKitsune @ Jul 30 2009, 08:52 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336553">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=336552:date=Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM:name=saxman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (saxman @ Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336552">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't get the Sonic CD hate... when I was younger, I remember EVERYONE liking Sonic CD. Now I'm 25 (crap!) and I see this hate emerging. Seriously, where the heck were you people 10 or even 15 years ago??<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    10 Years ago, I was playing Sonic CD, my First Videogame, the best one ever.
    (On Topic)
    If something happens to Nexus's site within the next few days, we know somethings up. Also, Taxman's Old Retro-Sonic site and Vid is still up, so the RSDK isn't completely under lockdown... yet.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It's never been released and from what I've been told it's not likely to ever be released for a very long time, as Taxman wants to get it perfect, and he keeps adding stuff..or something. In any case, if you REALLY want to use it you can do what a couple of others have and come up with a project that's impressive enough that Taxman invites you to use his engine(or you ask him yourself, not sure exactly how XG and Nexus got his engine :P ).

    And when I say come up with a project I mean actually have a concrete game first, not just ideas. Sonic XG and Sonic Nexus both started as games on Multimedia Fusion I think before they were ever moved over.
     
  6. Guess Who

    Guess Who

    It's a miracle! Oldbie
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    <!--quoteo(post=336549:date=Jul 30 2009, 10:24 PM:name=Lostgame)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lostgame @ Jul 30 2009, 10:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336549">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why pick one of the worst genesis Sonic games to port? Makes almost as much sense as them porting Sonic 1 to start - where the fuck is Sonic 2 and S3K, I mean I guess Sonic CD's not that bad but the level design...ugh. And the bosses? Retarded. Meh.

    Also, why would you even think about picking the JPN soundtrack? It's like...shitriffic.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I disagree with every single part of this post.
     
  7. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    <!--quoteo(post=336563:date=Jul 30 2009, 11:36 PM:name=Shoemanbundy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shoemanbundy @ Jul 30 2009, 11:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336563">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=336553:date=Jul 30 2009, 08:52 PM:name=CyberKitsune)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CyberKitsune @ Jul 30 2009, 08:52 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336553">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=336552:date=Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM:name=saxman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (saxman @ Jul 30 2009, 08:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336552">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't get the Sonic CD hate... when I was younger, I remember EVERYONE liking Sonic CD. Now I'm 25 (crap!) and I see this hate emerging. Seriously, where the heck were you people 10 or even 15 years ago??<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    10 Years ago, I was playing Sonic CD, my First Videogame, the best one ever.
    (On Topic)
    If something happens to Nexus's site within the next few days, we know somethings up. Also, Taxman's Old Retro-Sonic site and Vid is still up, so the RSDK isn't completely under lockdown... yet.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It's never been released and from what I've been told it's not likely to ever be released for a very long time, as Taxman wants to get it perfect, and he keeps adding stuff..or something. In any case, if you REALLY want to use it you can do what a couple of others have and come up with a project that's impressive enough that Taxman invites you to use his engine(or you ask him yourself, not sure exactly how XG and Nexus got his engine :P ).

    And when I say come up with a project I mean actually have a concrete game first, not just ideas. Sonic XG and Sonic Nexus both started as games on Multimedia Fusion I think before they were ever moved over.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    If Taxman is waiting for it to be perfect, then he will be waiting till the day he dies. No code is perfect.

    I'm pretty sure Nexus got it because Taxman is on that project. The other one.... Not so sure, really....
     
  8. Tweaker

    Tweaker

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    Why do people keep thinking Nexus is in trouble? SEGA has never been adverse to fangaming projects and I'm sure they're not going to start—it'd only be a bad thing for them from a marketing perspective. Nothing is illegal about Nexus, and I severely doubt that the RSDK is in any immediate danger or SEGA would have sent us a C&D to take down information for the engine being available on the wiki.

    If anything happened with regards to this project, it's either that SEGA simply decided to adopt it or decided to halt potential discussion of it because they have plans for their own iPhone port. Since I don't think we're going to figure out which of those two possibilities is the reality of the situation anytime soon, I suggest we refrain from making wild conspiracy theories about what has happened to the project and its website and how it supposedly means the end of Taxman's engine.
     
  9. Namagem

    Namagem

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    I'd honestly like to think positively, that he's been "hired" by sega and was forced to sign a NDA about it. It not only makes the most sense, but it is also the best option for the sonic community.
     
  10. Diablohead

    Diablohead

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    I wish Taxman the best of luck if so :D
     
  11. Sik

    Sik

    Sik is pronounced as "seek", not as "sick". Tech Member
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    being an asshole =P
    <!--quoteo(post=336552:date=Jul 31 2009, 12:48 AM:name=saxman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (saxman @ Jul 31 2009, 12:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336552">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't get the Sonic CD hate... when I was younger, I remember EVERYONE liking Sonic CD. Now I'm 25 (crap!) and I see this hate emerging. Seriously, where the heck were you people 10 or even 15 years ago??<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->To be fair I would say the very same thing about pretty much everything, not just Sonic CD, hell, not just games for that matter. People like to say that everything sucks when they're on Internet. It's like it's a rule in order to stay around.

    <!--quoteo(post=336582:date=Jul 31 2009, 03:19 AM:name=Tweaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweaker @ Jul 31 2009, 03:19 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336582">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Nothing is illegal about Nexus<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Um, any kind of fangame without explicit permission from the copyright owner is illegal. There's the exception of parodies where fair use may apply (read: may), but fair use is an active defense (which means that it must be declared inside a lawsuit already), so it isn't safe either because there's the matter of having to pay for a lawyer and such. Now, this is completely unrelated to the Retro Engine, that is.
     
  12. TSSZNews

    TSSZNews

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    Tweaker, it's a simple cause and effect thing between Nexus and RSDK. If Sega buys out the RSDK, it becomes their intellectual property, and more likely than not their *exclusive* intellectual property. It doesn't make good business sense—if not general common sense—to have a fan project use something you own, while you as a company are trying to profit off the thing you just bought by porting classic games to the iPhone/iPod Touch—or any platform, for that matter. I've signed more than a few contracts in my day, and in the end they ultimately are written to benefit and protect the company, rather than the outside contractor or what have you. If there is a deal on the table where Sega wants to purchase the engine, it would likely be an uphill battle to have an exception written in the deal where Sonic Nexus could continue to use the engine (and, in all likelihood, become the last people to do so outside of Sega.)

    And it's like Dean said earlier in the thread—the engine itself may not be sold, but you can bet the company may find a way to farm the roots out of this. Doing so may produce a bastardized version of RSDK that would make neither Sega nor Taxman look good.

    Unless Taxman is a man of his word and will not under any circumstances sell them the engine (and if so, bless his heart) it would be very, VERY stupid for the Nexus Team to not have a backup plan right now that isn't named Sonic Nexus Attitude XG: Mecha Madness Rebirth ;)
     
  13. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    <!--quoteo(post=336658:date=Jul 31 2009, 09:24 AM:name=TSSZNews)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TSSZNews @ Jul 31 2009, 09:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336658">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Tweaker, it's a simple cause and effect thing between Nexus and RSDK. If Sega buys out the RSDK, it becomes their intellectual property, and more likely than not their *exclusive* intellectual property. It doesn't make good business sense—if not general common sense—to have a fan project use something you own, while you as a company are trying to profit off the thing you just bought by porting classic games to the iPhone/iPod Touch—or any platform, for that matter. I've signed more than a few contracts in my day, and in the end they ultimately are written to benefit and protect the company, rather than the outside contractor or what have you. If there is a deal on the table where Sega wants to purchase the engine, it would likely be an uphill battle to have an exception written in the deal where Sonic Nexus could continue to use the engine (and, in all likelihood, become the last people to do so outside of Sega.)

    And it's like Dean said earlier in the thread—the engine itself may not be sold, but you can bet the company may find a way to farm the roots out of this. Doing so may produce a bastardized version of RSDK that would make neither Sega nor Taxman look good.

    Unless Taxman is a man of his word and will not under any circumstances sell them the engine (and if so, bless his heart) it would be very, VERY stupid for the Nexus Team to not have a backup plan right now that isn't named Sonic Nexus Attitude XG: Mecha Madness Rebirth ;)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Although, the community as a whole may not miss it that much, since nobody except for Taxman actually HAS the RSDK. Sure, it would be a horrible loss, but it isn't something we had to begin with really....
     
  14. Chimpo

    Chimpo

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    Atomic Sonic Part II
    <!--quoteo(post=336503:date=Jul 30 2009, 04:53 PM:name=TSSZNews)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TSSZNews @ Jul 30 2009, 04:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336503">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I assure you, it wasn't my practical joke.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It's probably best to hold your teasing of *huge* news until you have something more concrete then.

    Nexus isn't in trouble (why the fuck has this even been brought up?) The Nexus team are not stupid for lack of a back up plan, and I seriously doubt Taxman is going to just give away all his hard work just for one port. The conductor to this train of thought is stupid and will derail into a cliff.
     
  15. TSSZNews

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    Another thought.

    If Taxman doesn't want to give them RSDK, does anyone here think that Sega would hire him to make a similar but perhaps somewhat different and proprietary engine that could be used for the same purposes?

    That would sound like a win-win. RSDK and anything using it right now would be in the clear, and Taxman would still be able to provide that SCD proof of concept with an engine—it would just be a different one.
     
  16. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    <!--quoteo(post=336720:date=Jul 31 2009, 01:22 PM:name=TSSZNews)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TSSZNews @ Jul 31 2009, 01:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336720">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Another thought.

    If Taxman doesn't want to give them RSDK, does anyone here think that Sega would hire him to make a similar but perhaps somewhat different and proprietary engine that could be used for the same purposes?

    That would sound like a win-win. RSDK and anything using it right now would be in the clear, and Taxman would still be able to provide that SCD proof of concept with an engine—it would just be a different one.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It would quite likely also require reimplementing the entire RSDK scripting routines and language. Or Taxman may borrow code, in which things might get weird in the future. Doing something like that is a pain and really unnecessary.

    In the end, I really doubt anything will happen to the RSDK. Sure Taxman isn't exactly Epic Games, but SEGA should still have no problems licensing the engine for their use with the Sonic CD port.
     
  17. saxman

    saxman

    Oldbie Tech Member
    This topic has quickly become a conspiracy theory topic. We don't even know what's going on, and some people are going wild with ideas! With all due respect, let's not get carried away. Nexus isn't in trouble, and neither is Taxman's engine. Sega isn't likely to bully Taxman or anyone for making fan games or making an engine. All they want is to use what Taxman has created to port Sonic CD. That's it! There is no indication that they want more than that. And no, not everything in business has to be a strict money-maker legal matter.

    Taxman will have a further explaination of events I'm sure. This trying to come up with a scenario that fits with the events that have occurred based purely on one's imagination isn't healthy for anyone.
     
  18. Chimpo

    Chimpo

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    <!--quoteo(post=336720:date=Jul 31 2009, 11:22 AM:name=TSSZNews)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TSSZNews @ Jul 31 2009, 11:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336720">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If Taxman doesn't want to give them RSDK, does anyone here think that Sega would hire him to make a similar but perhaps somewhat different and proprietary engine that could be used for the same purposes?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Is the concept of licensing an engine so hard for someone to believe?

    Really? Jesus Christ.
     
  19. TSSZNews

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    Oh, I get that an engine license and nothing else is possible.

    From a business standpoint (the standpoint of Sega,) I just don't know if that's the best decision. If I were a CEO or whomever considering this deal, I'd want it all.

    Of course, the variable here is the inevitable community reaction to a deal (or lack thereof.) In the end, while I think it would be a huge thumbs up to the company all around if game and/or engine were picked up...if neither are, I don't see any outcry over this other than a simple "meh."

    That's why I think Sega doesn't have a lot to lose one way or another by making this an "all or nothing" situation. They have the advantage in that regard, and it's good business for them to do so.
     
  20. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    <!--quoteo(post=336752:date=Jul 31 2009, 03:10 PM:name=TSSZNews)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TSSZNews @ Jul 31 2009, 03:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=336752">[​IMG]</a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh, I get that an engine license and nothing else is possible.

    From a business standpoint (the standpoint of Sega,) I just don't know if that's the best decision. If I were a CEO or whomever considering this deal, I'd want it all.

    Of course, the variable here is the inevitable community reaction to a deal (or lack thereof.) In the end, while I think it would be a huge thumbs up to the company all around if game and/or engine were picked up...if neither are, I don't see any outcry over this other than a simple "meh."

    That's why I think Sega doesn't have a lot to lose one way or another by making this an "all or nothing" situation. They have the advantage in that regard, and it's good business for them to do so.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Except PR. And that's the worst loss any company can have. If they get bad PR from this, let's just say its not good for business...
     
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