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If Sega only cared about pandering to YOU, what kind of Sonic game would they make?

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Josh, Dec 22, 2021.

  1. ChaddyFantome

    ChaddyFantome

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    This seems like a contradictory statement. What I find silly is the categorical insistence on said basis. And yea, I find that silly and no I do not see it as disrespectful, moreso honest.
    Because one doesn't need an excuse or approval of others to enjoy something, yes?
    It is possible to have a curiosity or appreciation of an aspect of a game and even stress ones personal valuing of said element without proclaiming it, in a quite frankly dishonest manner, to be a fundamental element of its actual design, and that the people that did design the game effectively lied to people about the game and/or don't know or ever knew what they are talking about. And I don't see sense in doing so out of fear of it being accused of being "shallow", because ultimately the nature of the game itself isn't what is changed.
    If I am, I would like to know how I am presenting such a thing and be given an example where I have. I genuinely do not see how I have. I think I have made myself adequately clear on this so I would genuinely like to know as it is not my intent. With that said, If there is concern with derailing, I would be more than happy to continue the conversation privately if you wish.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2022
  2. Fadaway

    Fadaway

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    If they made a game for me exclusively, it would be a 2D game with hand-drawn art. It wouldn't be a mainline title, but a spinoff.

    Title: Amy & Ristar's Entheogen-Fueled Quest for the Mythical Prismatic Chelsea Boots in the Realms of the Unreal, of the Abezethibou-Dargerian Meth Storm, Caused by the Chimney Sweeps' Apprentices Rebellion

    The game would begin with a beautifully illustrated cinematic about Amy Rose unwittingly eating a bowl of Time-Travelling Spaghetti™. This, as it is eventually revealed, is a cruel scheme by a sinister A.I. to lure Sonic into trap. Sonic doesn't take the bait however and fucks right off enjoying the solitude and catches up on the latest episodes of Big Cat, Little Planet on Hulu.

    Meanwhile, Amy is thrust between worlds and into different time periods and in an alternate timeline of Sonic CD, while captive in Stardust Speedway Zone without the aid of Sonic, she is rescued by Ristar. Ristar informs her of the fabled Chelsea Boots and the power they possess. Together, they travel to 18th-century Westminster.


     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2022
  3. Frostav

    Frostav

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    -Gameplay akin to a tuned up version of Sonic GT's gameplay, with similar level design (but much more fine-tuned and less messy)

    -Aesthetically, like Sonic Mania/CD but in 3D. Surreal bright geometric environments with tons of detail, and much less emphasis on realism (outside of rendering tech which would be very high quality, probably with optional ray-tracing)

    -A plotline akin to SA2 or Unleashed, though with polished up writing akin to the IDW comics. Basically, just have a plot that takes itself seriously enough to be compelling. Think like a good cartoon, especially a more modern plot-focused one like Steven Universe. Not asking for some M-rated edgefest here!

    -Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles are the main playable characters. A variety of other characters with unique movesets based on his are available for free play and the like, unlocked through main story progress and other methods. Tangle and Whisper are available too. A customizable avatar is also available and make it actually good this time >:c

    -Each member of the playable trio plays through the same Zones--but not in the same order, and their actions affect the whole world. So if Sonic shuts the power off in an Eggman base and Knuckles plays through that Zone later, the power will be off. As I explained in a much earlier post:

    -Throughout the story have Amy realize that Sonic clearly isn't going to reciprocate her feelings for him and have her end up getting to know and eventually fall for Shadow (basically, make Shadamy canon and then make Sonaze canon too maybe) i̶ ̶k̶i̶n̶d̶a̶ ̶w̶a̶n̶t̶ ̶s̶o̶n̶a̶d̶o̶w̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶c̶a̶n̶o̶n̶ ̶b̶u̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶w̶i̶l̶l̶ ̶n̶e̶v̶e̶r̶ ̶h̶a̶p̶p̶e̶n̶ ̶l̶m̶a̶o̶

    -No humans but the Robotniks. Basically like the comics.

    -Introduce a new Mobian character that fights for Robotnik. Why this has happened only once (Infinite) is baffling to me a̶l̶s̶o̶ ̶m̶a̶k̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶m̶ ̶h̶o̶t̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶i̶n̶f̶i̶n̶i̶t̶e̶

    -Chao garden. Hoo boy, buckle up, I got a LOT of ground to cover here. Start with the SA2B system, of course. Now, for additions, tweaks, and changes:
    > Improve chaos drives and in general make leveling stats much less tedious. Even with improved animals and drives in Chao World Extended, it still takes an acceptable timesink to max levels so there's no need for the insane grind of SA2(B)

    > Completely overhaul chao genetics: firstly, two-tone chao now have a base color and a highlight color instead of each two-tone having a set combination. If you want to breed a white chao with red highlights, then you can (the original two-tones can be from [color]/Normal mixes). Mix and match any color (and also introduce like 50 new shades at the very least, perhaps even allowing for mixing shades by breeding two monotone chao together); Introduce several new coat types (frosted tips, dusty, gunmetal sheen, jewel but affected by color etc.) that all exist on the same gene as shininess. Make bright chao canon as well, based off of their dark chao appearances. Also make it so that COLORED DARK/NORMAL CHAO ACTUALLY LOOK THEIR COLOR AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

    > Overhaul chao's behavior: give them actual personalities that matter and the ability to make friendships/rivals/enemies/etc. with other chao. Have them actually do unique things around the garden and interact with the environment and each other: If a chao is drowning a chao that can swim can save them; two chao friends can fly around together; an altruistic chao can give a hungry one some fruit, etc. Add a LOT of new classes for them to take and things for them to learn (and don't make it require being in the garden itself to progress good god) to bolster this. Basically chao should do things.

    > Introduce many of CWE's new features/improvements (differing eye colors, hyper fruit/x grade, shiny fruit, character chaos chao, negative chao, colored wings, improving grades at the doctor with rings, family histories/trees, birthdays etc.)

    > Make Intelligence a regular stat alongside the existing 5 with unique evolutions (luck can remain a weird hidden stat though...but jester-esque Luck chao sound kinda cool so idk lmao)

    Basics of that down, I could go on but this post is long enough XD
     
  4. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    Reading you now, I've probably been reading your posts somewhat wrong and saying things I shouldn't in consequence so I won't make this conversation longer, but out of potential embarrassment, since I'd like to give you a proper answer and my previous responses suggest I won't be able to (better know when to shut up, or at least better late than never). About the way you say things, its probably that you speak too "logical" and not so much with your heart (at least we'll avoid that horrible song) that I'd probably read your tone as empathy lacking and a bit cathegoric, but, as I've said, I'm not sure I understood everything right, so sorry for being so harsh to you.

    This is the spirit! if you have freedom to choose, push every limit! I'm missing Socket Time Dominator in this plot of you, though.

    Knuxonic has always been the real thing and you know it.

    I'm still missing the visual novel spin-off game I suggested years ago, btw. Put that on the request list, though it wouldn't exactly be pandering to me. XD

    Also, now I think of it, we need some Super Sonic-only game, travelling through space or something like that. Something like Doomsday Zone but a whole game that could be top-down perspective like a bullet hell game, but with original gameplay instead as Super Sonic isn't an X-Wing. When I say Super Sonic only I'm talking about the form, not the character, so any other potential fitting character would also be welcome as long as they have 7 chaos emeralds and at least 50 rings.
     
  5. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Not where I want to be.
    Sonic (?): Coming summer of 2055...?
    Sonic Chaos: Xenoverse? Fuck it I'm in.
     
  6. ShroomZed

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    I'm not sure how strongly I hold this opinion anymore, but for a number of years, I've thought strongly that the classic Sonic format was screaming to be in a 3D format as there is so much potential there if done properly. So essentially, a competent, very carefully, and thoroughly done transition of classic Sonic into an appropriate 3D analog.

    Stages can have an unbelievably high amount of variety, as they would be complex manifolds giving the characters many choices for how to interact with the environment. Think similar to those old Tony Hawk skateboarder games, a world inundated with half-pipes, interacting levels, and slopes. An enlarged emphasis of the characters using their velocities (direction and speed) to reach different sections of each level. Levels should have different physical stories similar to 2D levels.

    Maybe levels would have a generic shape of a large inverted bell curve, where the overall direction is down a large slope, but there are many and multiple opportunities to reach higher stories in the level, which have different things happening in them before converging as they do in 2D levels. Windy Valley beta often appears in my mind when considering these options, along with a more streamlined Sonic Utopia. There should be more of an emphasis on A to B progression than there is in Utopia though. The world is large and expansive, but it's not a true open-world game.

    There should be levels too that interact more with the general physics ideas, such as maybe a stage where the concept is that the geometry of sections is constantly changing and you have to take advantage of the present shape to shoot yourself off to another part of the stage or to do something else interesting. Maybe some levels have badniks or some sort of structures built by Eggman which are moving around and you have to take advantage of their positions to launch off them or something of the like.

    Basic moveset would include the spindash, dropdash, and insta-shield, which I've always thought to be a neglected move. The insta-shield would briefly increase your hitbox considerably which would be useful in 3D, and perhaps there are certain pathways in levels which can only be penetrated by timing an insta-shield to make it through a forcefield or something of the like, allowing Sonic to have unique pathways in the way that Tails and Knuckles do.

    I'd imagine the art style to emulate Sonic Jam era stuff, with maybe a touch more CD-style surreality. Make the world feel like something amazing to behold, but extremely distinctive. Storyline and such things are mostly secondary, but I'd like it to take a roughly 3K approach to a narrative, where each stage plays a role in the next and explains why things are progressing as they are. I wouldn't be adverse to talking, but I'd think the cutscenes would be more on the short side and more reminiscent of the OVA than anything else, with short quips from each character as an event is happening, and then the next stage begins.

    Those are some of my basic ideas.
     
  7. MagnusTheGreen

    MagnusTheGreen

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    If Sega was pandering to me, we'd have a classic Sonic Maker game (kinda like that Sonic Maker fangame that's being made). You'd use a polygon editor to edit the stage, and place enemies and things. There'd be a story mode much like Super Mario Maker and one of the "gimmicks" would be that they got a bunch of level designers from previous games to their own level in story mode. In the editor, besides editing the terrain, you'd have the ability to edit the palette of the level to make it look unique. I wouldn't even ask for too many features, having the ability to make my own level to run around in would be nice. Much like Mario Maker, I imagine there'd be 4 themes, Hills (Reminiscent of Green Hill, Emerald Hill, and Splash Hill), Mechanical (Reminiscent of Chemical Plant, Metropolis, and Scrap Brain) and Ruins (Reminiscent of Aquatic Ruins, Labyrinth, and Marble Zone), and Sand (Reminiscent of Emerald Coast, Mirage Saloon, or Dust Hill). Due to the fact that you can toggle water or lava, and due to the fact that you can change the liquid's palette, a desert theme easily becomes a beach with a bit of water, and a hill theme with a bit of lava and a blue coloring scheme becomes a Hill-Top-Like volcano. Perhaps there would be DLC that allows you to get more themes somewhere down the line, but I feel like even just those themes + the ability to change the colors of the theme would let you customize them to look the way you want your level to look. You'd also have maybe 10 sprite decorations for each theme, so that you could use those to further make your level be special. As for music, I think it'd probably have a selection of music from a few Sonic games, mainly classic games, but some modern too. Maybe on PC, you could insert custom music. I could be pushing my luck, but getting someone like Karl Brueggemann to do some custom classic esque music would be the dream. I don't think it'd cost too much to make, and I think people would generally enjoy it assuming it ran on the retro engine. What are you gonna complain about, the level design? The story? It's just a level editor where you can share your levels online.
     
  8. Xiao Hayes

    Xiao Hayes

    Classic Eggman art Member
    I like this part of the post, because I find it very adequate as a silent answer to fans that also avoids a lot of shitstorm. "Go ahead, make your own games and leave us alone, we'll see if you do it better and, if not, complain to AnonUser1337 who made the levels you tried". :ruby:
     
  9. Ned Weasel

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    They'd give Nack the Weasel his own game! Mostly Genesis-style 2D gameplay, but it would be nice to see some animated cutscenes, and some good 3D renderings of Mr. Weasel would be nice.

    I'm honestly not sure how best to incorporate the gun into the gameplay, though. Maybe something in between "Jazz Jackrabbit" and "Shadow the Hedgehog?"
     
  10. VelvetBlueDreams

    VelvetBlueDreams

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    If they were trying to pander to me specifically, they'd probably make a new classic style 2D game with hand-drawn art during gameplay and animated cutscenes inbetween certain zones.

    Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles would be playable of course, with all their S3&K abilities (plus Drop Dash and Peel-Out for Sonic), and I feel like the Chaotix deserve another game too, albeit with a nerfed Charmy. Amy would be playable and just as fast as the other characters, and I'd even like to see some more modern characters in a classic game, like Rouge, Tikal, or Blaze. Metal Sonic would be cool too.

    The levels would be original too, some sort of forest zone sounds like it could be amazing, I've always wanted a Christmas level, and a beach zone just sounds fun.

    Or they could just make a Sonic Man game. I'd buy that.
     
  11. Azookara

    Azookara

    yup Member
    If Sega were only pandering to me, they'd say "fuck off" to Sonic for a minute and make a new NiGHTS game.

    Like, a proper 3D one, not simply a retread like JoD was.

    GAMEPLAY:
    You freely fly in any direction in the sky (albeit auto-moving) in a more adventure-type game, with occasional "rail shooter" areas to loop around a track like the original. NiGHTS can fly up, down, left or right, and if held long enough can do loops or U-turns, although said turns are somewhat wide. Despite auto-moving, NiGHTS can hard brake with the left trigger, and soft brake with the right trigger; each allowing tighter loops and turns. NiGHTS has their usual Drill Dash on A/B, but to assist hitting enemies or honing into objects, NiGHTS gets a "Homing Dash" on X/Y, not too dissimilar to how it works in Rodea the Sky Soldier where you can aim with a cursor upon holding and launch upon release into target objects/enemies (or just in a short burst, if not locked onto anything). NiGHTS could also do tricks using the right stick, and upon double tapping in any direction can quickly dodge incoming hazards.

    When not playing as NiGHTS, you play as the human character, who can do certain things NiGHTS cannot (like jump on things, navigate places on the ground, do more dexterous things, or speaking to NPCs). Turning to and from NiGHTS would require Blue Chips, as in this game (to replace the time limit) we treat it sort of like Super Sonic, where you must keep more than zero on you to stay dualized.

    STORY:
    Instead of doing another game about kids, we focus on young adults having to parse their way through figuring out who they are in their newfound adulthood lives, with maybe a pinch of romance between the two characters. Main guy is a young man who got caught into being a businessman but always wanted to be a musician. The main gal is a baseball player who wants to get back in touch with the side of her that did ballet (or maybe the other way around). The two, through NiGHTS, meet each other, Dreams Dreams plays, etc idk get a hold of Science Saru and let them do something really cute here.

    The main plot of the game, however, would be about Wizeman learning how to break the barrier between Nightopia and the real world, letting Nightmaren run free and warp reality into a bastardized, Paprika-esque NiGHTS version of the real world (name reveal of this world below). It's up to your two main protagonists to save both reality and Nightopia from this convergence, and restore peace to both worlds. Maybe the whole thing comes off like a dream to the main protags when it sorta-is, sorta-isn't. Don't worry too hard about the specifics, more about the feelings the game gets out of the player.

    And call it... NiGHTS into Limbo.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Hit me up, Sega.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2022
  12. I wasn’t going to post this here on this website, because I didn’t think it was worth it’s own thread. But then I remember this thread exist.

    This stuff could apply to a 3D Sonic game as well (in fact, there is a 3D Sonic game already that embodies all of them but I digress) but for the sake of being able to easily imagine the concepts, picture the base being your typical 2D Sonic game, control and perspective wise.

    This is a slight revision of the basics of what I think make a fun Sonic game, given basically in order of importance.
    • Flow
    • Rhythm
    • Tension
    • Gimmicks
    • Secrets & Experimentation
    • Challenging Platforming
    • Aesthetics

    FLOW

    I think what BEST embodies this is actually not a Sonic game at all, but something I feel Sonic should definitely learn from:

    Donkey Kong Country

    The PEAK 2D platforming series.

    Though I think 3K also has it down pretty good sometimes.

    Being able to keep moving forward and maintain momentum just feels good, and creates intrinsic incentive to play in a way (reacting to obstacles properlyand timing moves correctly) that allows you to keep maintaining that momentum.

    Ideally, I think this is something that you should be able to reach even on a first run through a level if you react quick enough and execute correctly.

    So don't have hazards they could not have seen coming, right? Try to telegraph the stuff.

    Think a levels gimmicks should contribute to the flow of momentum, not completely halt it.

    If you wish to slow a player down for tighter platforming, or wish to have them go in a different direction, do it smoothly with well placed ramps and inclines rather than abruptly so as to keep that feeling of flow. And maybe make it to where even when you have to slow down a bit so as to land on a platform you don't have to STOP completely. At the very least, not for very long.

    In areas where players can take damage, make wise use of flat terrain for this is easy to stand on, and thus also easy to charge up a spindash on and get back up to speed.

    Also, maybe they can experiment with taking damage not taking away all of Sonic's forward momentum, but just some of it. I think Advance 3 did this, actually. DKC takes away no momentum if you have a partner, just pausing the screen for a second before resuming the flow, but you don’t have to go that far.

    About momentum based obstacles such as loops and tall ramps...

    We just need to make it to where a player can make it through such obstacles without having to rely on the spindash, instead being able to just rely on their built up momentum. So have enough flat/downhill terrain proceeding them to build up momentum. Also, any obstacles that would break the players’momentum before they reached the momentum based obstacle needs to be well-telegraphed.

    One more thing about this point of flow, though I feel I should mention it is flow of a different type:

    I don’t want to feel like I am fighting Sonic’s momentum at any point. Slowing down a little bit for a moment to land on a platform is fine, and even great, but I would want the momentum I have controlled (perhaps via level design) to where I don't have SO MUCH momentum that it feels impossible to stop in time to land on the platform.

    RHYTHM

    Somehow. SOMEWAY, a feeling of rhythm needs to be created. And this kind of goes hand in hand with flow, necessary to the feeling of it even. And like flow, the feel of rhythm should be attainable even on a first run through if you react fast enough and execute correctly.

    So what is rhythm? Think SA2's speed stages, the Unleashed/Generation's boost stages, or even speedrunning the platformer Celeste.

    It's about running through a level with very little stopping (which is flow), ALONG WITH activating moves with precise timings, sometimes one after another in rapid succession.

    It is SO satisfying running through a level, maintaining momentum, chaining moves together with accurate timing, each one propelling you to the point or leading to the point where you need to time the next.

    Now when I say timing, I am talking about timing moves within NARROW windows. Also, the moves need to have BOTH a too early and too late aspect too them. I emphasize that latter part because of some people in the past trying to 100% unironically tell me Adventure 1's spindash jumps take a ton of mechanical skill to execute, which I don't agree with. The window of opportunity is too big for me to even really consider it something that takes effort.

    To keep a tight tempo, I do think Sonic needs some sort of ability that he can time midair, so he is not left with nothing to do when he is in the air. I am not so worried about the ground because even before we add real level design, he already has moves he can time on the ground: That is his speed jumps off angles of the terrain.

    Speaking of which, I'd want the level design to emphasize such jumps quite a bit more than they do generally. A go to example of just how frequent I want it to be would honestly probably be the mobile game Skyturns, which is a great platformer kind of in the same style of a Sonic game.

    TENSION

    That is, tension to moving with flow and maintaining momentum, making the player REALLY care that they do this. There are a number of ways to go about this. For one thing, going fast automatically creates this as you want to maintain that momentum, and thus will have to react to hazards and precisely time things.

    The ranking system also KIND OF does this.

    However, I really do think a more tangible thing as a reward for maintaining momentum would also be great, such as CD’s time travel or Neo Sonic’s boost mode in SRB2, which was originally in the Advance games starting with Advanced 2.

    I also think of my favorite level piece in Spring Yard Zone, where you need to have enough momentum gained from the decline to make the jump needed to reach the higher area...




    (^This round the 0:38 mark^)

    …Rather than just being able to stand on a hill and spin-dash jump, which is not as much of a timing challenge. Yeah, I definitely feel that the spin dash kind of ruined the potential for real tension to gameplay like this in particular. It doesn't matter if you lose momentum before you make it to the incline you want to jump off of because you can just fire up a spin dash.

    As far as being able to still have this source of tension even when the spindash exist, just make it to where (or if you're the Classic Games, KEEP IT to where) the speed you can gain from spindashing never reaches the speed you can get from the declines in the level.

    Then you'll really care about carrying the momentum gained from declines from earlier in the level to later in it so as to use it.

    GIMMICKS

    This is just part of giving stages their own identity and also keeping the gameplay fresh. 3K did a really good job with that.

    Just decide on a concept for the setting, and try to think of gimmicks that fit it.

    SECRETS/EXPERIMENTATION

    3K’s approach to secrets most specifically. Visual cues or openings above/below hinting at secrets and alternate path’s offscreen. It is just satisfying to have a hunch that a secret may be in there/up there/down there/back there/over there or whatever else, you follow that hunch, and you are right.

    A similar feeling is generated when experimenting, such as when trying to see what jumping off bits of terrain gets you. Or when you notice that a level loops back around and you use this to skip to later parts of the level earlier. A necessary element of this and the secrets being satisfying is that an observation is made, a plan is CONSCIOUSLY formed and then DELIBERATELY carried out, and then rewarded.

    But anyways, about the secets again another thing I also appreciated about 3K that there was no pressure to collect all of the secrets (big rings and elemental shield monitors) in a single run which would be a nightmare considering how difficult it may be to backtrack and go on different paths in that game...

    ...Though maybe you should make levels like that anyway, taking a page from CD.

    PLATFORMING

    I truly feel the only Classic Sonic game that got platforming completely right is SRB2. When it comes to other Classic Sonic games, the platforming simply isn’t challenging enough. In SRB2, it is.

    What SRB2 does is double down on Sonic's (in comparison to other platformers) "slipperiness." Because of how much momentum Sonic has in that game, you really have to worry about braking at the right time midair so as to land on platforms. You have all the information needed to do this because, due to being 3D, you can see the platform in the distance

    What I mean by that last part is that it’s not like a platform shoots on screen and, because of how fast you were going, you cannot stop in time and overshoot it. No, you know the platform is coming because you can see it (again 3D game where you can see ahead of you), so you start braking in time to land on it.

    For this to work in a 2D game, I think we need to zoom out the screen a bit more, at least for such sections.

    We could make the challenge come not from Sonic's control but the platforming itself such as in Megaman or Celeste, but I think that would involve changes to Sonic's control that wouldn't feel natural or Sonic. By which I mean drastically increasing his traction, particularly in midair.

    As is, Sonic is too heavy making it to where stopping midair (especially at speed) takes too long to emphasize landing on precise points, and to where TURNING AROUND midair and going in the opposite direction FOR SURE takes too long to have times where the player is falling in which they must move left and right so as to not fall on obstacles.

    AESTHETIC

    This is REALLY subjective, moreso than anything else mentioned, and not something that should be set in stone. The only thing that matters is that the art, scale, and music of the levels creates atmosphere. 3K does a great job at this.

    However, I think I will summarize a few thoughts I've ran into that I think I agree with. Taken from observations about Sonic Adventure 1 though, they mainly apply to 3D level design:

    When making levels, don’t necessarily start with levels. Start with fleshed out environments. The path through these environments that the player takes should not feel race tracks isolated from the environment but instead as a natural part of it. The path could be made up of a series of connected sections/islands that are generally open and wide (perhaps wide enough to where they extend our past what’s visible when the camera is pointed forward down the path to the goal) rather than narrow tracks.

    And these sections should come in a variety of shapes other than being straight lines forward, instead being (imperfect) squares, hexagons, circles, and odd shapes that curve, loop around, rise, and fall.

    The level pieces and platforms on the ground should also feel like a natural part of the environment, rather than (just) being videogamey gimmicks such as ramps, springs and grind rails.

    Also, as far as such level pieces there for aesthetic design…

    Don’t just literally give up placing them after placing them in areas that are directly in front of you on the path forward. Lol

    EDIT:

    I guess I will add that, in addition to the individual stage gimmicks, the special stages do provide an OPTIONAL way to shake up the pacing of the game? Kind of sucks that that element of them kind of stops after you beat 7, though. (Or 14, if you are a certain game.)

    But then again, the alternate special stage thing started in 3K and continued in Mania kind of makes up for that, offering the same pace change while not feeling as mandatory as they would be if they were for chaos emeralds. Though it is only one minigame in Mania, and in both cases more levels of the chaos emerald minigame (just for something that is not the chaos emeralds) aren't available here.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2023
  13. Using Generations as the base, a 3D game starring Sonic and Blaze.

    Game plays pretty much identical to Generations Modern Sonic, but wall jump and light dash are no longer context sensitive, the drift loses a lot of speed when colliding with walls, and turning when not boosting is basically identical to Frontiers' open zone turning. Homing attack range gets reduced because a lot of cool platforming segments in Gens can get easily skipped cuz Sonic can just home in on a enemy half a mile away.

    Blaze can't light dash and is a bit slower than Sonic but gets a higher jump and her hover ability to compensate.

    Standard 7 zones, 2 acts + boss each. Each act has 2 accompanying optional missions. Sonic can get the chaos emeralds via special stages that he can access via the same method from Sonic Heroes. Blaze earns the Sol Emeralds through her own unique Special Stages too.

    Original levels are a given, I dont want nor need Blaze in Green Hill.

    TLDR; gimme Generations Rush Sonic Team, it was right there :'-(
     
  14. You know, you just described one of several reasons I think the homing attack was a mistake

    Drastically reducing the range is a good one, if it doesn’t get shafted entirely.

    Though another one that has been long on my mind is simply not placing enemies in certain sections where the focus should be on platforming. Or making some enemies that it is very unwise to homing attack, because they’ll always either dodge sending Sonic hurtling past them possibly to oblivion, or counter which could be worse. (Of course, the enemies would have a distinct visual design to hint at being capable of that.)

    And maybe you can play around with that. Maybe the level design could sometimes use the dodge enemies to allow to basically do the same thing as homing attack cancelling in Frontiers, using the momentum to traverse otherwise unreachable gaps.

    Or maybe you get a feel of where the counter enemy will send you flying if you hit him at a certain angle, and so you use that to get knocked to otherwise unreachable areas.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2022
  15. HEDGESMFG

    HEDGESMFG

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    They'd hire Sonic Team Junior to finally finish the updated single player campaign in SRB2 and just throw money at them to make them do it faster.

    Oh, and Mania 2 with original stages.

    I guess I wouldn't mind a proper SA3 either... but at this point I don't even entirely know what that means anymore.
     
  16. Unleashed did something like that in the later day stages where mindless homing attacks on springs would be hard punished, but I like your idea a lot since it addresses one of 3D Sonic's more endemic issues (and tbh Sonic games in general I'd say).

    Just doing anything with the homing attack that isn't just hitting a button over and over would be nice, honestly. It's been 20+ years and homing attack chains over pits is still not riveting gameplay.

    Colors Ultimate for all its many flaws added the best improvement to the move since it was introduced, and I'm pretty disappointed that wasn't incorporated into Frontiers in some way. There's always next game I suppose.
     
  17. Levi Church

    Levi Church

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    If SEGA only cared about pandering to me they would make a new game with Kaio Kincaid as one of the playable characters. The tone would be kinda close to Sonic X but no Chris Thorndyke. Rocket Metal from Sonic the Fighters would be in it. The Chao Garden would be greatly expanded, basically turning the game into an MMO RPG when you enter the garden. The Egg Memos would be back but now there is 80 of them instead of only 24. The game would end with a time skip where Sonic and Amy are happily married and have lots of kids. One of them looks a little like Silver the Hedgehog. The end, no more Sonic games. Then the post credit scene for 100% completion teases a new NiGHTS game involving characters from Sonic Shuffle.
     
  18. RDNexus

    RDNexus

    Member
    I think this kind of thing was one of my first posts here. Not sure where it may be nowadays...

    If it were to me alone, I'd want a reboot of the franchise as a whole, with lore, continuity and character exposition and development accounted for from the beginning.
    The Classics (those in Origins) as a whole could make 1 game, SA1 could be a 2nd game, SA2 a 3rd game, etc...
    There'd be an inclusive plot with nice cutscenes and well-choreographed action and interactions.
    There'd be a world map ALA Origins with each location relevant to the story, and each location would have a HUB world big enough to explore, do missions, access stages and unlock extra features ALA JAM's Sonic World. Heck, South Island's HUB could pretty much be a revamp of said space ^^"
    In regards to gameplay, action and cutscenes, it seems Frontiers set a nice example, so ST could work from there and better the whole experience.

    In the end, I'd rather that said game wouldn't be for me alone, but something the fandom's majority (if not entirety) could come to enjoy and see as a potential future for the franchise.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2022
  19. Lurker

    Lurker

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    I would actually like to see a Sonic 06 Definitive Edition where they fix all the bugs. You know, actually show what the game could have been with a few more months of dev time
     
  20. Shaddy the guy

    Shaddy the guy

    Professional Internet asshole Member
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    You can see what the game would be like without bugs by simply avoiding the bugs, it really isn't that hard.

    It still sucks, to be clear.