Decent Dreamcast emulator wanted

Discussion in 'General Sega Discussion' started by DigitalDuck, Apr 11, 2010.

  1. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Not that I mind that too much. I'm just waiting for a new developer to head up the NullDC development. It's gonna take awhile, cause drk||raziel coded NullDC in an extremely messy manner. Though, fixing it up was one of my motivations for learning C++.

    EDIT: Response to the widescreen shots, btw.
     
  2. SegaLoco

    SegaLoco

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    I tried working on it, it's still a god damn mess. I just dropped it altogether as it's to heavily dependent on windows right now.
     
  3. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Apparently, the code is alot cleaner now as of the newest revisions. It just takes an understanding of how the dreamcast works to wrap your head around it, so says one of the people working on it over at ngemu.
     
  4. SegaLoco

    SegaLoco

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    Ehh, it's still VERY windows oriented, and 1. I am not gonna set up a Visual Studio environment for that crap, and 2. An overhaul to portable code would take quite a while, and I'm sure the team is already working on that...
     
  5. Chuck D Head

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    I've used NullDC to emulate RE: Code Veronica (works flawlessly and at a smooth 60 fps) and Shenmue (sort of laggy but still playable) and I think I used the default emu settings for the most part. I think I was using version 1.00b1.6 (that's what the exe is labeled as..? got it packaged with RE).

    <!--quoteo(post=441607:date=Apr 12 2010, 03:55 PM:name=BlazeHedgehog)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BlazeHedgehog @ Apr 12 2010, 03:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=441607"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Unfortunately, there's no gamepad plugin in the latest version. Speaking with the creator on the NullDC forums, I guess he actually hates gamepads as an input device and refuses to code a controller plugin for his own emulator (why he chose to emulate a game console, then, is a mystery to me). Somebody else was supposed to write a controller plugin a few months after the last release, but that never happened. :( You could roll back to the previous version, which has a gamepad plugin, but there are some optimizations in the last release that, at least for me, make that not an option.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    There's an easy way around this, just download XPadder or Joy2Key and map your keyboard config to your joypad that way. They both have good analog detection with adjustable dead zones and everything. Really useful for programs that refuse to allow a joypad.
     
  6. Friend of Sonic

    Friend of Sonic

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    Wow, aside from those graphical glitches, SA2 looked pretty nice in Null DC.

    OP, why not buy a system, have it break in three years (such as you say it will) and then hopefully by then emulation for DC will be further along?
     
  7. DigitalDuck

    DigitalDuck

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    <!--quoteo(post=514647:date=Oct 7 2010, 07:24 PM:name=Friend of Sonic)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Friend of Sonic @ Oct 7 2010, 07:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=514647"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->OP, why not buy a system, have it break in three years (such as you say it will) and then hopefully by then emulation for DC will be further along?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    If it'll last three years. I could buy another Dreamcast, I suppose. Maybe when I have enough, I'll use the dead ones to make a domino run.
     
  8. Friend of Sonic

    Friend of Sonic

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    <!--quoteo(post=514652:date=Oct 7 2010, 11:31 AM:name=DigitalDuck)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DigitalDuck @ Oct 7 2010, 11:31 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=514652"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=514647:date=Oct 7 2010, 07:24 PM:name=Friend of Sonic)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Friend of Sonic @ Oct 7 2010, 07:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=514647"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->OP, why not buy a system, have it break in three years (such as you say it will) and then hopefully by then emulation for DC will be further along?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    If it'll last three years. I could buy another Dreamcast, I suppose. Maybe when I have enough, I'll use the dead ones to make a domino run.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Haha.

    It's recommended you pick up one made earlier than 2000 something. In the US ones at least, they used higher quality Hitachi drives.
     
  9. null1024

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    You are probably not going to get full speed on a lot of games with that setup [although the sole bottleneck might just be the integrated video on my machine, but the rest of the specs you described are very similar to what I have, if you have a separate graphics card, disregard this post entirely].

    Senko no Ronde runs 60fps for me, but is the only game I have that runs at that speed [NullDC Naomi, but the hardware is pretty much a slightly upgraded Dreamcast]. Ikaruga runs at ~30-50fps [it chugs a lot, almost unplayable] and Triggerheart Exelica runs at 40+ fps [barely playable, usually sticks itself at 50fps, but likes to drop]. Not even going to try SA1 because the PC version runs at ~30fps, not too much hope to see if the DC version will fare any better.
     
  10. Conan Kudo

    Conan Kudo

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    <!--quoteo(post=512789:date=Oct 1 2010, 05:20 PM:name=SegaLoco)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SegaLoco @ Oct 1 2010, 05:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=512789"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ehh, it's still VERY windows oriented, and 1. I am not gonna set up a Visual Studio environment for that crap, and 2. An overhaul to portable code would take quite a while, and I'm sure the team is already working on that...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    That is assuming these people think logically. Read <a href="http://code.google.com/p/nulldc/issues/detail?id=23" target="_blank">this</a>, and see how they've committed to NOT having cross platform support on the PC.
     
  11. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    How is that illogical? Pig-headed and stubborn maybe, but I dunno about it being illogical.
     
  12. AamirM

    AamirM

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    <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That is assuming these people think logically. Read this, and see how they've committed to NOT having cross platform support on the PC.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I didn't see anything there which indicated that they "committed" to not being cross platform. It's open source. Why don't you go ahead and (help) port it to Linux then? The main developer even said that he will accept the port. Oh wait, it's so easy to bitch at developers and just preach the holy Linux.

    If someone cared enough about Linux, we'd have a Linux port already.
     
  13. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    Agreed. But still, can someone explain to me why Linux is held on such a high pedestal by programmers?
     
  14. Overlord

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    Likely because (a) most coders use it as their own OS and (b) it's about the only mainstream(ish) OS they can add code to. Oh, and it being legally free helps.
     
  15. Xkeeper

    Xkeeper

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    <!--quoteo(post=515121:date=Oct 9 2010, 02:43 AM:name=AamirM)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AamirM @ Oct 9 2010, 02:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=515121"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That is assuming these people think logically. Read this, and see how they've committed to NOT having cross platform support on the PC.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I didn't see anything there which indicated that they "committed" to not being cross platform. It's open source. Why don't you go ahead and (help) port it to Linux then? The main developer even said that he will accept the port. Oh wait, it's so easy to bitch at developers and just preach the holy Linux.

    If someone cared enough about Linux, we'd have a Linux port already.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    And if you read the comments, none of the developers use or deal with Linux.

    I was always under the impression that having it open source meant you could go ahead and add it yourself?


    Re: the Linux thing... who knows. It's great as a server, but I continue to find desktop Linux a waste of time.
     
  16. Meat Miracle

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    <!--quoteo(post=515121:date=Oct 9 2010, 02:43 AM:name=AamirM)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AamirM @ Oct 9 2010, 02:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=515121"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Oh wait, it's so easy to bitch at developers and just preach the holy Linux.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Sir, you've just made my day.
     
  17. Bartman3010

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    Its strange to me that Dreamcast emulation has been at such a standstill compared to the miraculous progress made between certain emulators. Hell, Sega Saturn emulation is at full speed with stunning accuracy and yet nullDC just recently got game pad support. For a system thats supposed to be touted as the pinnacle of Sega's console development, its still far behind of what it should be doing. What they got done with it is okay. You can still save progress and theres rudamentary keyboard and mouse support for the games that make use of those accessories. But it still has a way to go.

    I tried using nullDC, and it can run games decently, although there'll be plenty of graphical errors, and none of the games I ran (Sonic Adventure 2, Quake 3, Looney Tunes Space Race) and they all work. Quake 3's splitscreen mode doesnt work properly for some reason. Outside of that. They work decently. I cant change the screen resolution without the emulator crashing, and I cant get 60 frames per second on Sonic Adventure 2 for some reason.

    Overall, its just 'okay' but you'll be better off sticking to an actual system.
     
  18. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    That's because there isn't as much nostalgia factor on the Dreamcast. A lot of the Dreamcast's best games were faithfully ported and even upgraded to other systems. I'm waiting on Dreamcast emulation to pick up myself, so that the dreamcast can get some 720p treatment of it's own.
     
  19. Meat Miracle

    Meat Miracle

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    <!--quoteo(post=527226:date=Nov 8 2010, 08:33 AM:name=Bartman3010)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bartman3010 @ Nov 8 2010, 08:33 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=527226"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Its strange to me that Dreamcast emulation has been at such a standstill compared to the miraculous progress made between certain emulators. Hell, Sega Saturn emulation is at full speed with stunning accuracy and yet nullDC just recently got game pad support. For a system thats supposed to be touted as the pinnacle of Sega's console development, its still far behind of what it should be doing. What they got done with it is okay. You can still save progress and theres rudamentary keyboard and mouse support for the games that make use of those accessories. But it still has a way to go.

    I tried using nullDC, and it can run games decently, although there'll be plenty of graphical errors, and none of the games I ran (Sonic Adventure 2, Quake 3, Looney Tunes Space Race) and they all work. Quake 3's splitscreen mode doesnt work properly for some reason. Outside of that. They work decently. I cant change the screen resolution without the emulator crashing, and I cant get 60 frames per second on Sonic Adventure 2 for some reason.

    Overall, its just 'okay' but you'll be better off sticking to an actual system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Saturn emulation progressed faster because there were 1-2-3 emulators that got constantly worked on.

    DC is progressing slower because NullDC wasn't even looked upon for half a decade, and the other emulators that surpassed it have been busy with NAOMI related hijinx (cracking protections and emulating the t&l in naomi2, etc). Still, Makaron and Demul should be both waaaaaaaay beyond NullDC now.

    Also, DC emulation hit a brick wall is because they are using hardware acceleration, and d3d can't really get many of the powervr kinks right. DirectX11 will fix some of that, but that can only happen if the emulator authors buy new cards and upgrade their OS.
     
  20. Aerosol

    Aerosol

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    I wasn't aware of either Makaron of Demul being better than NullDC. I didn't know about the "powervr kinks" either. Would OpenGL be a better API for them to use?