Confirmed: Michael Jackson DID compose music for Sonic 3

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by jmr, Dec 3, 2009.

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  1. OKei

    OKei

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    Finally, after years of getting someone official to say "he did it", we've finally had said someone close to him come forward. This made my freaking day, month, and possibly, year.

    This means that <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1_mNirAgC0" target="_blank">this</a> and <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbVM-l2Oku4" target="_blank">that</a>, weren't for nothing. =)
     
  2. Mobiethian

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    Since I found out about MJ's connection with Sonic 3, I was somewhat convinced that the mini boss music sounded like an MJ song.
     
  3. Dude

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    The sad part is that none of this will bring him back =[
     
  4. Andlabs

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    Writing my own MD/Genesis sound driver :D
    <!--quoteo(post=380444:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:01 PM:name=Tweaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweaker @ Dec 2 2009, 10:01 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380444"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->(...commentary proving that I was more shortsighted than I thought you all were...)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Huh. Is there really an image to keep protected anymore? I will never understand fully how a company works...
    But yes, I discredited the rest of his commentary based solely on having not heard the final soundtrack. I'm still a little bit skeptical, but I'll just wait to see how this all unfolds.
     
  5. Guys, random stupid thought -

    If Jackson wasn't pleased with how his music was sounding in Sonic 3, what did he feel about the Moonwalker video game?
     
  6. evilhamwizard

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    While I guess it's cool that someone who worked with MJ is actually confirming it this time - sadly I personally didn't learn new facts because of the interview. It sucks that he never played the game, but at least someone else can say the same thing. I believe (personally of course) that we'll know more than what Brad told the magazine when Yuji Naka starts to talk about it.

    Also, just note. The whole thing about MJ discrediting his name from the game is an assumption (keyword in the interview being "If"), because he already stated that he never knew MJ wasn't credited surprisingly up until now - due to the fact that he never played the game once. So there can still be a debate as to how he was excluded from the credits list. IMO - I can almost believe what Brux said. But when you think about the stories of MJ + Sega in the past (in this case, the Sega-16 article), MJ already knew what the sound hardware was capable of otherwise he wouldn't have had a partnership with Sega. Even at the Megadrive's earliest stages where sound wasn't even up to par (ala Moonwalker) Michael knew about what the Megadrive can or cannot do. So, I guess Brad might be wrong here as well. BUT AGAIN, my opinion - so it's not fact...yet.

    So what the actual development cycle for the making music for the game is now a little more clear. My guess is that Michael would relay chords and notes to people like Brad/etc (people who weren't credited under "Sega Sound Team"), and the people like Brad would arrange demo tracks using synthesizer and send them to the Sega Sound Team to be arranged by a Japanese team who knew how to work with the sound driver/hardware to put it in the game. When the music is initially inserted into the game, it would normally be a lot like the rough demo (based on my personal knowledge of sound development) and then would gradually take form as the game progresses. Which would be a possible reason as to why Roger Hector (I think) was confused with the fact that Michael Jackson's music was in the game at some point - because maybe it always was but became differently arranged by the Sega Sound Team with time.

    I hope that made sense.

    ps: I don't know what MJ would've been thinking if it's true that he didn't like how his music was being represented. I thought Sonic 3/3D used the Z80 the best, in my opinion.
     
  7. <!--quoteo(post=380447:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:04 PM:name=Tweaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweaker @ Dec 2 2009, 10:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380447"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380446:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:03 PM:name=jmr)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jmr @ Dec 2 2009, 10:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380446"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380403:date=Dec 2 2009, 06:34 PM:name=Andlabs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andlabs @ Dec 2 2009, 06:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380403"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What I do find funny: neither Buxer nor Drossin played S3K; I wonder if there's something else going on or what.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Someone really needs to send these people a copy of the game, or at the very least the soundtrack. :P
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Totally agreed! We should definitely try and get in contact with Buxer and show him the Sonic 3 soundtrack for more clarification.

    What I always found interesting was a line said by Tom Payne when we interviewed him at SAGE: "I don't play games; I just make them." Something tells me this mentality is more commonplace than we seem to think.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    In all honesty it really seems that way. I don't think it's nearly as common now, but back then was pretty much the real start of video games. There were a lot of people who were making something that had never been made before so of course they didn't play games as much. They had to make them first! Granted this is a time when some games were already available (arcades and NES, etc) but might not have been popular enough or accepted enough to inspire a career. Of course these days every kid on the block who's played a little too much Xbox wants to make video games because it's a much more valid job choice in today's society.


    <!--quoteo(post=380463:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:47 PM:name=Kiddo Cabbusses)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kiddo Cabbusses @ Dec 2 2009, 10:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380463"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Guys, random stupid thought -

    If Jackson wasn't pleased with how his music was sounding in Sonic 3, what did he feel about the Moonwalker video game?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    As far as we know, the Moonwalker game was mostly MJ's brain child for a video game. He worked very closely with those that were making the game to ensure it came out exactly how he wanted. Did it? Maybe not 100%, but he was obviously more pleased with it then Sonic 3's music. It's also kind of a different situation since he was just translating songs he already did to the Genesis instead of writing entirely new material.

    That being said, this makes me curious how hard he was working on the still upcoming Michael Jackson game that started production before he passed away. The last time the developers spoke about it, the game was still in line to be finished because any required voice or audio work from Jackson was done.
     
  8. Lobotomy

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    Well, fuck me, some confirmation. Also, Sonic 3's ending theme is the base for Stranger in Moscow. Awesome.



    <!--quoteo(post=380405:date=Dec 2 2009, 06:35 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Dec 2 2009, 06:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380405"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Confirmed: SEGA Genesis has a shitty Soundchip. Super Nintendo reigns supreme yet again.

    Eat it Genesis fags.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Also, suck my dick, Genesis had better games. >:(
     
  9. Shadix

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    <!--quoteo(post=380429:date=Dec 2 2009, 08:48 PM:name=Spexfox)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Spexfox @ Dec 2 2009, 08:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380429"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380415:date=Dec 2 2009, 09:41 PM:name=NiktheGreek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NiktheGreek @ Dec 2 2009, 09:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380415"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Guy confirms that work was done by Michael Jackson, but is unsure as to how much (if any) was kept.

    Of course, Roger Hector already confirmed that Wacko worked on music for Sonic 3. Two years ago.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Well yes and no. He mentioned that he had worked on it but said that all of the music was scrapped from it and that it was due to the lawsuit MJ was facing. This isn't the case though as we can see. There's absolutely music in Sonic 3 that MJ worked on but who knows if the lawsuit is what stopped him from putting in credits or his taste.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    <b>To be fair though, SHOULDN'T Roger Hector know what was going on with the music more than Buxer would since he was overseeing it?</b> This also contradicts the firsthand testimony of Howard Drossin, who was the musician that Roger brought in to rewrite the music following the scandal. Add to the fact thats it possible given the nature of his work that he never was filled in about SEGA backing out from the music, and MJ could've told that to Buxer to save face.

    Theres alot of possibilities as to why the music didn't actually end up getting replaced. The scandal broke out literally months before Sonic 3's release. It could be as simple as missed deadlines or unsatisfaction with Drossin's pieces.


    I mean, I'm not saying it's not possible thats the case, but the odds are favored against Buxer's story.
     
  10. Tanks

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    <!--quoteo(post=380414:date=Dec 2 2009, 06:40 PM:name=Super)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Super @ Dec 2 2009, 06:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380414"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380405:date=Dec 2 2009, 09:35 PM:name=Chimpo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chimpo @ Dec 2 2009, 09:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380405"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Confirmed: SEGA Genesis has a shitty Soundchip. Super Nintendo reigns supreme yet again.

    Eat it Genesis fags.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Mega Drive.

    Anyway, this is pretty cool - and I love how it comes out so nonchalantly. Now, Qjimbo just needs to make one last edit to his years-old video and he's pretty much done with that project...
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    No, Genesis.

    Anyway, yea. Finally glad to hear that MJ did the music. I have new pants. I'll be sending the bill to Tweaker momentarily. I might be double charging him though since my asian porn just finished downloading.
     
  11. Heran Bago

    Heran Bago

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    Hah. I knew it was only a matter of time before we heard. Good to get the confirmation.
     
  12. PicklePower

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    I updated the wiki (<a href="http://info.sonicretro.org/Michael Jackson" target="_blank" style="background: url(http://info.sonicretro.org/images/5/50/Reticon.png) right no-repeat; padding-right: 20px; border-bottom: 1px dotted #3366BB; color: #3366BB; cursor:pointer; text-decoration:none;" class="wiki">Michael Jackson</a>) with this new interview and what information we've learned from it. It would be nice to learn more about the magazine (I'm having trouble finding out about it on the internet for some reason), and if possible, get a scan of it.
     
  13. Qjimbo

    Qjimbo

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    Updated my video with annotations, bit intrusive but you can always disable them for the "classic" experience.
     
  14. Phos

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    <!--quoteo(post=380471:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:05 PM:name=Spexfox)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Spexfox @ Dec 2 2009, 10:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380471"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380447:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:04 PM:name=Tweaker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweaker @ Dec 2 2009, 10:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380447"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380446:date=Dec 2 2009, 10:03 PM:name=jmr)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jmr @ Dec 2 2009, 10:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380446"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=380403:date=Dec 2 2009, 06:34 PM:name=Andlabs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Andlabs @ Dec 2 2009, 06:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=380403"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What I do find funny: neither Buxer nor Drossin played S3K; I wonder if there's something else going on or what.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->Someone really needs to send these people a copy of the game, or at the very least the soundtrack. :P
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Totally agreed! We should definitely try and get in contact with Buxer and show him the Sonic 3 soundtrack for more clarification.

    What I always found interesting was a line said by Tom Payne when we interviewed him at SAGE: "I don't play games; I just make them." Something tells me this mentality is more commonplace than we seem to think.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    In all honesty it really seems that way. I don't think it's nearly as common now, but back then was pretty much the real start of video games. There were a lot of people who were making something that had never been made before so of course they didn't play games as much. They had to make them first! Granted this is a time when some games were already available (arcades and NES, etc) but might not have been popular enough or accepted enough to inspire a career. Of course these days every kid on the block who's played a little too much Xbox wants to make video games because it's a much more valid job choice in today's society.

    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Well, in Tom Payne's case, he's an artist who didn't even know what video games were before he took the job. Musicians and artist might be more interested in the unique challenges that video games present. One of the professor's at SMU's Guildhall doesn't play games, he's just interested in the unique way they have to be written, and Shun Nakamura wouldn't have heard his music in game on his own, he said in an interview that he's not very good at it.

    I find it kind of funny that MJ doesn't like the way his music sounds in this game, considering he used so much synth anyway. The Genesis sound chip also makes sounds that other devices tend not to, ones that I find uniquely beautiful... Unless they used GEMS.
     
  15. Toasty

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    In other news: Qjimbo's video on Sonic 3's music has almost 2 million views! Holy shit!

    This is great news, although I don't think anyone doubted his involvement. It was pretty obvious from Carnival Night, Ice Cap, credits, and Launch Base.
     
  16. Qjimbo

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    Yeah after MJs death it went from about 1 million to 2 million. Kinda insane to say the least :P
     
  17. Ha! If it weren't for Needlemouse, this would be the most exciting Sonic news in about half a decade.

    Still pretty exciting, mind you.
     
  18. Phos

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    QJimbo is officially internet famous.

    I just noticed that sound that plays when you lock onto the Area 4 boss in Rez makes a sound similar to the record scratching in Jam.
     
  19. Ayla

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    I didn't know there was really any doubt, but confirmation is always a nice feeling. Coolies.
     
  20. TmEE

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    I guess the info is psreading now and soon sonic3 will cost 100USD on ebay after a while........... I already have my complete sonic3 so I don't care, hahahahahahaa
     
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