Character Art

Discussion in 'Sonic 2 HD (Archive)' started by Vincent, Mar 22, 2010.

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  1. zemulii

    zemulii

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    Since there hasn't been much action around here lately...

    Well I've been trying to get to grips with Illustrator. So I thought it would be good practice to start by trying to vectorize my chicken.

    This is what I've got so far...

    <img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/ofuh5l.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    Concept: <img src="http://i39.tinypic.com/1nz0ar.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    I'd rather not post it at game size just yet as it's reeeeally small and at that size the pixels look terrible (seems to work better when I scale it down in Photoshop... Illustrator makes it too sharp or something and it actually loses detail...) so I guess there's a lot of optimisation to be done there. It's been a lot more difficult than I thought it would be but that's probably just due to my inexperience. Anyway it's obviously unfinished.

    One thing that irritates me is that when I use clipping masks to shade (don't know if that's the usual way, but it seems to work) the edges look terrible. That is until I use "save for web" and it seems the output is a lot higher quality. But when I'm working on the file, I can see the colour underneath on the edge (know what I mean?) and it's pretty off-putting. Is there any way I can have a higher quality "preview" while I'm working? Little things like that really make my blood boil :P.
     
  2. Vincent

    Vincent

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    To preview the actual pixel aspect, Illustrator has a very handy option called pixel preview mode. (view-->pixel preview)

    My AI setup method:

    -Add a <a href="http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/7756/sfondoxb.png" target="_blank">light green color BG</a> layer and lock it.
    -Add a new layer to place both concepts and original frame, then lock it.
    -Add a new layer and put there all your vector work.
    -Be sure your vector work at 100% zoom is the exact same size as the original frame.
    -Add new shapes on top of the others instead of nasty clipping masks.
    -Enable pixel preview to adjust them to look pixel perfect (zoom back to 100% to give it a final check)

    That's it.
     
  3. zemulii

    zemulii

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    <!--quoteo(post=442700:date=Apr 16 2010, 01:46 AM:name=Vincent)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Vincent @ Apr 16 2010, 01:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=442700"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->To preview the actual pixel aspect, Illustrator has a very handy option called pixel preview mode. (view-->pixel preview)

    My AI setup method:

    -Add a <a href="http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/7756/sfondoxb.png" target="_blank">light green color BG</a> layer and lock it.
    -Add a new layer to place both concepts and original frame, then lock it.
    -Add a new layer and put there all your vector work.
    -Be sure your vector work at 100% zoom is the exact same size as the original frame.
    -Add new shapes on top of the others instead of nasty clipping masks.
    -Enable pixel preview to adjust them to look pixel perfect (zoom back to 100% to give it a final check)

    That's it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Up to the bit about clipping masks, that's exactly what I've been doing actually :) (apart from using a blueish-turqouise background). Yeah the clipping masks... I have been wondering about them. The only thing is... I obssess with getting all the edges to line up perfectly and when I add shades, it was the only way I could find to keep them within the bounds of the original shape without too much hassle. They do look tacky when you view "outlines" but I can look past that at least. Is there another way to get everything to line up perfectly? I know I'm probably being a bit pedantic about it all... especially considering minor things like that won't be seen at it's actual size.

    I intend to do all my pixel perfect adjustments <I>when/if</I> it gets to the stage that I can consider it up to scratch. So far it's just practice/experimentation, as I haven't really decided on how I'm going to get the shading done just yet. I've read all the tutorials, but I'm still not totally comfortable with working in vector. So I'll just see how I go :).
     
  4. Volpino

    Volpino

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    I hope this isn't entirely off-topic but I thought it would best be placed here...

    <img src="http://sanik.hacking-cult.org/inker/data/1237075329UBER-Stand2.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    Even though up close it looks like a hastily-drawn example up close, I wanted to know, is there anyone working on Tails? Is this going to be made into his final sprite if not?
     
  5. Gambit

    Gambit

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    At the moment nobody is working on Tails (or Knuckles) because Sonic is still being polished up and everyone else is working on their own thing. As for whether or not that sprite is going to be the final or not I can't tell you for certain since I'm not in charge of the character art, but I have a feeling it'll change some. I'm sure Vincent will be along soon to tell you more.
     
  6. Hamneggs

    Hamneggs

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    <!--quoteo(post=445141:date=Apr 20 2010, 03:30 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 03:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445141"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://sanik.hacking-cult.org/inker/data/1237075329UBER-Stand2.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    <!--quoteo(post=445187:date=Apr 20 2010, 04:21 PM:name=Gambit)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Gambit @ Apr 20 2010, 04:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445187"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->At the moment nobody is working on Tails (or Knuckles) because Sonic is still being polished up and everyone else is working on their own thing. As for whether or not that sprite is going to be the final or not I can't tell you for certain since I'm not in charge of the character art, but I have a feeling it'll change some. I'm sure Vincent will be along soon to tell you more.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Indeed it should change. The shading at the base of his chest's white hair makes it look like he is either wearing a plain of snow or a marshmallow.
     
  7. Vincent

    Vincent

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    As Gambit anticipated, Tails and Knuckles remasterings hasn't started yet.
    If any community artist wants to provide mockups of him, they are much welcome! ;)
     
  8. Volpino

    Volpino

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    <!--quoteo(post=445314:date=Apr 20 2010, 07:25 PM:name=Vincent)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Vincent @ Apr 20 2010, 07:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445314"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As Gambit anticipated, Tails and Knuckles remasterings hasn't started yet.
    If any community artist wants to provide mockups of him, they are much welcome! ;)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I actually started doing these sprites before I realized I didn't have a vector program or a way to draw in vector at the time, so I abandoned it, but I did this based on an older submission that used to be up on the site if you wouldn't mind considering it a 'mockup', if it helps...

    <img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    It's shaded with Paint Shop's basic pallet. All the others I have are sketches not shaded or in pieces. (His limbs are literally everywhere.) I didn't realize his tails weren't supposed to be ground-level with his feet until I looked at Sonic 2 again. Before, I was going off the sprites which have his body and tails as separate sprites, just to say that I know it's wrong on this one.

    But about the one posted, I actually wanted to give some feedback on what I thought of it... But when I looked at the larger image closer I realized "Hey, this isn't even cleaned up!" but I did want to bring up something about the representation of the character himself, if that's alright...

    He's smiling. This bothers me because in the old games, I never imagined Tails would be smiling. What gave me this impression, especially when he's at top speed, flying back to Sonic or swimming on Sonic 3, was that he either looked tired, nervous or like he's trying to be brave. This was re-enforced by some Sonic 2 concept art (Sketched) that showed him running (the wobbly little canter he does before he spins his tails for speed) and his face had an '=o' expression, like he was either exerting energy running after Sonic or like he was saying in his mind "I gotta be brave" and then to the right of that it showed him at full speed, tails spinning and all, and he has the '>=(' face, the serious one, and the games did reflect that in his top speed sprite. So I feel like him smiling takes away from his character at that point in his life.

    I did read a topic posted about how some thought Sonic shouldn't smile in his sprites, and how, in his official art, he would always be smiling like a cocky little bastard, and how it fit his character more and I agree: I think all the Sonic sprites are fantastic in representing Sonic, so this isn't a 'The characters never smiled in the games" statement, since it's a little hard to tell on pixels what they were doing (Even though I think Sonic 3's Sonic sprite looked like he was having a ball throughout the entire game, until he died, because I suck.) but I'm just basing this off what expressions I could read (open mouth while Tails flies in Sonic 2's sprites) and the concept art. I need to find it again, it used to be up on Sonic Stadium but all the images from that site are gone.

    Edit: And they never put them back up. Maybe SEGA made a property claim?

    Anyway, I know what the boxart of him looks like, but after digging through Sonic Retro's archive, I found some artwork that has him looking nervous or uncertain while Sonic maintains his smile. <a href="http://info.sonicretro.org/images/4/43/OOZ_sonic_tails_art.jpg" target="_blank">This is only one.</a>

    It's just one of my concerns though, and I hope it will be considered when someone starts work on his final sprites.
     
  9. <!--quoteo(post=445334:date=Apr 20 2010, 08:09 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 08:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445334"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I really like this new direction...
     
  10. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    I... really don't, sorry. Looks like he's melting or something.



    Since work still hasn't started regarding Tails, and the art direction is leaning more towards the official artwork now, it would be interesting to have a Tails sprite in that same position, but with the correct proportions. It might not look too good in HD having his legs look so short and chubby only when standing still.

    Here's some examples to refresh your memories.
    <a href="http://img217.imageshack.us/I/tails1.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8264/tails1.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a> <a href="http://img228.imageshack.us/I/tails4.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/574/tails4.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
     
  11. Volpino

    Volpino

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    <!--quoteo(post=445567:date=Apr 21 2010, 09:39 AM:name=ICEknight)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ICEknight @ Apr 21 2010, 09:39 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445567"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I... really don't, sorry. Looks like he's melting or something.



    Since work still hasn't started regarding Tails, and the art direction is leaning more towards the official artwork now, it would be interesting to have a Tails sprite in that same position, but with the correct proportions. It might not look too good in HD having his legs look so short and chubby only when standing still.

    Here's some examples to refresh your memories.
    <a href="http://img217.imageshack.us/I/tails1.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8264/tails1.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a> <a href="http://img228.imageshack.us/I/tails4.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/574/tails4.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The links don't work and don't show up in the post.

    It's an old sprite, and it's done in pixels, so it looks odd. I only posted it to show what I thought his expression would look like in-game, when not trying to look excited or at-his-best on the title screen.

    <!--quoteo(post=445262:date=Apr 20 2010, 06:21 PM:name=Hamneggs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hamneggs @ Apr 20 2010, 06:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445262"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Indeed it should change. The shading at the base of his chest's white hair makes it look like he is either wearing a plain of snow or a marshmallow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Sorry, I missed this at first. I agree, it doesn't look like the stomach curves with his body, his eyes are too small, his ears' shading makes them look polygonal and a little small and the glare on his head is a little light... The lightest glare he had was a light yellow, but not white.

    But it's only a test apparently. I'm just throwing this out there.
     
  12. RedStripedShoes

    RedStripedShoes

    And I'm gone again. Member
    <!--quoteo(post=445334:date=Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445334"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I burst out laughing when I saw that. That was just great.
     
  13. Volpino

    Volpino

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    A secret. >:3
    <!--quoteo(post=445627:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM:name=RedStripedShoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RedStripedShoes @ Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445627"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445334:date=Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445334"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I burst out laughing when I saw that. That was just great.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Was it funny in a way that doesn't reflect badly on me? :v:
     
  14. RedStripedShoes

    RedStripedShoes

    And I'm gone again. Member
    <!--quoteo(post=445631:date=Apr 21 2010, 11:52 AM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 21 2010, 11:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445631"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445627:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM:name=RedStripedShoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RedStripedShoes @ Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445627"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445334:date=Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445334"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I burst out laughing when I saw that. That was just great.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Was it funny in a way that doesn't reflect badly on me? :v:
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    What? I was just saying it was a funny picture.

    EDIT: Sorry, just realized that my post could be easily misconstrued. I was talking about the expression on his face. He's got these great big puppy dog eyes and this pout that makes him look so fragile and helpless, and it makes me laugh to think about watching the game start up, and seeing Tails with that sort of face.

    Tails: "Mistew Sonic, I'm scawed."
    Sonic: "They're just floating rings, Tails. They won't hurt you."
     
  15. Canned Karma

    Canned Karma

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    I'm pretty sure that when it's time to focus on Tails, more attention will be given to the concept art like ICEknight posted up. Energetic, dynamic Tails works far better than Deer-in-the-headlights, chubby Tails.
     
  16. Elratauru

    Elratauru

    Little Shiny Emurralds Member
    <!--quoteo(post=445634:date=Apr 21 2010, 01:55 PM:name=RedStripedShoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RedStripedShoes @ Apr 21 2010, 01:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445634"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Tails: "Mistew Sonic, I'm scawed."
    Sonic: "They're just floating rings, Tails. They won't hurt you."<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    QFTW. Just awesome.
     
  17. ICEknight

    ICEknight

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    <!--quoteo(post=445626:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:42 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 21 2010, 12:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445626"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The links don't work and don't show up in the post.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Let's try again...
    <a href="http://img517.imageshack.us/I/tails1.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/8264/tails1.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a> <a href="http://img340.imageshack.us/I/tails4.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/574/tails4.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
     
  18. Compsense

    Compsense

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    Just change the capital 'I's in the links (at /I/) to lowercase 'I's. The forum automatically changes the letter 'I' to uppercase - or so I've heard - breaking some imageshack links as a result.
     
  19. —eff I May..?
     
  20. Volpino

    Volpino

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    <!--quoteo(post=445874:date=Apr 21 2010, 06:03 PM:name=ICEknight)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ICEknight @ Apr 21 2010, 06:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445874"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445626:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:42 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 21 2010, 12:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445626"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The links don't work and don't show up in the post.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Let's try again...
    <a href="http://img517.imageshack.us/I/tails1.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/8264/tails1.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a> <a href="http://img340.imageshack.us/I/tails4.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/574/tails4.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Right. I should have thought of that since I have too much Tails official art clogging my hard drive.

    I never intended to come off as if I thought the official artwork was a bad example, just that Tails smiling in his sprites looked strange, especially since there are some sprites in Sonic 2 and 3 that suggest he doesn't smile. His 'sign' in Sonic 3 even represented him as having an indifferent face, and it's not just because of the limits of pixels since in the bonus stage mini games his icon is smiling.

    <img src="http://i43.tinypic.com/6iz5o6.png" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    If I need more than that, I can provide it, but I'll stop there so it doesn't look like I'm driving the same nail into a wall that doesn't need any more.

    <!--quoteo(post=445922:date=Apr 21 2010, 07:04 PM:name=subsubstantive)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (subsubstantive @ Apr 21 2010, 07:04 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445922"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->—eff I May..?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Sure, I take it as a compliment, even though that picture is old it's nice to know someone found a use for it.

    <!--quoteo(post=445634:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:55 PM:name=RedStripedShoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RedStripedShoes @ Apr 21 2010, 12:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445634"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445631:date=Apr 21 2010, 11:52 AM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 21 2010, 11:52 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445631"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445627:date=Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM:name=RedStripedShoes)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RedStripedShoes @ Apr 21 2010, 12:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445627"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo(post=445334:date=Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM:name=Volpino)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Volpino @ Apr 20 2010, 07:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=445334"><img src="public/style_images/retro/snapback.png"></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/rbi58n.png" border="0" class="linked-image" /><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I burst out laughing when I saw that. That was just great.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Was it funny in a way that doesn't reflect badly on me? :v:
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    What? I was just saying it was a funny picture.

    EDIT: Sorry, just realized that my post could be easily misconstrued. I was talking about the expression on his face. He's got these great big puppy dog eyes and this pout that makes him look so fragile and helpless, and it makes me laugh to think about watching the game start up, and seeing Tails with that sort of face.

    Tails: "Mistew Sonic, I'm scawed."
    Sonic: "They're just floating rings, Tails. They won't hurt you."
    <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    That last bit made me laugh, but that was what I was going for. To me, he looks very nervous in his sprites with the big cute eyes and the often indifferent expression on his face. He wasn't meant to look helpless though, just nervous and uncertain. If I ever manage to make some of these freeware programs work, I'll keep in mind not to give him puppy eyes again and not to trace the sprites exactly. (Or copy old pictures from Sonic Retro that weere replaced by newer ones. :v:)
     
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