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Cancelled SegaSonic game SegaSonic Bros. (1992) found

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by TimmiT, Feb 4, 2016.

  1. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    Sonic's colors also look kinda similar:
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  2. Lanzer

    Lanzer

    The saber calls for its master... Member
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    Living life.
    God soo behind on the developments of this.

    So wait, this game is out now? last I heard this game was never going to be released by the owner?

    And what's this about Sonic 3 music being in this game that pre-dates it?!
     
  3. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    And it wasn't. This is not the dump from the original board but rather it was altered so that it would work in a multi-game board, then extracted from there.

    There's also some music from other SEGA games and stuff which came afterwards, so it seems like SEGA may have had a vault of pre-made music since at least 1991.
     
  4. nineko

    nineko

    I am the Holy Cat Tech Member
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    For what it's worth, some instruments in Sonic 3's "universal voice bank" are identical to some instruments used in Sonic 1 songs, so there's that, at least.
     
  5. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    Oh my, things may be starting to come together. Do we know if these also use the universal voice bank?

     
  6. RyogaMasaki

    RyogaMasaki

    0xffffffff Oldbie
    I think this is a very important point we need to keep in mind, from both a research and preservation standpoint. This will get around very quickly as the 'proper' dump when that's not actually the case.

    Ice, I saw you mention this earlier. What's your source on that info?
     
  7. Clownacy

    Clownacy

    Tech Member
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    What, this game's driver? No. S3K's driver is the only one I know of with a voice bank like that. It might be worth noting, even in S3K, the special stage music doesn't use the UVB.
     
  8. nineko

    nineko

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    Yeah, I didn't mean this song or these songs specifically. I just meant that some instruments in the UVB are the same as some instruments in some Sonic 1 songs. Possibly Sonic 2, too, but I don't have experience in that field.
     
  9. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    The MAME team.

    They were understandably pissed off at the leak, by the way.
     
  10. RyogaMasaki

    RyogaMasaki

    0xffffffff Oldbie
    Just got back to Japan and the first thing I did when I got home was disassemble SSB, hehe.

    Here's a quick MAME cheat to enable the alternate title screen menu that evilhamwizard posted about previously:
    Code (Text):
    1.  
    2.   <cheat desc="Use alternate main menu">
    3.     <comment>Unused alternate menu on the title screen; displayed after a coin is inserted; display is somewhat buggy</comment>
    4.     <script state="on">
    5.       <action>[email protected]</action>
    6.       <action>[email protected]=4e71</action>
    7.     </script>
    8.     <script state="off">
    9.       <action>[email protected]=temp0</action>
    10.     </script>
    11.   </cheat>
    12.  
    As evilhamwizard pointed out, there is a check on the player button input for a value that is not normally possible for the hardware, followed by an unconditional branch skipping over the jump to the alternate menu. This cheat just NOPs out the branch so it always goes to the alternate menu regardless.
     
  11. Okay, next question: Why exactly does such an altered version exist? Especially considering most "multigame" boards, like the 60-in-1 or the Pandora's Box, are unlicensed bootleg material?

    Was this planned to be an arcade version of the Socks the Cat malarky all over again?
     
  12. RyogaMasaki

    RyogaMasaki

    0xffffffff Oldbie
    I'm guessing it was modified for and dumped from California Arcade Extreme where it was available for play.

    http://segabits.com/blog/2018/07/25/rare-segasonic-bros-arcade-prototype-to-be-playable-at-california-extreme-this-weekend/
     
  13. While that is a theoretical possibility it sounds kinda... I dunno, hokey? If they were not gonna have the authentic PCB at that event, why not just a ROM on emulator on PC?
     
  14. RyogaMasaki

    RyogaMasaki

    0xffffffff Oldbie
    I created a text table for the custom encoding used in the game. Looks like there were more entries in that options menu:
    Code (Text):
    1.  
    2. 1P GAME LEVEL
    3. 1P EMERALD LEVEL
    4. 1P GASS TIME
    5. 2P GAME LEVEL
    6. 2P EMERALD LEVEL
    7. 2P GASS TIME
    8. LANGUAGE
    9. LEVEL TIME
    10. LEVEL B RANKUPTIME
    11. LEVEL C RANKUPTIME
    12. RANK ATIME
    13. RANK BTIME
    14. LEVELUP KAKOMI CNT
    15. CHIMA RANKUP SPEED
    16. LEVEL SPEED
    17. HI SCORE
    18. KEY TEST
    19. MUSIC TEST
    20. KOUHO TIME
    21. EME LEVEL
    22. NEXT BLK WAIT
    23. EXIT
    24.  
    Here's the (somewhat incomplete) text table: https://pastebin.com/g6MAysxc

    Also shamelessly plugging my twitter where I post this stuff first: https://twitter.com/suddendesu

    EDIT: And at 0x746C we have this: ORIGINAL GAME CONCEPT BY MTJ

    I believe that's the first mention of Mitsuji Fukio's name in the game.
     
  15. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    Neither Shoutime nor California Extreme nor any members of the MAME team are related in any way to this leak.

    Also, due to the leak and the attention it got, we'll probably not see other similar games that we may have never even heard about.
     
  16. biggestsonicfan

    biggestsonicfan

    Model2wannaB Tech Member
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    I didn't think it would be related at all, as the cabinet Shoutime used malfunctioned during the expo, and did not appear to be a multi-game cabinet.

    Also, one step forward and a million steps back for the public preservation of these gems... :(
     
  17. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    It's not even properly preserved. Not just because some of the ROMs may differ from the original but, as far as I know, the board wasn't even documented and I suspect that certain bugs like the odd credits behavior may be due to that.

    EDIT: See below.
     
  18. RyogaMasaki

    RyogaMasaki

    0xffffffff Oldbie
    It was my understanding that it was properly preserved, but the version that was leaked was modified. Is that not the case?
     
  19. rata

    rata

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    Trying to be useful somehow.
    Indeed. The original ROM was dumped a long while ago so it's safe.
     
  20. ICEknight

    ICEknight

    Researcher Researcher
    Oh, yeah, the real ones are preserved somewhere else. Forgot about that. =P

    But in any case, these are not the properly preserved and documented ROMs.