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Adventures with Chaotix

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by Black Squirrel, Jan 23, 2021.

  1. E-122-Psi

    E-122-Psi

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    This guy looks cool, like something that would be a halfway imposing obstacle used in something like the original Megadrive games.

    It's a shame the badniks are so underplayed in this game, likely because they hadn't figured out any way to mesh good level and obstacle design with the cumbersome ring mechanic.
     
  2. Black Squirrel

    Black Squirrel

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    Bump me do.


    14:02

    Quality control out of the window at Sega's booth - watch the player get stuck on the loops in Speed Slider.

    So, which build?

    Well 1207 doesn't have a morning palette so not that. One would expect the 0111 prototype to be later as it's dated after Winter CES took place. But let's check

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    1227 | 1229 | 0111

    The diagonal flag bits were removed in 0119 so that build's clearly too late.

    In the 1227 (and 0111) protos, a giant ring is visible from this point. Not in 1229.

    It's not a foregone conclusion that this build is 1229 (after all it might a build we don't have!) - there's 5 minutes on the clock and 500 points were obtained from somewhere (possibly that giant ring), but yeah... I might have guessed correctly.

    Oh and if you're an idiot and think this might be from the final game:

    [​IMG]

    It really isn't.
     
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  3. muteKi

    muteKi

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    If the 1229 build was made to be a source for footage in a CES preview that would explain why it's missing features that the build from two days before had (ie the ring). Incomplete features or stuff they're not ready to reveal getting hidden in a specific build. Longstanding mystery potentially solved?
     
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  4. Devon

    Devon

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    Bump!

    I apologize if this has been pointed out before, but I haven't seen this in this thread or on the wiki.

    I was doing some digging on my own and I came across this totally unreferenced sprite that seems to have been meant to go with sprite set 0x2E (the one at 0x172F64). This particular sprite can be found at address 0x173B68. It looks like some kind of coil. The wiki does mention something about "a coiled spring-like object", but I wasn't sure if it referred to this, so here it is.

    [​IMG]

    This is the only unreferenced sprite in the game it seems.
     
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  5. CaseyAH_

    CaseyAH_

    human incarnation of Palmtree Panic 'P' Mix Member
    Chaotix is like an endless well of things no one has seen before because no one bothered to check.
     
  6. HEDGESMFG

    HEDGESMFG

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    I still pray for the day we can properly romhack and begin to at least tweak this title (and Saturn 3D Blast too...)...

    I just want those 2 games to be accessible by modern standards.

    Anyway, nice find. Does that conclude all of the visual assets hidden in the data 100% now?
     
  7. McAleeCh

    McAleeCh

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    I mean, I don't think we ever got an answer as to which build those unused Eggman intro graphics are hidden in, did we? I wouldn't rule out more undiscovered stuff still lurking somewhere amongst the various prototypes.
     
  8. Devon

    Devon

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    I will say that Chaotix is quite a different beast compared to the other mainline Genesis games. Of course, it has its similarities, but its engine is definitely more complex and thought out. For instance, objects are stored in a linked list, which allows the game to just string through the slots that are loaded and tied together, rather than check every single slot to see if it has an object loaded into it like the other games do. There's also 4 different object pools that get set up for different types of objects (though they all pull their slots from the same area of memory, they just have their own list heads and paths). That's just one example, but it was definitely written to be more dynamic and optimized. Making a disassembly and hack of Chaotix would require a different set of eyes than one would have with the other games in order to make sense of it all, and that's not even accounting for all the 32X stuff...

    Fun fact: Sonic Crackers also features this same linked list setup and functions for objects (mostly, has some small differences) as well. If you ever wanted another little thing to prove that Crackers is an actual prototype of Chaotix, then there you go... even though it's definitely not needed now with all the other proof we have :P
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2023
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  9. Devon

    Devon

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    There's this string of text at address 0x2D997E that lists the programmers of the game. I don't think this appears in-game (it doesn't appear to be referenced anywhere by the game, plus it uses \r\n for line breaks) nor does it seem to be documented anywhere online.
    Code (Text):
    1.  
    2. 32X CHAOTIX TEAM PROGRAMER HIROSHI OKAMOTO,TOSHIAKI YAJIMA,TATUO YAMAJIRI,KENJI KAWAI AND CHIKAHIRO YOSHIDA
    3.  
    4. MD SONIC TEAM PROGRAMER HIROSHI OKAMOTO,TOSHIAKI YAJIMA,KENJI KAWAI,CHIKAHIRO YOSHIDA,SYUJI TAKAHASHI AND ARATA HANASHIMA
    5.  
    6. THANK YOU FOR PLAYING!! AND SEE YOU AGAIN!!
    7.  
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2023
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  10. HEDGESMFG

    HEDGESMFG

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    Is this just something that programmers hope we'll find? Is it text that would somehow be displayed in the game but never was?

    Yet another cool tiny find, 28 years later.
     
  11. Devon

    Devon

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    Alright, so I would like to get some confirmation from a Chaotix nerd about some more potential unused graphics.

    For context, Chaotix does contain a small set of Nemesis compressed graphics that are meant to be rendered as sprites on the Genesis rather than the 32X for use in stages. Some of them are used, others are not, some even being completely unreferenced, it seems.

    The Genesis sprites that I do know are used are those structures in the background in Botanic Base, alongside the ground for the boss arena that crumbles downward, and the ones made for World Entrance... and that's it. So, let's take a look at what I uncovered, and maybe someone could confirm if some of them actually do appear in the game or not. I haven't seen any of these in any sprite sheet or wiki article or forum post either.

    First is this from Techno Tower (0x2D492E).

    [​IMG]

    The palm tree is a copy of the one found in the background, but formatted as a Genesis sprite. There's also some kind of small object, in which I just guessed the palette line.

    The next one are these clouds from Marina Madness (0x2D4718).

    [​IMG]

    And now, this palm tree (0x2D7D14) and block (0x2D7C6A) from Isolated Island.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    These sprites are the ones that are referenced in the game, but I haven't seen them actually being used in the game, which is why I wanted to get some confirmation in the event that I am wrong in my assessment.

    The next set of sprites don't seem to actually be referenced by the game. Most of these I merely guessed the palettes to the best of my ability, but they could be totally wrong. It's just enough to make out what the sprites are supposed to be, at least.

    First are these objects (0x2D6B50). The palette used is from Amazing Arena. The 2 objects on the left are actually the same sprite, but with different palette lines applied.

    [​IMG]

    Next is this thing (0x2D6D84). I've not found a palette that I was sure of, so I just applied Botanic Base's palette, since that was seemingly the only one that didn't come out too weirdly, but I highly doubt it was meant to be green.

    [​IMG]

    Next is this thing (0x2D6EB4). The palette used is from the final boss stage.

    [​IMG]

    Next is this structure/machine (0x2D7050). The palette used is from Marina Madness.

    [​IMG]

    Finally are these sprites that I know for certain are for Speed Slider, because the palette matches perfectly (0x2D764C).

    [​IMG]

    Again, if anyone more knowledgeable on Chaotix could lend a hand, that would be great.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2023
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  12. Chimes

    Chimes

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    AW YEAH IT'S REWIND TIME
    Happy Boxing Day, you goobs.
    So on the wiki there's a method on fixing the Sonic Clackers sound driver crash that involved editing a few bytes in the ROM.
    While it worked, I wanted to find a way to avoid the crash without modifying the ROM.
    And thus, I devised a very impractical yet usable method on avoiding this bug.

    1. Use the emulator BlastEm (I use the latest nightly revision, so I don't know if stable has any changes)
    2. As soon as you load the ROM, press U to access the debugger.
    3. Enter this command in the console:
    z80 set [$1C0A ] 0x81
    4. After you've entered it, type c and press Enter to go back to the game.

    This gives Clackers a song to munch on. From there, you can browse more of the menu.

    Additionally, you can use your terminal of your choice to load BlastEm with the debugger as soon as the ROM loads. Here's the commands.
    Now you can avoid crashing while taking way longer to load the game!
    Also, Electoria has some instruments that get gradually quieter the longer the song plays. What's up with that...?
     
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2023
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