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Dark Sonic, on 08 May 2012 - 08:13 PM, said:

Fair enough, but I enjoyed Sonic Adventure, especially the chao, as they were, and for what they could have been, but never were, because apparently Sonic is never supposed to be too different from what the Genesis games were even though that's exactly what happened to Mario.

Mario 64 plays differently from Mario 3, Mario wasn't about exploring in Mario 3, but it was in Mario 64 and Sunshine, so I don't see why the 3D Sonic games can't be more like Rare games. All SEGA does lately is one thing.

It probably doesn't help that Nintendo also owns 3 other franchises that do different things whereas SEGA owns one people still give a shit about that relies on nostalgia.

David The Lurker, on 07 May 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Because I would. I like exploration on MY terms, and that means going everywhere in a level. A game that prevents me from or punishes me for exploring everything like classic Sonic games does frustrates me. That's not fun, that's just developers being lazy. You can throw out a bunch of "OH WELL YOU JUST DON'T LIKE CHALLENGE LOLOLOL" insults and they won't mean a damn thing to me considering Spyro and Tomba were focused on exploring everything and those games were not easy.

You people hate backtracking and I hate playing fucking Green Hill over. I think a level should be fully explored the first time to find everything in it as opposed to playing it over again because some asshole developer thought it would increase replay value. I put down Sonic 1 halfway through the game because of how dated and archaic it is. I only beat Sonic 2 because of the co-op, I think they're repeatedly making themselves not fun for me because of all the arcade bullshit they had to throw in there.

David The Lurker, on 07 May 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Mario's minigames have never aggravated me beyond livid. I have never done physical damage to a TV over Mario games. Nintendo does something SEGA has never gotten through their thick skull and that's make a game fun and accessible without being a blowjob for so-called "hardcore" gamers and a nightmare for anyone just looking for an escapist diversion.

David The Lurker, on 07 May 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Using Shadow as an example is only acknowledging one type of modern game. By "modern" I mean for them to throw away this arcade bullshit that is bogging down the series. Mario wasn't always the way it was in 64 so why can't Sonic be more about collecting? It'd make the levels more interesting and the gameplay more of a controlled pace. I'd like it much more if the series would take the good points of modern games. Modern games give players choices on how to play; Sonic can do that by giving different character options and not FORCING speed on you, not everyone who got into the franchise wants to play a racing game thinly veiled as a platformer. Sonic Adventure is not my idea of a good example for the emeralds, I don't want them to just pop up in a story, I don't want Super Sonic to be an endboss thing, I want to find them but I want to do it without the insane trial and error of the classic games. I got thoroughly annoyed every time I died in Mario 64 and was thrown out of the level. That made the game tedious to play, imagine how tedious I think classic Sonic is by comparison, I want to play a game one time, and be able to go back for anything I miss, and stay in a level for an extended time to collect everything instead of having to replay the entire fucking game for that.

I'm a completionist, not getting an item in a game drives me insane (And is also why I stopped playing mainstream Pokemon games) so "not getting everything" is ludicrous.

If you want a summary, one thing that I think is ESSENTIAL AND REQUIRED of modern games are choices. Choices in playstyle and choices without obscene consequences. An RPG like Skyrim gives you the option of how to build your character. You can't master every skill but the game doesn't block off entire sections of itself if you can't pick locks, Skyrim is a prime example of choices, because instead of being a douche like classic Sonic, it doesn't shut its doors to "less skilled" or more importantly, "less interested" players and instead gives them an alternative that they can choose.

In the case of a platformer, you can either complete a level in one go on Spyro or come back to it later, it doesn't just become unavailable to you at a certain point, the latter should just be viewed as a design flaw instead of a feature because it does nothing for the player besides frustrate them and force them to restart their game.

The idea that a video game should be "Do this or you don't get this" is a dead concept to me, the modern translation is "There are several ways you can accomplish the same thing" and that's how it should be, with a few exceptions such as boss fights.

Sparks, on 07 May 2012 - 01:15 AM, said:

Sorry, you quoted mine so I thought it was.

Still, why does everything have to be classic? Why can't Sonic take some ideas from modern games instead of taking them from 80s arcade games all the time? I think that's really bogging it down.

I wouldn't mind special stages if they weren't all about "OMG LOL RUSH TO THE EXIT WITH THIS MANY RINGS" or "DON'T FALL IN THE WRONG PLACE OR YOU FAIL" Why do they have to be such a pain in the ass? If they're going to vary on gameplay, can't they find some other way to introduce surrealism into the games? Mario 64 had secret areas where you had to find five silver stars to get one power star, something a little more exploration-based with the same risk involved that everywhere else in the game had would be nice.

Sparks, on 06 May 2012 - 09:59 PM, said:

That's if you're talking about a classic Sonic game, I wasn't.

I hate the idea that everything to do with the property has to be classic for people to like it, the mass amounts of fangames that are trying to be a Sonic 2/3 homage just irritate me, it's like nobody wants to do something else. (I don't think those fangames are bad, some of them are very nice-looking, but they're mostly the same.)

I hope that encyclopedia gets a Kindle Fire edition, I have no space in my house for comic books anymore. :V