[speedyink]

I think it's unfair to just assume this game was going to suck. I mean, it never got anywhere close to a finished product.
I think, had things gone...basically the opposite we could have had a pretty solid game. If POV managed to get the game looking like Ofer's late PC builds, but with properly built levels that had flow to them (not just test levels), than this game would have smoked Sonic 3D blast. There were seriously some promising elements in those test levels that would have blown me away in '96 (or '97 if it came to that). In fact, depending on how well they designed the levels, I could see myself enjoying it more than the Sonic Adventure games.

On a side note, does disc swapping actually damage the Saturn? Is there some sort of explanation rather than just "it will break your Saturn"? I mean, yeah, no shit if you do it constantly it can cause extra wear to the motor, but that's the only conclusion I can really come to. No thread derailment, if you don't know for sure, then don't answer. I'm just curious since I can't find it actually explained on a technical level.

This post has been edited by speedyink: 12 May 2015 - 08:18 PM

[TheKazeblade]

I really do believe that PoV's non-fisheyed engine and that particular version of Jade Gully had the makings of being a legitimately good Sonic game for Saturn. A primarily 2D experience but with an added z-axis that would allow for alternate paths and exploration. Pull that camera back a bit and continue with that line of level design, and I do see this iteration of X-Treme being a successful Sonic game. I would love to see an off-shoot of Andrew75's AXSX project exploring this approach without fisheye, or even just seeing custom levels done in this particular engine.

Which reminds me, since PoV's engine is its own thing and not Ofer Alon's, is there any issue with releasing the source code for this particular build? Wasn't the only reason behind not releasing previous builds because we were respecting Alon and Senn's wishes?

[Andrew75]

TheKazeblade, on 12 May 2015 - 09:28 PM, said:

I would love to see an off-shoot of Andrew75's AXSX project exploring this approach without fisheye, or even just seeing custom levels done in this particular engine.

AXSX has Fisheye both ON and OFF Modes, we can even adjust the fisheye power on the fly if we wanted.

[TheKazeblade]

Andrew75, on 12 May 2015 - 10:22 PM, said:

TheKazeblade, on 12 May 2015 - 09:28 PM, said:

I would love to see an off-shoot of Andrew75's AXSX project exploring this approach without fisheye, or even just seeing custom levels done in this particular engine.

AXSX has Fisheye both ON and OFF Modes, we can even adjust the fisheye power on the fly if we wanted.

That's fantastic!

[Spinksy]

TheKazeblade, on 12 May 2015 - 09:28 PM, said:

Which reminds me, since PoV's engine is its own thing and not Ofer Alon's, is there any issue with releasing the source code for this particular build? Wasn't the only reason behind not releasing previous builds because we were respecting Alon and Senn's wishes?

I also kind of wondered about this - don't get me wrong I have no clue about using source code to mod etc but I know theres people on this site that would work magic on this. (and thats something I'd really like to see).

Like how people were starting to port SX levels into one of the previously released builds.

[HEDGESMFG]

I love every bit of work that's been done on these protos so far. The fact that we have them is downright incredible...

But I'd love to play those latter PC versions where we have videos that show proper level design a heck of a lot more. The ones they refuse to release (within their rights of course).

You know, something that's not barely functional as an actual game.

Still, don't misunderstand. These protos are really interesting and I'll take every one released that we can get, but I think the so-so response from the general public mostly stems from the fact that the protos simply aren't very functional, no matter how technically impressive their recovery/porting is. It kills a lot of X-treme hype to see how rough the game truly was throughout these stages of development. Your average player would be left wondering if the game was 'ever' any good at all.

By all means, keep making them though, please. You're doing a true service to us all!

[Lostgame]

HEDGESMFG, on 13 May 2015 - 12:30 PM, said:

I love every bit of work that's been done on these protos so far. The fact that we have them is downright incredible...

But I'd love to play those latter PC versions where we have videos that show proper level design a heck of a lot more. The ones they refuse to release (within their rights of course).

You know, something that's not barely functional as an actual game.

Still, don't misunderstand. These protos are really interesting and I'll take every one released that we can get, but I think the so-so response from the general public mostly stems from the fact that the protos simply aren't very functional, no matter how technically impressive their recovery/porting is. It kills a lot of X-treme hype to see how rough the game truly was throughout these stages of development. Your average player would be left wondering if the game was 'ever' any good at all.

By all means, keep making them though, please. You're doing a true service to us all!

Also I think part of the lack of interest is the fact that the source is not public. Imagine the level of progress when it eventually gets out somehow! Then I think everyone's gonna be into it, for sure.

[EmphaticRevolution]

I'm baffled by how well this runs, how good it looks, and how stable the framerate is, it's just incredible. Never in a million years did I expect that we would get a version of Xtreme that was this stable.

But was this the farthest they got or did they edge a little closer?

EDIT: By "closer" I mean beyond minor changes.

This post has been edited by EmphaticRevolution: 13 May 2015 - 07:25 PM

[speedyink]

Here's a little video I did for this build. I'll put this here if anyone's interested.

https://www.youtube....h?v=odJj1zuwPFQ

I managed to jump off the map, I was surprised that there wasn't an invisible wall to stop me from running away from the level. Also, Sonic gets a tad glitched when stuck on the bottom (hence the "moonwalk")

[Andrew75]

EmphaticRevolution, on 13 May 2015 - 07:18 PM, said:

I'm baffled by how well this runs, how good it looks, and how stable the framerate is, it's just incredible. Never in a million years did I expect that we would get a version of Xtreme that was this stable.

But was this the farthest they got or did they edge a little closer?

EDIT: By "closer" I mean beyond minor changes.

They may have gotten a little bit closer than this I think .
This POV build did not incorporate cube resizes for the bridge posts among other cubes as would have been seen if ran in STI's engine build v42.
I would assume they had gone a bit further than what we released here. Only time will tell....

[TheKazeblade]

Andrew75, on 14 May 2015 - 04:30 AM, said:

Only time will tell....

Are there more files left over on the PoV workstation JollyRoger has, or do you just mean in general?

[Spinksy]

TheKazeblade, on 14 May 2015 - 04:52 AM, said:

Andrew75, on 14 May 2015 - 04:30 AM, said:

Only time will tell....

Are there more files left over on the PoV workstation JollyRoger has, or do you just mean in general?

I'm sure I remember reading somewhere what jollyroger was planning next but can't find it- was wondering the same thing.

Is there much more in the way of stuff to release (without meaning to sound greedy there - pretty amazed at what we have already)!

Also did you hear back from Christina?

[Energy]

Spinksy, on 14 May 2015 - 05:33 AM, said:

I'm sure I remember reading somewhere what jollyroger was planning next but can't find it- was wondering the same thing.

Is there much more in the way of stuff to release (without meaning to sound greedy there - pretty amazed at what we have already)!

Also did you hear back from Christina?

JR has hinted at releasing something that's more 'playable' which he will possibly make moddable. Which would explain why some of the new levels haven't been given away yet. I imagine this could take quite a while though.

This build is stunning.

[winterhell]

Lostgame, on 13 May 2015 - 04:07 PM, said:

Also I think part of the lack of interest is the fact that the source is not public. Imagine the level of progress when it eventually gets out somehow! Then I think everyone's gonna be into it, for sure. />

I'm not sure about that. Previous experience with Open Source Sonic projects and collaborations tended to have even less progress than closed source projects.
'Everyone' contributing to something because its open source is wishful thinking and its rarely the norm. I'd very much like to be wrong about this

Plus we've established distributing x-treme's source is against the creator's wishes. I hope they keep being respected.

[TheKazeblade]

winterhell, on 14 May 2015 - 01:12 PM, said:

Plus we've established distributing x-treme's source is against the creator's wishes. I hope they keep being respected.

The only thing that is in question in that regard is Alon's X-treme Engine. However, this current build is not Alon's engine which was the only reason I brought it up. He has no right to claim work that is not his own should not be allowed to be researched and studied. At least from my viewpoint. In the end, JollyRoger and Andrew75 are pretty much the only ones with the source code, so it's up to them and how they interpret it.