[Barry the Nomad]

TimmiT, on 26 February 2015 - 03:17 PM, said:

AngelComa, on 26 February 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

I think TimmiT is mixing "I like Paper Mario so thats what they should go with" and assuming they aren't doing the design on purpose.

I was saying that 2D drawings on 3D platforms can be done well and used Paper Mario as an example of it being done well, not how it should be done. In that game the 2D drawings look like they belong in the world, rather than looking like two completely different styles that don't mesh well. Which in my opinion is the problem with the new Toejam and Earl's visual style. I hope that it'll improve, but the way the 3D world is stylized in early trailers doesn't give me much hope.

The argument isn't "are they done well or not" the argument is "are the 2D characters on a 3D map intentional", and yes they are.

From the Kickstarter:

Quote

"Fixed isometric camera, 2D sprites, simple controls, and an emphasis on coop play. It will also pull in some of the more beloved elements from game two, AND we have a list of exciting new gameplay elements planned as well."

"3D Terrain: Don't worry we won't make you sick and confused with an over-the-shoulder POV camera like we had in game 3. Nevertheless, 3D terrain will let us do some really FUN stuff. We can zoom in to see characters better, or zoom way out to see the stacked levels. You can now see the levels way below you, and when you fall, where you land on the level below makes sense. Also, we'll have hills! So what? I can answer that with 2 words... ROOOCKET SKAAAAATES!!. "

The graphics are in an early state and their aesthetics are subjective.

[ICEknight]

AngelComa, on 26 February 2015 - 02:43 PM, said:

ICEknight, on 26 February 2015 - 02:07 PM, said:

AngelComa, on 26 February 2015 - 01:10 PM, said:

They said they wanted the characters to look like it was ripped out of a 90s comicbook and 3D backgrounds. Thats exactly what it looks like.

I don't think they meant it as in "we want everything to look paper thin against the 3D backgrounds".

Looks like someone clipped comic book paper and put it in the 3D background, I'm pretty sure thats what they wanted. Hey, we are having Greg on the podcast next week. I'll ask him what he mean't.

Dude's been designing games for 25 years, I'm pretty sure he mean't to make it look the way it looks... your argument is terrible.

I'm just saying that I don't think he meant they wanted the characters look like actual comic book clippings, but "ripped out of a 90s comic book" as in the drawing style, which is not being translated into the environments.

But whatever, I hope they add some cel shading to make the backgrounds look more like in the animation, and fix the perspective as in the A Link Between Worlds example that has been posted. That could help make things look more consistent and ultimately more appealing.

Barry the Nomad, on 26 February 2015 - 03:34 PM, said:

The argument isn't "are they done well or not" the argument is "are the 2D characters on a 3D map intentional", and yes they are.

Actually, I think the argument here is "is the noticeable clash between 2D sprites and 3D environments intentional or are they actually aiming for both to blend more seamlessly".


It doesn't seem like the team is 100% sure about the current looks, judging from this:

Quote

we may do some more experimenting with the environment look. If you have any suggestions or ideas of what you think might be cool we'd love to hear it

This post has been edited by ICEknight: 26 February 2015 - 05:45 PM

[Glaber]

I just hope they add graphics for movement in at least 2 more directions. Moving forward and back using the sideways graphics doesn't look right

This post has been edited by Glaber: 27 February 2015 - 01:42 AM

[ICEknight]

Glaber, on 27 February 2015 - 01:42 AM, said:

I just hope they add graphics for movement in at least 2 more directions. Moving forward and back using the sideways graphics doesn't look right

That's their intentions, according to the FAQ.

[Toasty]

I love TJ&E! Huge fan of the first two games, but I never did play the third. I absolutely adorable the first game, the second is okay, but the first was a top tier Genesis game for me.

I can't give to a project that isn't coming to consoles though and it breaks my heart at the thought of this being PC only. I don't play PC games, I only play ps3 and Wii u.

[ICEknight]

Toasty, on 27 February 2015 - 02:42 PM, said:

I love TJ&E! Huge fan of the first two games, but I never did play the third. I absolutely adorable the first game, the second is okay, but the first was a top tier Genesis game for me.

I can't give to a project that isn't coming to consoles though and it breaks my heart at the thought of this being PC only. I don't play PC games, I only play ps3 and Wii u.

They'll make it multiplatform, eventually:

Quote

Why aren't you developing for multiple platforms at once? What about Xbox One, and WiiU, and PS4 or PSVita?
We absolutely plan to put this on as many consoles as we can. Hopefully all of them.

[Hero Of Fate]

That's how kickstarter Projects tend to work anyway. PC is the easiest to get something out on at first, but since they're using Unity they can put it on anything else once they've got everything ironed out. I'll be backing this soon enough because, I mean, it's TJ&E.

It's even possible that it could be on 3DS, as that Spongebob HeroPants game seems to have been developed using Unity. As for Wii U, Unity is Nintendo's lead supported engine for independent developers.

This post has been edited by Hero Of Fate: 27 February 2015 - 08:58 PM

[ICEknight]

Hero Of Fate, on 27 February 2015 - 08:49 PM, said:

It's even possible that it could be on 3DS, as that Spongebob HeroPants game seems to have been developed using Unity.

That looks like a pretty average looking game... I'm betting on the team just forgetting to remove the Unity logo from the "publishers 'n crap" movie. =|

[Hero Of Fate]

It's possible, but Unity is a very workable engine so I don't find it that surprising. I mean, there's a reason Nintendo includes it with every Wii U dev kit. But really, it doesn't really matter if it doesn't make it to 3DS if it's on every other possible platform, which seems like the team really wants to do once they get the PC version finished.

This post has been edited by Hero Of Fate: 28 February 2015 - 12:27 AM

[RankoChan]

Greg responded to the art direction complaints today by showing some conceptional examples for a brighter palette, outlines, and the removal of shadows for folks to vote on.
Original:


Option A:


Option B:


I think B's direction is the way to go. Maybe re-add A's shadows but with an increased transparency? It looks like the team went with shadows in the first place to highlight the day/night cycle.

On a side note, maybe this topic should be moved to general gaming? Sega only owns the rights to the first three games, not the IP itself, and has no involvement with Back in the Groove.

[TimmiT]

Both options A and B look far better than what was first shown at least, I'd be okay with either.

[TheKazeblade]

I agree, both are significant improvements. It's funny, the way it originally was reminds me of the color scheme you would see on the Dreamcast, which made me a bit nostalgic. But I would definitely say either A or B are a much better direction.

I'm with RankoChan, B with increased shadow opacity.

[RenyNoise]

Option A, Just lower the opacity a bit, and please give Earl some hightops, No one in hip-hop is wearing Timberlands anymore. Thats so 03.

This post has been edited by RenyNoise: 05 March 2015 - 09:03 AM

[Eduardo Knuckles]

Option C has no shadow in everything and option B really gives no hightops to Earl and still both C and B seems to be lacking details in comparison to A. So, A.

[RankoChan]

They've decided to go with B, but with more subdued shadows; Really digging this new direction. Greg recently did an interview revealing further ideas/concepts he has for the game and returning elements too. The cow ghost from Panic on Funkotron (I loved this thing) has been confirmed returning!

Also stretch goals:


Definitely want to see those classic skins happen.