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So just what the hell was the deal with Sonic 2 8-bit

#31 User is offline The Game Collector 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:56 AM

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View PostGlitch, on 15 June 2014 - 07:34 AM, said:

View PostCooljerk, on 14 June 2014 - 08:03 PM, said:

View PostPhoebius, on 13 June 2014 - 03:56 PM, said:

By the way, does someone knows how to make it work on real hardware? I've failed two times already (I get a "software error")


Incidentally, do you happen to have the 3d glasses adapter attached? Try unplugging it.

The checksum is incorrect in the version of the ROM that's floating about. If your SMS BIOS checks the value it will fail to boot.


That's strange, because in the earlier build of the rom where the ring loss behavior wasn't changed yet (I prefer it this way so I won't update to the newer version) it runs on Everdrive MD for the Genesis with no problems. I completed the game 100% this way.

#32 User is offline Glitch 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 07:48 AM

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View PostThe Game Collector, on 20 June 2014 - 01:56 AM, said:

That's strange, because in the earlier build of the rom where the ring loss behavior wasn't changed yet (I prefer it this way so I won't update to the newer version) it runs on Everdrive MD for the Genesis with no problems. I completed the game 100% this way.

The Mega Drive doesn't have an SMS BIOS. Also, the checksums aren't validated when booting a game from a flash cart.

#33 User is offline Vangar 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 08:16 AM

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I got up to one of the last levels and the palette went all screwy. This was a while ago, maybe I was on an incomplete version of the hack? Used an everdrive.

#34 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 12:25 PM

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View Postashthedragon, on 15 June 2014 - 06:46 PM, said:

like when that Marble Zone BGM was found on Sonic 1 8bits.


Wait, what?

#35 User is offline GerbilSoft 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 12:32 PM

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9001

View PostCooljerk, on 20 June 2014 - 12:25 PM, said:

View Postashthedragon, on 15 June 2014 - 06:46 PM, said:

like when that Marble Zone BGM was found on Sonic 1 8bits.


Wait, what?

http://forums.sonicr...showtopic=32298



#36 User is offline Glitch 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:31 PM

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View PostVangar, on 20 June 2014 - 08:16 AM, said:

I got up to one of the last levels and the palette went all screwy. This was a while ago, maybe I was on an incomplete version of the hack? Used an everdrive.

The Triple Trouble topic is over here. Let's try not to derail this one.
I think I fixed the palette issues in the latest ROM. Check that out. If it's still a problem post in the TT topic and I'll see if I can help.

#37 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 20 June 2014 - 04:24 PM

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So, to foster discussion, on the subject of the marble zone song from Sonic 1 8-bit, I'll link my old thread on the subject of Sonic 1: http://forums.sonicr...showtopic=20657

I still believe everything I wrote. DRX said back then he was trying to chase down an 8-bit Sonic 1 that was more like the Genesis version and repeated it in that Marble Zone music topic, so Im guessing my theory was pretty much spot on.

#38 User is offline nesboy43 

Posted 02 July 2014 - 03:53 AM

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I have a special place in my heart for the GG/MS Sonic games. As someone who loves the Classic Sonic games and thinks they are the greatest games of all times it was nice to discover the 8 bit games a long time after my childhood. I found Sonic 1 MS to be the best designed of all the games. Chaos was great but too easy. Sonic 2, Labyrinth, and Spinball are the only classic Sonic games I have not beat. I had no idea about the Triple Trouble hack and will give it a try.

What is the consensus on 3DS emulation of GG games? I have a Game Gear with a decent screen (have to look at it from and angle though) and all the Sonic games, but not sure if it is worth paying to also own them on 3DS.

View PostJosh, on 16 June 2014 - 01:10 PM, said:

And I definitely prefer the Game Gear version's. It's a lot less traditional as a boss theme and I agree that the sound mixing isn't so rough on the Master System's version, but eh.



I actually looked up the Master System Sonic games on eBay the other day, and they're pretty expensive.


Looked this up and you are definitely right. Wow! Sonic 1 MS NTSC boxed are selling for 90 bucks!

I am glad I got my copy of Sonic 1 and Sonic Chaos CIB for around 10 bucks a piece a few years back. Just need to get Sonic 2 to complete the collection (Sonic Blast is definitely out of the question).

To be honest I was always hoping that Sega prices would stay low like they have been, despite the big surge in Nintendo game prices for the past few years. For a while they did but I guess it was only a matter of time.
This post has been edited by nesboy43: 02 July 2014 - 03:55 AM

#39 User is offline Ch1pper 

Posted 02 July 2014 - 06:48 PM

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If your Game Gear still works then you're probably fine as-is. I bought a few of the 3DS releases out of nostalgia (why else would I get Blast? :v:) and I make decent use of the save-state feature, but other than that there's no real reason to double-dip until necessary. I miss the Game Gear's d-pad and buttons when playing some of them nowadays. :(

#40 User is offline nesboy43 

Posted 03 July 2014 - 10:22 PM

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View PostCh1pper, on 02 July 2014 - 06:48 PM, said:

If your Game Gear still works then you're probably fine as-is. I bought a few of the 3DS releases out of nostalgia (why else would I get Blast? :v:/>/>) and I make decent use of the save-state feature, but other than that there's no real reason to double-dip until necessary. I miss the Game Gear's d-pad and buttons when playing some of them nowadays. :(/>/>


Well my main thing would be because of the screen and ghosting. The Game Gear Screen was never great to begin with, even on my recapped one things aren't perfect. With 3DS I would imagine these issues would be nonexistant. However, if it is bad emulation the benefits would be out weighed by the cons.
This post has been edited by nesboy43: 03 July 2014 - 10:23 PM

#41 User is offline Ch1pper 

Posted 04 July 2014 - 06:56 PM

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Yeah, there's no such issues on the 3DS. Ghosting is turned off by default but still available as an option (for whatever reason), the 1/2/Start buttons can be mapped to any 3DS button (other than Start/Select), and there's a few options for screen size adjustment. A step or two above NES/Game Boy offerings in the eShop, to be sure. :)

#42 User is offline Master Emerald 

Posted 05 July 2014 - 12:34 PM

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You can change the frame color too, the emulator is pretty good! It was done by M2 IIRC.

#43 User is offline ICEknight 

Posted 06 July 2014 - 06:12 PM

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Doesn't the emulator show a wrong aspect ratio when using the frame, though?

#44 User is offline nineko 

Posted 10 July 2014 - 12:45 AM

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View PostCooljerk, on 11 June 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

what's up with those monitors in the 8-bit version of Sonic Spinball that have the japanese characters for "look" written on them? If you break them, some weird text scrolls across the screen. They almost seem like debug monitors, but they're found out in the open, like you're meant to find them.
If you break them all, you obtain a cheat code which can be entered like the other ones in the Sound Test screen, as sfx numbers: 08-31-71 (see this old Youtube video I did) which means 00 08 03 01 07 01. While it is recognized as a valid cheat code (the screen shakes when you enter it), I don't know what it does. Not even smspower mentions that.

edit: Google is always a good friend. It looks like that new messages appear when you break the monitors after you entered the code.
This post has been edited by nineko: 10 July 2014 - 12:50 AM

#45 User is offline HP Zoner 

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View PostCooljerk, on 11 June 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

Little bits and pieces of the Master System version make it seem incomplete to me. Like in Aqua Lake Zone act 2 - in the GG version, it begins with you above water, and then the water level rises quick. This actually still happens in the master system version, but the palette is always that of being under water, so you don't notice. the only things that tip you off that you're above water is that you can't drown in the opening part of the act, and you move uninhibited. That the zone is the only placement of the speed shoes also makes me think it wasn't quite complete.

The water/speed shoes monitor is an interesting thing, and I can explain why they removed the monitor in the Game Gear version. As you mentioned, in the Master System version, you can run and jump freely at regular speed where you start off. However, the water never actually rises in this version and always stays at the same vertical level. What makes this evident is that Sonic runs faster whenever you're way up high, and you also can't drown no matter how long you stay there.

It works something like this:

Posted Image

Notice how the Speed Shoes monitor is above the water. Besides adding a shiny trail of sparks behind Sonic and changing the music, it actually doesn't do anything! It's supposed to cover up the fact that, for whatever reason, the top of the level is above the water. Most people would get the monitor when the chance presented itself, so for the short segment after you find it, you'll think that you're running faster because of it. It's actually because you've jumped out of the water. A good way to see this is by getting the monitor and falling back down. You'll be as sluggish as usual.

So why isn't the Speed Shoes monitor in the Game Gear version? That's right: because the entire level does get submerged in water there (and very visibly so). Picking up the monitor there wouldn't have changed your speed because they never bothered programming it properly. It was easier to just get rid of it altogether. I'm not suggesting the Speed Shoes monitor was intentionally created to cover up the whole water thing, but I do think it was incomplete near release, so they decided to give it some use where it made the most sense.

I don't know the exact reason why they didn't do something similar for the beginning and the ending of the level, but I guess it was just more jarring to see Sonic picking up and losing speed randomly somewhere in the middle. The game was clearly rushed, so this kind of stuff isn't too surprising.

I'm more surprised they didn't just make the Master System level underwater from top to bottom, but perhaps they planned to make the water visible like in the Game Gear version at first. I don't think it was intended to rise, though: it was this that made the shortcut near the end of the level impossible to take in the Game Gear version, due to Sonic's hindered movement (I'm talking specifically about the intangible wall before the tube that leads to the Emerald, which allows you to bypass the long vertical ascent with all the lobsters and spears).

Speaking of Aqua Lake oddities, the boss hilariously hits himself the first time he tries to attack you, provided you just stand there and watch. This was fixed for the Game Gear version.

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