[Hez]

Dark Sonic, on 19 July 2015 - 07:29 PM, said:

MotorRoach, on 19 July 2015 - 07:15 PM, said:

I'm not going to lie, I swear that was done only for the purpose of a joke video and nothing else. The idea for Fang's aiming is an interesting idea, but I think that something about it could be changed, just so it wouldn't end up being a straight clone from the egg throw in Yoshi's Island. The flutter jump, on the other hand, just looks ridiculous and unfitting, because it's the same as if Sonic tried to fly by waving his arms really fast.

Unless you literally want an excuse to put a Yoshi reskin in the game, I recommend changing his ability to something else-- such as making use of his spring tail, which is... like, one of the distinct things about him, not waving his legs in the air.

Agreed. I could totally see a Scrooge McDuck cane type move working for Fang's tail. The fluttering? Kinda odd.

Ill be honest, I didn't expect so much negative feedback. I've been playing through half the game today using it and its really fun. Be-it, I'm changing the sound affects and probably using a different animation for the fluttering (or remove it completely).

I may just remove the character again. I can't really find anything else to do with anybody besides the core three.

This post has been edited by Hez: 19 July 2015 - 07:59 PM

[Strife]

If you've been contemplating adding additional characters to the game, have you looked at E-122-Psi's character hacks for inspiration? Vector and his air dash could make for an interesting gameplay switchup, as would Amy, Sally or Bunny.

[Dark Sonic]

Hez, on 19 July 2015 - 07:58 PM, said:

Dark Sonic, on 19 July 2015 - 07:29 PM, said:

MotorRoach, on 19 July 2015 - 07:15 PM, said:

I'm not going to lie, I swear that was done only for the purpose of a joke video and nothing else. The idea for Fang's aiming is an interesting idea, but I think that something about it could be changed, just so it wouldn't end up being a straight clone from the egg throw in Yoshi's Island. The flutter jump, on the other hand, just looks ridiculous and unfitting, because it's the same as if Sonic tried to fly by waving his arms really fast.

Unless you literally want an excuse to put a Yoshi reskin in the game, I recommend changing his ability to something else-- such as making use of his spring tail, which is... like, one of the distinct things about him, not waving his legs in the air.

Agreed. I could totally see a Scrooge McDuck cane type move working for Fang's tail. The fluttering? Kinda odd.

Ill be honest, I didn't expect so much negative feedback. I've been playing through half the game today using it and its really fun. Be-it, I'm changing the sound affects and probably using a different animation for the fluttering (or remove it completely).

I may just remove the character again. I can't really find anything else to do with anybody besides the core three.

What's wrong with the pogo stick tail and the current gun shooting mechanic? That's different from the core 3. It's just change one move to another.

The gun shooting mechanic is awesome.

This post has been edited by Dark Sonic: 19 July 2015 - 08:13 PM

[Pexs]

I think the character looks like a BLAST to play, even if it doesn't make complete sense to the character himself. I'd expect something like that out of Bean, maybe. (And hey, there's an idea if you want it.)

I'd say to try and preserve the gameplay somehow. It looks too fun to just scrap.

[Hez]

Pexs, on 19 July 2015 - 09:33 PM, said:

I think the character looks like a BLAST to play, even if it doesn't make complete sense to the character himself. I'd expect something like that out of Bean, maybe. (And hey, there's an idea if you want it.)

I'd say to try and preserve the gameplay somehow. It looks too fun to just scrap.

"Fang's main weapon is his Popgun, a popgun that fires corks, as opposed to conventional bullets. His title, Sniper, suggests that he's able to use his Popgun with great accuracy."

It doesn't make sense?

EDIT: Well, they aren't corks in the game. I had to find some way to make it so its not over powered so his gun uses rings that it compresses instead. Ring Corks™?

This post has been edited by Hez: 19 July 2015 - 10:12 PM

[Dark Sonic]

Hez, on 19 July 2015 - 10:11 PM, said:

Pexs, on 19 July 2015 - 09:33 PM, said:

I think the character looks like a BLAST to play, even if it doesn't make complete sense to the character himself. I'd expect something like that out of Bean, maybe. (And hey, there's an idea if you want it.)

I'd say to try and preserve the gameplay somehow. It looks too fun to just scrap.

"Fang's main weapon is his Popgun, a popgun that fires corks, as opposed to conventional bullets. His title, Sniper, suggests that he's able to use his Popgun with great accuracy."

It doesn't make sense?

EDIT: Well, they aren't corks in the game. I had to find some way to make it so its not over powered so his gun uses rings that it compresses instead. Ring Corks™?

I think he was referring to the fluttering. Bean's a duck, so he could fly.

[DinnerSonic]

I want to say the flutter jump seems a bit goofy, though this is Sonic, it's not meant to be hyper serious. A Duck Tales style pogo tail high jump might make more sense, but given what you say, I wonder if it would be as fun/refreshing? If it bothers people or you too much, maybe make his ducking animation involve the trademark tail animation, jump or no jump, and have the hover sprites include a cartoony "villain's escape jetpack" instead of/along with the foot kicking?

Meanwhile, the gunplay seems pretty cool, and despite the obvious YI influence seems to have it's own unique touches, with an apparent bit of physics and the shields granting special effects. I secretly hope the electric shield one has some kind of ring magnet effect over the shots. I also like how it seems shots return the ring that you spend to shoot if you can get to it, seems like a kind of expansion of the traditional Sonic ring loss gameplay.

One thing I wonder is if there are any features to allow quicker aiming during faster Sonic gameplay moments, or if lock-on or manual quick aiming would break it, especially in the age of 2D homing attacks and other such things that aren't thought of as needed in a 2D game. Can Fang even jump on enemies though? Restricting any and all enemy damage to his (ringpop?)gun might be what encourages people to use it more.

One last thing, I swear I remember either this or Sonic Classic 1 having some form of mission mode, find the giant Badnik, beat this score, things like that. Will Fang get any missions? It'd be another good way to encourage people to use his differing jump and attack features if they needed to defeat X amount of Badniks either before reaching a goal or in general.

This post has been edited by DinnerSonic: 19 July 2015 - 11:13 PM

[Hez]

DinnerSonic, on 19 July 2015 - 11:13 PM, said:

I want to say the flutter jump seems a bit goofy, though this is Sonic, it's not meant to be hyper serious. A Duck Tales style pogo tail high jump might make more sense, but given what you say, I wonder if it would be as fun/refreshing? If it bothers people or you too much, maybe make his ducking animation involve the trademark tail animation, jump or no jump, and have the hover sprites include a cartoony "villain's escape jetpack" instead of/along with the foot kicking?

Meanwhile, the gunplay seems pretty cool, and despite the obvious YI influence seems to have it's own unique touches, with an apparent bit of physics and the shields granting special effects. I secretly hope the electric shield one has some kind of ring magnet effect over the shots. I also like how it seems shots return the ring that you spend to shoot if you can get to it, seems like a kind of expansion of the traditional Sonic ring loss gameplay.

One thing I wonder is if there are any features to allow quicker aiming during faster Sonic gameplay moments, or if lock-on or manual quick aiming would break it, especially in the age of 2D homing attacks and other such things that aren't thought of as needed in a 2D game. Can Fang even jump on enemies though? Restricting any and all enemy damage to his (ringpop?)gun might be what encourages people to use it more.

One last thing, I swear I remember either this or Sonic Classic 1 having some form of mission mode, find the giant Badnik, beat this score, things like that. Will Fang get any missions? It'd be another good way to encourage people to use his differing jump and attack features if they needed to defeat X amount of Badniks either before reaching a goal or in general.

As of right now, he can only destroy badniks with his gun. As for quick shots, while I've been playing through testing I've just been lightly tapping on the button, which just fires off a quick round. It works, and doesn't seem to cheap.

[W.A.C.]

I agree with everyone that the fluttering jump sounds like an incredibly odd move for Fang. The Scrouge McDuck influenced idea sounds like it would fit his character design better. Gun gameplay looks okay. Biggest problem I have with how he's implemented is that his gameplay is mostly just a complete ripoff of Yoshi's gameplay, which is odd because I'd expect both charactera to play very differently. Though I've yet to see him implemented great in a fangame. Has potential, but his gameplay could use either more originality or have his gameplay consist of ideas from more than one specific game unrelated to Sonic.

This post has been edited by W.A.C.: 20 July 2015 - 01:11 AM

[Billy]

I'd say keep the flutter jump, but have him helicopter his tail downward, since there's already an obvious precedent for that sort of thing in Sonic. It honestly doesn't matter if his character design matches this ability, lest we forget Knuckles' design gives no indication that he can glide.

[Titan]

Whoa, what's with the negativity? I think the flutter jump fits with the goofiness of Fang's character (you only have to look at Sonic Triple Trouble to see he's not meant to be taken seriously), and the gun mechanic looks really cool. Looking forward to playing as him

[MotorRoach]

So you're saying that just because Fang is a goofy character that's not meant to be taken seriously, anything that is goofy automatically fits him? Sorry, but that's not how designing a character works, no matter how goofy you try to make it sound like. By that logic, you could make him summon a Daytona USA car into the stage, 'cause who cares, he's not meant to be taken seriously.

Acting like a helicopter would be kind of stretching the purpose of his tail, and would only work if he had a bigger tail or anything else, instead of just a long purple stick-- that and just disguising the flutter jump animation wouldn't make him any more unique to play as either.

So far, Scrouge McDuck type of gameplay has been the best ability replacement suggestion in this thread. It fits him because his tail serves to the sole purpose of acting like a spring and make him bounce off the floor, and that's evident in both games he appears in (STT and STF). I'm here hoping that the tail idea isn't a complete ripoff of Scrouge's cane, though, but something on that basis would still work pretty decently along some slight changes to it.

I'm also not that good with planning movesets, but I was thinking if he could charge his spring tail when he's in the floor (maybe in a spindash like fashion?), in a way that could launch him upward as a quite high jump-- to add more to that, he could perhaps jump on enemies after spring jumping, in case he still kept his tail twisted like a spring when landing. No, I'm not sure how well that would work, but it's just an idea.

I also wanted to talk about his aiming... it seems off that he doesn't even looks at the direction he's aiming, and pretty much just twists his arm up and down as if he was some robot. It's just weird, and could use some work.

And still, don't get me wrong, I'd love to see Fang being playable, given that it was an unexpected addition, and surprisingly good of a character choice at the same time... but so far, this is a purple cowboy Yoshi.

This post has been edited by MotorRoach: 20 July 2015 - 08:53 AM

[Flare]

Can you shoot while fluttering? If so then for the shooting mechanism this makes it incredibly useful, could see him slowly descending while enemies try to hit you.

Still think we should allow for some humour in our unofficial and uncommon games and this made me smile and want to play his style.

[MotorRoach]

Flare, on 20 July 2015 - 09:02 AM, said:

Still think we should allow for some humour in our unofficial and uncommon games and this made me smile and want to play his style.

Are you telling me that Fang's addition is literally meant to be a joke?

[Flare]

Is it a bad thing if he was?

And no I am not implying anything, just that one of the great things about making your own game of an existing IP is experimenting with things that you might not expect. I like the idea of the cross over between the mechanisms of other games and Sonic, in this case the Yoshi series.

If the goal was to make me want to pick up a controller and play his style of gameplay, then it worked. It is of course not to everyones liking, so what develops from this is down to Hez.

This post has been edited by Flare: 20 July 2015 - 09:53 AM