[Chimpo]

We're aware of most of issues our game currently has, but appreciate you listing them. They will be fixed in future demos. However, my plan this SAGE was to give people basically a progress report of where we are, so I had no intention of skipping SAGE.

You probably should have stuck to videos, screenshots or information on your website. A bad demo can leave a bad impression. Just look take a look at Bionic Commando. Wonderful game, terrible demo.

[Sonic Warrior TJ]

I appreciate your honesty Chimpo.

I'm not afraid to admit that yes, this is indeed a very early build. There are still several things left to do with the existing level as far as hazards and "character" are concerned. One of the main reasons we released such an early build was just to see what people had to say about it while it was still this early in development (so your words have definitely been noted, Chimpo). Unfortunately, we just ran out of time before we could add more features. We also used SAGE as a way to interest any potential artists or programmers who may want to help us along the way. There will definitely be much more to see and do in the next demo we release, no doubt about it!

This post has been edited by Sonic Warrior TJ: 27 July 2009 - 01:21 AM

[DM Ashura]

We're aware of most of issues our game currently has, but appreciate you listing them. They will be fixed in future demos. However, my plan this SAGE was to give people basically a progress report of where we are, so I had no intention of skipping SAGE.

You probably should have stuck to videos, screenshots or information on your website. A bad demo can leave a bad impression. Just look take a look at Bionic Commando. Wonderful game, terrible demo.

I'm pretty pleased with the reception we've got so far --- and it's starting to recruit more graphics and programming assistance. So I'm happy with the direction we're going.

[Sonic Warrior TJ]

Me too. Haha, we already have a better signpost.

This post has been edited by Sonic Warrior TJ: 27 July 2009 - 01:32 AM

[Endri]

Actually, as from the moment anyone play the game, it's easy to assume the current state of the project is that it's clearly a work in progress, so, making a harsh review, as if it was a completed comercial game isn't going to help it improve at all.

From what I've seem so far, the game has a very well developed concept. The game is highly interesting, and have a lot of potentioal to be explored. It's a lot enjoyable. The game is original and very creative. I personally found the Special Stages (or Bonus Stages, for the matter) very unique. The game art is exceptional! The backgrounds, the scenaries and the sprites are custom, and gives a very original feeling for the game, which is awesome. The level design is good, as well as the itens placement, and makes the game feel just like a original Sonic game. In fact, it looks like just what Sonic might've turned out if it was released to the 32X after Knuckles' Chaotix. The gameplay itself is very good, and the character swapping is a very interesting concept, which can be developed to be something awesome. But, the game has many gameplay flaws, like, getting bloqued by the wrong foreground plane, getting stuck, spring bugs, etc. Mostly because the game is still in a development porccess and is still a tech demo I assume. By no means it's a bad game, mind you, but it still doesn't look like a proper 'game' yet. Other than that, It seems to have a lot of potential, and I really hope you to keep up the good work.

Also, I DO encourage the use as multiple builds as necessary, in order to improve the game, and the experience for the players. After all, it's still a W.I.P, and a fangame being developed by (correct me with I'm wrong) amateur programmers with no experience with professional game development programming at all.

I worked in many companies as of now, and I must say that the progress made is no different, only that it is faster, and you have to deal with deadlines. So this project is pretty much in the right lead.

By the way, about what Chimpo said, SonicCD was all about "pointless" loops.

This post has been edited by Endri: 27 July 2009 - 01:45 AM

[Overbound]

Actually, as from the moment anyone play the game, it's easy to assume the current state of the project is that it's clearly a work in progress, so, making a harsh review, as if it was a completed comercial game isn't going to help it improve at all.

I gotta disagree there. I mean its a work in progress yeah and I'm sure they know in fact I know they know about most of the problems. But at the very least having them listed makes it easy to remember and fix. At the most Chimpo spent a good deal of time going over the demo for them, with positive intentions to help make the game better. Chimpo probably wasn't trying to be harsh just honest and truthfully who would spend that much time writing something just to be nasty.

Since 2006, I learned that a critical analysis of my games by other people is one of the best ways to make it better. Doesn't mean you have to hang on their every word but it does mean that you listen. I think Chimpo did a good thing and I think Ashura and Sonic Warrior are handling the critical analysis very well.

[Chimpo]

I apologize if it comes harsh, I'm just trying to give my honest critical opinion here. I'm not posting just to tell them "OH MAN YOUR GAME SUCKS!". I seriously want them to improve it because I was looking forward to this and I hope they do improve by the time of any future release. I did spend a lot of time on this demo so it wasn't just a review based on a single playthrough. The only way I was able to write that critical review was by playing the fuck out of it.



Seriously.

(I was listening to some other shit that distracted me from this -V)

Actually, as from the moment anyone play the game, it's easy to assume the current state of the project is that it's clearly a work in progress, so, making a harsh review, as if it was a completed comercial game isn't going to help it improve at all.

I made a review based on a demo. A demo's purpose is to get people interested in the project, whether it's just to play the game, or support it by contributing. It's also meant to show off what the project is entirely about. I merely expressed my views of the demo, mainly the second part because there's no way, as an outside party, can contribute to the first part. The review is only based on my viewpoint. I do not speak for anyone else.

From what I've seem so far, the game has a very well developed concept. The game is highly interesting, and have a lot of potentioal to be explored. It's a lot enjoyable. The game is original and very creative.I personally found the Special Stages (or Bonus Stages, for the matter) very unique. The game art is exceptional! The backgrounds, the scenaries and the sprites are custom, and gives a very original feeling for the game, which is awesome. The level design is good, as well as the itens placement, and makes the game feel just like a original Sonic game. In fact, it looks like just what Sonic might've turned out if it was released to the 32X after Knuckles' Chaotix. The gameplay itself is very good, and the character swapping is a very interesting concept, which can be developed to be something awesome. But, the game has many gameplay flaws, like, getting bloqued by the wrong foreground plane, getting stuck, spring bugs, etc. Mostly because the game is still in a development porccess and is still a tech demo I assume. By no means it's a bad game, mind you, but it still doesn't look like a proper 'game' yet. Other than that, It seems to have a lot of potential, and I really hope you to keep up the good work.

Why couldn't you express your opinion without attacking mine? This post would have been fine like this. You expressed YOUR personal opinion on what you've played. They want everyone's input, whether it be positive or negative.

By the way, about what Chimpo said, SonicCD was all about "pointless" loops.

I didn't like that game either for that reason (level design), what are you getting at here?

Please refrain from attacking me if you have no real reason too.

[Sonic Warrior TJ]

Whoa, very nice. I'd like to see a speed run video of that.

Someone should make a Time Attack video of all the SAGE games.

[DM Ashura]

(stuff)



(more stuff)

...

Holy shit.

I know we don't have a number of things implemented in our game, but if our level is capable of being completed in such a speed this bodes well for a time attack mode. :D

I'll just need to figure out how to challenge you along the way, Chimpo.

[Chimpo]

Haha, I knew that would get your attention.

Unfortunately I must inform you that the time was only obtained by an exploit I found during my play testing.

It appears that you set the keys A, S and D to different speeds. Upon pressing these keys, Sonic goes to that speed immediately and begins to slow down. If you keep spamming it though, you pretty much stay at that same rate of speed the entire time.

All I had to do was find a route and abuse this exploit.

Course, just because I could exploit something, doesn't mean I didn't try to match it with legit old rage inducing jumps.



I could possibly get it down to 49 seconds if my trigger finger didn't hurt.

[Matwek]

Im happy with the critisism so far, im glad people like the art.

As for the level design I think that just falls down to limited communication. I just designed the levels then passed it on to the programers not really having much understanding of the process and not quite 100% on how sonic/metal would perform in game. Probably needs to be a bit more comparing of notes.
Also it is only the second level of a LOT of levels, wanted to keep the learining curve fairly shallow at first. Pretty tricky to judge without the counter weight platforms, crushing pillars and working badniks but are people more in favour of a slow intorduction to the game and its controls or straight from the get go all out character swaping and puzzles?
Secondly are people more in favour of being able to finish the whole level as one character or the other taking seperate routes, or would they prefer forced character swaps at certain points like Heros?

[RGamer2009]

Im happy with the critisism so far, im glad people like the art.

As for the level design I think that just falls down to limited communication. I just designed the levels then passed it on to the programers not really having much understanding of the process and not quite 100% on how sonic/metal would perform in game. Probably needs to be a bit more comparing of notes.
Also it is only the second level of a LOT of levels, wanted to keep the learining curve fairly shallow at first. Pretty tricky to judge without the counter weight platforms, crushing pillars and working badniks but are people more in favour of a slow intorduction to the game and its controls or straight from the get go all out character swaping and puzzles?
Secondly are people more in favour of being able to finish the whole level as one character or the other taking seperate routes, or would they prefer forced character swaps at certain points like Heros?

If being forced means more puzzles...I am all for that. Just don't make it so that one character can simply beat the level without the other character's input. That would break the game and the concept.

[DM Ashura]

I personally think that forced is necessary for the game to be worth it ... otherwise we'll have Sonic Advance, where you go "Hey, Sonic can do a flip kick!", do it twice, then never use it again. If you think about Knuckles' introduction, there were parts you *HAD* to glide or climb to get past the levels.

I think once we've got more stuff implemented, you'll see why Metal will be useful. He'll be able to cross gaps Sonic can't, hit switches Sonic can't, destroy spikes (woo hoo throwback to Sonic CD), etc.

This post has been edited by DM Ashura: 27 July 2009 - 10:39 AM

[Overbound]

Im happy with the critisism so far, im glad people like the art.

As for the level design I think that just falls down to limited communication. I just designed the levels then passed it on to the programers not really having much understanding of the process and not quite 100% on how sonic/metal would perform in game. Probably needs to be a bit more comparing of notes.
Also it is only the second level of a LOT of levels, wanted to keep the learining curve fairly shallow at first. Pretty tricky to judge without the counter weight platforms, crushing pillars and working badniks but are people more in favour of a slow intorduction to the game and its controls or straight from the get go all out character swaping and puzzles?
Secondly are people more in favour of being able to finish the whole level as one character or the other taking seperate routes, or would they prefer forced character swaps at certain points like Heros?

I didn't mind the level design my self. But I will tell you that its a good idea to draw your levels on graph paper first and look at Sonic level maps over and over again for inspiration at least that's how I do it.

[Black Squirrel]

Low framerates are common with Game Maker games. As are long loading times. I think there's a tool that will clean the game up a bit to make it perform better, but generally you need a reasonably decent PC to achieve perfect results

My machine couldn't get it above 17FPS except for in bonus stages. It's just one of the letdowns of Game Maker.

This post has been edited by Black Squirrel: 27 July 2009 - 11:28 AM