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The Sonic the Hedgehog Continuity Thread of Love and Timelines

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by dredd, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    This actually makes some (more?) sense, if you think about it. If that Phantom Ruby that Eggman found in the prequel comics were the same gem from Mania, and Classic Sonic and the Phantom Ruby came from Mania at the same time, why would Classic Sonic take 6 months to arrive? Besides, there's a line after Classic Sonic defeats Chaos in which Tails says something like "this power that Eggman is using is affecting other dimensions somehow". The real Phantom Ruby was not Eggman's doings, but the prototypes were. I myself don't think these two pieces of evidence are conclusive at all, but you know.

    However, that concept art might be an original idea that was scrapped in the final version, since the prequel comics doesn't show the real Phantom Ruby like that. And as I said before, I asked Ian about that in his live podcast and he said (at 1:46:36): "I am assuming it is the real one because... it originates in Mania, and then somehow appears in the Classic Era (not the Classic, stupid!) the Modern Era, and Eggman finds it outside his base. And then bases the prototypes off of that. From my understanding".
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2021
  2. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    Just to add a bit: if the Phantom Ruby in Mania were a prototype and not the real one, another thing that you could explain better is its effects. The Phantom Ruby in Forces is all about illusions/virtual realities. Both Infinite's prototype and the real gem in the prequel comics work like that. But in Mania, it's not clear if all of that was illusions - and it doesn't look like it. If it was a prototype, it makes sense if it doesn't work as expected.
     
  3. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    The opening cutscene of Knuckles and that the Phantom Ruby's effects 'shatter' in certain instances (read: Metal Sonic) suggests that it's similarly illusionary in nature and only affecting those it catches in the 'bubble'.
     
  4. _Sidle

    _Sidle

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    The transformation of five Egg Robos to the Hard-Boiled Heavies look to be real and permanent as of Encore Mode (and IDW).
    upload_2021-12-1_8-1-36.png upload_2021-12-1_8-7-41.png
    Giga Metal on normal Metal Sonic and the Phantom Heavies on the normal HBH do make sense to be illusions given the circumstances.

    Unsure what to make of the intro cutscene for Knuckles... The rumblings of the Ruby being extracted are clearly the same event happening in both, and Knuckles is only just offscreen from Sonic and Tails.
    upload_2021-12-1_8-35-59.png
    The Ruby activating in the S+T scene should be both heard and seen (due to the large expanding radius going past the wall) in the K version, if there were two separate activations as proposed.
     
  5. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    (0:15)
    And yet, as the Phantom Ruby flies into shot, it's glitching out, suggesting it was activated.

    My thought, the Illusionary Field is similarly illusionary. It's only seen by those who have a line of sight, like Sonic and Tails in one scene, Knuckles in another. Not sure if there's much evidence for or against this thought.

    Not sure how IDW will handle the whole Phantom Ruby thing, perhaps it can be taken as the Heavy King being constructed in 'reality' after his effectiveness in the illusions? Encore Mode can also be indicated to be still within the Illusionary Field, since it features Sonic being drawn into the field, then 'spat out' in a different area.

    Anyone else notice something about the opening half of Sonic Mania's levels?

    Angel Island Zone - 'reality'
    Green Hill Zone - first living thing affected is Sonic, and that's 'his' Zone. Robotnik grabs the Phantom Ruby, and then...
    Chemical Plant Zone - Robotnik owned chemical plant.
    Studiopolis Zone - Robotnik owned TV studio.
    Flying Battery Zone - Robotnik owned battery.
    Press Garden Zone - Robotnik owned news printing factory.
    Stardust Speedway Zone - Robotnik owned future world.
    Hydrocity Zone - Back on Angel Island.

    I kind of like to think those levels are Robotnik taunting Sonic with a world owned by him, before kicking him back into 'reality' where the Hard Boiled Heavies, perpetuating illusions like Chaos, Shadow, Metal Sonic and Zavok are, can harass them as they make their way to the Little Planet, where Robotnik has shown them.
     
  6. Linkabel

    Linkabel

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    To be honest the situation with Knuckles and Angel Island doesn't make a lot of sense.

    Supposedly the island fells again because of the Ruby, but Knuckles is just chilling?

    Seems like the island is still grounded going by the Super Sonic cutscene where he gets warped to Forces. The background in the scene looks more like Never Lake too than what we saw in Sonic 3 (just the sea) or Sonic Adventure.

    So was the Ruby interfering with the Master Emerald and that grounded it? But when it was off the island was that Eggman's doing?

    Even in Mania Adventures the island was grounded too, so not sure what was going on in that.
     
  7. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Considering where Sonic and Tails approach and that they came in full tilt, perhaps he was waiting for them?

    Considering Angel Island has moved to intercept the Little Planet (Lava Reef Zone transition), that implies the island is afloat again.

    I consider Encore Mode to be the Phantom Ruby doing a last ditch attempt to kill Sonic by screwing around with his previous adventure, hence the similarities and differences. Angel Island being grounded is because that's how the adventure 'started'
     
  8. Levi Church

    Levi Church

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    So then where is the Mania Phantom Ruby in Forces?
     
  9. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    It's hovering around Classic Sonic guiding him like an invisible Omochao.
     
  10. Forte

    Forte

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    Do You think we will se other gems in mainline Sonic Universe? I mean, the Phantom Ruby was a neat idea, I wonder if there are more gems with special powers.
     
  11. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    I remember someone saying (don't know if it was IIzuka, or some fan speculating) that the Time Stones aren't present in the Modern continuity because Sonic Team wants to simplify things and let the Chaos Emeralds be the only gems.

    And now they create the Phantom Ruby which nobody understands exactly.
     
  12. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Chaos Emeralds - Chaos is Power
    Time
    Stones - Self-Explanitory
    Phantom Ruby - Illusions of the Mind
    Warp Topaz - Spacial Warp...

    I kinda do :eng99:
     
  13. Levi Church

    Levi Church

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    You forgot the
    Sol Emeralds

    Now all we need is reality, which could be one of the things I am just now finding out about from Sonic Shuffle like the Forcejewel or the Precioustone. Never played Shuffle so I know nothing about them

    UPDATE: Just learned Sol is a reference to the Roman mythology Sun God.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2021
  14. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Nah, I'm counting all the gemstones in the main universe, rather than alternate dimensions. :V
     
  15. raphael_fc

    raphael_fc

    Overthinking Sonic timelines. Member
    And that's why Solaris came from the Sol Dimension a long time ago and was entrusted to the royal family of Soleanna, which actually got the name from Solaris. Just like the Chaos Emeralds are named after Chaos, the Sol Emeralds are named after Solaris (which makes an interesting duality water versus fire).

    :ruby:
     
  16. Plorpus

    Plorpus

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    The Phantom Ruby is a bit of a special situation since as far as I’m aware it was originally just a one-off plot device for Mania, and they decided to replace Sonic Forces’ Valtron machine with it mid-development in order to tie the two games together. They pretty much just find+replaced the word Valtron with Phantom Ruby in the script, meaning now all the powers the machine had belong to the gem from Mania despite not appearing there, and now it somehow has prototypes and power sources.
     
  17. Levi Church

    Levi Church

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    Does Sonic Shuffle have good lore or meh? Where is it in the Sonic Timeline?
     
  18. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Post-Sonic Adventure, I'd place it directly after and pre-Sonic Advance, but that's just me:
    [​IMG]
     
  19. Dark Sonic

    Dark Sonic

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    Wait that was the plot of Advance 3? Eggman pulled an Unleashed? I honestly had no idea that intro cutscene was not clear.
     
  20. BlackHole

    BlackHole

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    Yeah, he split the world into seven pieces with Chaos Control. They start warping as well, with Chaos Angel being some sort of perverted Angel Island.