If you jump right before the elevator starts going up, then you'll get some extra hang time enough to hit him.
I'd say the problem with Metal Sonic is less a problem of his being overused (although I understand that) but more how relatively weak he is. He only really serves as a minor boss who is a bit of a pushover. Sonic 4 tried to make him more of a central threat, so I'll give them credit for that. But in Gens, Forces and even Mania, Metal just kind of appears and gets beaten. In Mania he at least poses more of a threat as a boss (since his boss fight is longer and harder than the average boss), but he still just is a minor boss. In Sonic CD, his actual boss fight is rather simple, but he has a much more central role in the game. Same with Sonic Heroes.
It's easy to hate the Hard-Boiled Heavies: you just don't want a Looney Tunes version of a Sonic game, but, hey, if that's ok for you, you have Robotnik doing "chuu! chuu!" on the train too. Knuckles looking ridiculous when Death Egg launched from... well... launch base, was the highest comedy level I could accept in a classic styled Sonic game; what happens in mania may be ok for modern games or tv shows, but I don't need that kind of things in a wannabe classic game save for Robotnik's surprise face when he's defeated or his running animation. Oh, for everyone who didn't notice yet, I like to play Mania, but I'm far from loving it, I have a lot of complaints about its design. The game may be solid but it's not the kind of Sonic game I played 20 years ago, just the best trying to get near that.
As long as we have languages that are gender conscious, that's bound to keep happening. Some people are just now getting used to saying they/them when what pronoun to use isn't immediately obvious, because it can save some embarrassment in a public setting. :v: I like that two of the Heavies are women. Female characters are next to non-existent in the classics, so it's refreshing and gives them a little more character. (And who could say no to one of their pets?) Overall, I love all five of them and their boss fights. (Especially thought it was neat how one of them uses the infamous spike stars from Sonic 2 as throwing stars.) The fights were great at adding some engaging complexity, while staying firmly within the mechanical simplicity Sonic is known for, much like Sonic 3's bosses. I think there's a ceiling with how much you can do with bosses when there's only one button for combat and platforming; the devs did well at respecting the classics.
Which is funny, considering how he apparently thought less of Blaze in Rush because she was female: OVA isn't canon, but he also tried to forcibly wed a teenage girl in that movie as well.
The one thing I found interesting is how different and well executed the HBH are, even when knowing about the "more advanced" E-Series robots. Everything about the Egg Pawns is lazy by comparison.
So, in other words: In seriousness though--I don't really get Mania's heightened wackiness as a complaint or being uncharacteristic of classic Sonic, or those elements being examples of "modern" humor. Check the supplementary materials for classic Sonic, even back then--the television shows (particularly AoSTH, more serious / story-driven stuff like SatAM, and Underground didn't completely shy away from this either), the comics/manga, the OVA, and even official game artwork, animated shorts (Man of the Year, CD's ending animation), and television commercials for Sonic products, both in the West and (especially) in Japan. Cartoonish elements is far from a new element to classic Sonic, let alone an alien concept (we're talking about a character designed after Western cartoon icons like Felix the Cat and Mickey Mouse, after all). I'd also say that embracing those elements also gave Mania some actual personality/character to it, which I think helped the game stand out compared to the Genesis titles in a positive way (especially so given the accusations the game got as being a "lol ROM hack" early on). For me, the added levity for me is an example of the developers knowing how to have some fun when putting the game together, and also helped established some personality of the characters in an official game that you'd otherwise only see in the manual. That's not even getting into how we've seen what happens when Sonic goes in the opposite direction and takes itself way too seriously.
Sonic has had its Looney Tuney moments here and there since day one, like the trademark wheel-of-feet itself or Robotnik's "ash face" after defeating a boss. I'd say that the TMS "Man of the year" short probably had the most accurate non-game interpretation of the style that Sonic Team was originally aiming for, so the extra cartooniness in Sonic Mania is very welcome in my book. I think that, at least for Classic Sonic's look and feel, it all comes down to a good balance between anime-ish and cartoony... and hey, it's not like Mania has an army of anvils falling on Sonic's head or anything. =P
I have a confession: I didn't even know that the HBHs were transformed from Egg Robos, I just thought the Egg Robos found the Phantom Ruby, teleports the main character, and the HBHs just show up. :| That's okay though, a lot of people don't know that the main animated opening has two different tracks. :v: One is the main one everyone knows, the other is a a different tune with sound effects. I found this out accidentally when leaving the title screen idle for the second time.
Well, two things about what I said before: - First, I'm not sure on how to explain the way I feel about it, so I didn't like very much how it sounded, but I hadn't anything better and I still don't have it. I suppose is more as how cartoon momentos or anime moments are presented, since I always enjoyed those anything but serious moments like Sonic's or Robotnik's faces when they're hit, and I like mania's animations at the beginning of chemical plant, when the drops hits them. I think it has to do more with the style they're drawn, or also with the general tone and the number of moments that kind of scenes happen. Maybe if drawn differently and shown in a slightly different manner, I wouldn't mind it, but it bugs me the way it is. - Second, while it's quite obvious the classic games are the same for everyone of us, what they means to us is very different, and the graphical geometry with that abstract feel the first games had made a huge impact in me, and the whole trascending background life and balance against artifice and corruption, the animal saving the nature from the hand of the greedy human, defines my point of view on the classic series, the way I feel it myself, so, when it's reduced to some wacky fight between the cartoonish hero and some comedic henchmen, I reject what I see. Both points aren't so differnet, and I'm afraid I might not be expressing it the best way I could, but the feeling is there and I can't agree with the HBH's presence and anything related to them. But it's obvious they nailed it for most fans and newcomers, so that's why I've been refraining from expressing my concerns about the game.
Mania is relatively standard momentum based platformer as far as speedrunning goes and doesn't have better speedrunning featuresets or design than the original Sonic CD released in 1993. Don't shit your pants. It actually possibly has less speedrunning features than Advance 2 by completely knocking bosses on the head for its Time Attack mode (which to me I interpret as tactic admission that the games bosses are not good design for speedruns which even if it's correct it's still kind of weak) and has less pulse with modern speedrunning culture than 2014's Freedom Planet by the complete absence of any consideration for people who like to speedrun the entire game rather than individual levels. Then you have Mirage Saloon 1, a level so decidedly not designed for speedrunning it's quietly missing from Time Attack altogether. I don't usually like pissing on fun this hard but Mania is not a high standard for speedrunning and I bristle with annoyance that anyone would consider it as such. It's decidedly middle of the road in this field.
This isn't true at all. Sonic Mania levels have multiple paths that will need to be considered for speed running, with areas for optimal speed and precision timing. This is the same with Sonic CD but this wasn't considered - later zones are much more maze-like and pace killing for sure. Just because there's a reference to sky chase in 1 act doesn't mean the entire game isn't possible to speed run...
I just checked my Switch and no updates or patches are available. Got my hopes up that the super transform button on the PC version was finally added.
Alright, I'm a bit late (like over a month) to the party but I'd like to give my opinion on the game. I joined this community just so I can gab non-stop about it to people who'd understand. Overall, I loved the game. It has a lot of replayability given the multiple paths, unique experiences per character, and overall enjoyment. It wasn't perfect (far from it), and I don't rate it as highly as most, but I still found it very fun and I'll play it over and over again. I played the PC version, so my gripes are based on that. My complaints: - The game relied too much on nostalgia and past references, and didn't really add much new moving forward (minus the Drop Dash). - Not enough new Zones (which is made even more aggravating given how good the new zones were). - The endings are very lackluster, and I was disappointed there were no animations during the credits ala Sonic CD. - Denuvo's inclusion. - Zone transitions being in some Zones but not others felt jarring (how the hell did Sonic get out of that pit in Hydrocity Act 2?) - Can't select Acts from level select. - Didn't seem like there was enough Knuckles-only content compared to 3&K. That said, I felt Taxman, Stealth, and company did an excellent job. My favorite parts of the game include: - The new Zones, especially Studiopolis and Mirage Saloon. - There are enough new content added to the revamped Zones to feel like a new experience (but would have liked more new Zones). - The Hard-Boiled Heavies are quite possibly my favorite bad guys not named Ivo Robotnik. - The music. Enough said. I have the same reaction to someone mentioning the music in this game as others have when someone mentions the breadsticks at Olive Garden. - The boss fights were creative and a few made you think for a second on how to beat them as opposed to "jump on them 8 times." - Knuckles & Knuckles - Metal Sonic fight was fantastic. - The elemental shields having more impact on the game (i.e. Flame Shield burning the rolling spike logs in Green Hill). Yeah, I know I'm not adding much new to the conversation, but here it is. I just like talking about this game. I quoted someone but I misread what they said the first time. Disregard if you happened to see it.
Looks like it just brings it up to the PC version controls (Super button, modified debug mode controls) and whatever bugfixes are actually in the PC version.
So, we appear to have finally got an update for the PS4 version, which is great news. It looks to be mostly the same as the day one patch for the PC version, from what I've looked at. However, there are new problems introduced, which is a little weird. Score is no longer saved on save files (it appears to reset to 0 on load), for example. Also, seeing as the initial update has been released, could we have the Sonic Mania Post Release Bugs/Fixes thread re-opened, please?
