What was the point of + - having Kocos if they resemble Chao so much, anyway? They're just stone-like beings that lived inside the Ancients which then became the Chao.
+ - No. The Koco have the spirits of the Ancients inside them, who then die. Someone earlier said that they think the last generation became chao or something.
That's what I gathered from this game too. + - Ir would mean that whilst the Ancients mutated/evolved into the Chao seemingly very suddenly. And then the specific Chao that eventually became Chaos due to the Master Emeralds radiation or whatever had essentially reverted to his original form. It's interesting, potentially. But my biggest criticism of Frontiers' story is that it did nothing which that huge lore reveal. It was a huge shock when you saw the Ancients on Kronos and then... Nothing. Lame. But yeah, Chao and Koco aren't interchangeable. They've got similar origins, but the Koco aren't even supposed to be alive. /iSpoiler]
That's kind of what I meant, + - they are stone-like objects worn by the Ancients inside their bodies that later were reanimated with their souls after they died. I'm not sure if every detail is exactly clear in Frontiers and there's a lot of speculation but that's what I could gather. It feels like a lot of work when Chao already share some of the backstory and could possibly serve the same purpose.
Nah, I actually really disagree with this. + - The Chao are child-like, innocent creatures who just like of exist doing their own little thing. They're presumably what became of the Ancients that survived The End. The Koco meanwhile are very aren't even supposed to be alive. They contain the spirit/will/memories of Ancients that perished and they themselves seem to "die" when they've fulfilled their last lingering regrets. So even though they're very clearly related, they have very different purposes. If the Chao represent the survival of the Ancients, the Koco represent their death. Putting the Chao into this new tragic position would undo some of their simplistic charm and appeal. I also don't know quite how you're reconcile it story-wise. Is there any problem with them sharing similar related origins? It just adds to the depth of the story.
Spoiler I like the idea that the chao evolved from highly advanced intelligent life forms to babies Sonic and friends force to race each other
I have problems so I got the PS5 version during the sale last week. This time I'm making a point to get all the memory tokens on the map, instead of just exploring blindly, so I'm running into little things I didn't experience the first time. It's kinda nice. I wasn't sure how I would feel going back to it after a couple weeks, even though I really enjoyed my first playthrough, so I'm glad I'm still having a good time. Are the bugged out water effects at the fishing spots a universal thing across all versions? I guess I didn't expect to see that on both PS5 and Series X. Must have just been something they couldn't iron out before release, even though it's pretty glaring and obvious. Bothers me more than any Open Zone pop-in ever will, but oh well. Also one thing I found odd that I haven't seen talked about yet: when Sonic is on his way to fight Giganto he just...flies across a body of water. I mean, there's taking a running leap and then there's hopping into the air and DBZ-flying at a constant speed/trajectory. Just seemed weird. Maybe he's air boosting but there's no effect to indicate that, and again, his trajectory doesn't change until he lands on the other side. Has he turned into Super Sonic enough times now that he can fly short distances in his base form? Or maybe in an earlier draft, he already had all seven Emeralds at this point and was originally supposed to be in Super form on his way to Giganto? But then why run at all and only fly across a lake? Just not sure what their intent was with that.
The intent was "hey, wouldn't it be cool if Sonic glided over the water, DBZ-style?" From the same minds that brought you "what if Sonic Spoiler killed a motherfucker with its own sword? "
I have removed the entirely unrelated music chat from a different bame. @LetTheSpeedMendIt1 , you're skating on extremely thin ice. Stop it.
I beat the game last week and waited to give my thoughts on it after I gave it sometime to sit on my brain and I think it was overall...fine. Not entering my top 5 or even top 10 Sonic games but I enjoyed it through and through and don't regret paying full price for it. I just wish there was more to do. I wish there was more to accomplish in the open zone other than getting the emeralds, memory tokens, and emeralds. There's no overtly memorable set pieces or moments that stand out to me a week later. It's competent but not fulfilling. Overall a great first experiment into the open zone but I hope the sequel increases things drastically.
+ - Egg Memos 11 explains this a little, and then we can try to fill in the blanks based on what we're given. The memo explains that the Ancients are relatives of Chaos. Whilst that's obvious to us just from looking at them, the Ancients probably aren't even seen by anyone before the visions displayed in this game. The memo goes on to say that the Ancients DNA was corroded to go the point that they became a new species over countless years. And it also specifically states that this was down to radiation affecting them for years. We know that Chaos was a Chao mutated by the Master Emerald. We also know that the Ancients found their way to Earth when the Chaos Emeralds powering their ships were drawn in by the Master Emerald, and that the survivors of The End took the Chaos Emeralds to the Master Emerald. Filling in. The blanks, the Master Emeralds radiation turned the Ancients into the Chao, and eventually somehow turned one Chao into Chaos.
I'd imagine the same reasons mighty big cats eventually became the tamed house pets we know today evolution has simply proven it is more effective to spend all day getting pets from an owner instead of surviving in the wild
If you're talking about the glitchy artifacts that appear flickering in the water during the camera transition, I'm pretty sure those are an intended feature. Sonic travels to Cyber Space to fish so the entire pond has a glitchy aesthetic like the rest of the levels. It's funny because the pop-in is so glaring everywhere else that it makes it difficult to tell whether the artifacts are real or not.
No, I think he's talking about the halo effect around objects in front of water, most obvious with Sonic himself during fishing. I don't think it's intentional. It looks absolutely fine in any still screenshots, but it's jarring in motion.
I also ended up thinking it was decent. I think the issue with it is that it's a Sonic with an open world imagery, but lacking the elements that make those games fun. You can even see Iizuka acknowledging this in interviews. They were adamant to calling it an "open zone" game, and they were right since at the end of the day this is an action/adventure/platforming game. But at the same time it's also lacking some of those elements as well. It's a game that it's strengths are also their weaknesses, so it feels like its essence is in this state of conflict. I think this is another thing that makes the game lose steam. Even though yes, you're running in a big "open zone" you still get thrown into this very linear platforming that immediately takes control away from you. I'm not saying there's not the odd challenging platforming section, but in the majority of them it's honestly better just letting go from the controller for a bit because the dash panels and springs are going to guide. And you taking control of Sonic might result in making him fall off. But this brings me to my main point that O wanted to make. This is from one of the IGN interviews: When they were explaining what the game was going to be about I was really hoping the islands were going to feel like the Adventure fields. But I think they kind of missed the mark. Even with the limitations of the era, the Adventure fields feel alive and click so well with the world that was established in the classic games. Station Square feels like a city that Sonic might've visited in the past. The Egg Carrier evokes imagery of Eggman's battleships from Sonic 2&3K. But the most important Adventure field is Mystic Ruin. It really shows that Sonic Team learned a lot during their trip across Mexico and South America because in a way the small areas of this field do feel like there's forgotten history behind it. And how they tied the imagery to the mystery of the echidnas, the emerald and Chaos worked perfectly. How they naturally integrated the levels to them also feel like they're expanding the world more then adding something foreign to them. The use of NPCs also make those areas more real, since the events happening in the game also affect them. Ideally Starfall Islands should feel like one big Mystic Ruins Adventure field, but it really doesn't. And I think it's because they wanted to have their cake and eat it too with using open world imagery. For example, instead of using the BotW shrines imagery and portals, wouldn't had been better if the Cyberspace stages would've used the island assets? And entrances like how you go access levels like Emerald Coast, Ice Cap or Red Mountain to name a few. They could've had a Kronos ruins beach Cyberspace level, oasis Cyberspace levels, sky/clouds/lava theme Cyberspace levels etc etc. That would've taken care of one criticism of them reusing Generations assets out of the way, and given them a chance to expand the areas more that they couldn't fit in the "open zones." Dare I say the game would've had less flaws if it would've been a more linear experience, especially with the story. Or they could've added more challenges that didn't involve the map challenges or platforming areas. Perhaps after completing all the required and optional character interactions they could've give you time challenges or harder guardian fights that gave you more bonus stuff. The game also needed a bigger skill tree because you basically have everything before or around the midpoint of the game. Someone mentioned the Chao, and if there was a game that needed a garden this was it. You could've at least used some of those skill points or fruits to give to your Chao after leveling up Sonic. They could've just said the Chao migrated there after Perfect Chaos destroyed the world in the past and a colony was formed where they thrived cutoff from the rest of the world. Didn't need to be more complicated then that. I know I went on a rant, but it pains me that this game had so much potential and could've been greater than it is. Here's hoping they don't throw what worked, listen to the criticisms and don't throw the formula away for the next game.
Spoiler You know actually I forgot some chao are intelligent, they have jobs as doctors and principals and shop owners, cheese is smart and Cream can understand him. Their language is incomprehensible to most like the ancients and the koco. So their evolution can make some sense I guess, they got cherub-ified. But Sonic and friends do make the babies race and fight each other that is true. And their parents just sit and watch… or fight them.
