In the past, a malicious part of me hoped Sonic Origins would come out and flop dead on its face That part of me must be, at the very least, somewhat pleased right now
This is one of those times where I feel like I must be playing a different game than everyone else. Or more likely, everyone else who likes it has been drowned out by the people who don't. There's plenty of even-handed criticisms to make, Origins ain't perfect, and I do hope Sonic Team and Stealth get to put at least one final coat of polish on it. Digital Foundry's breakdown was perfectly fair, I thought. There's room for improvement. But as far as core gameplay goes, most of what's different falls in line with what I expected from Mania and the mobile ports, and with a handful of exceptions, these aren't even detriments, they're just differences. Aside from the Tails respawn bug, I've had nothing but a great time with it. The mission mode was way more fun than I thought it'd be, I love speed running the boss rushes, and the new animations brought tears to my eyes more than once. It's been a blast to play through some of my favorite games again. Especially Sonic 3 & Knuckles, I'm SO happy we finally got that remaster we'd been waiting for for what, nine years? So yeah, it's a thumbs up from me, I'm happy to see it getting a lot of 8s, and I hope it'll get even better.
I get where you're coming from. I bought it for Switch hoping this is going to be the ultimate edition of all the classic sonic games and this would be my only way to play moving forwards but there are some odd things going on in this collection. The tails AI in Sonic 2 is driving me up a wall. The roll lock for the drop dash in Sonic 1 & 2 makes me not even bother with drop dash among another issues. Oddly enough it works great in Sonic CD. But then Sonic CD has weird music looping issues. For Sonic 3 I could careless about the music changes but the physics are not exactly correct. Maybe its just me, and maybe I'm taking crazy pills. I cant put it into words but there are parts of the game I'm struggling with that are not an issue in S3 Complete or A.I.R. At the end of the day I'm going to do my time honored tradition and beat Sonic 3 with all the characters and emeralds and then sink back to A.I.R and the other Sonic Decomplications. I 100% agree the Mission Modes and boss rushes are a lot of fun along with the Museum itself. I really really hope they let Taxman and Stealth fix this because I know its not their fault and it has potential to be the best versions. I just don't feel like Sega is going to give this anymore attention and move on.
The rolling jump lock wouldn't even have been an issue if it weren't for the drop dash. It's one of the biggest glaring oversights in the collection IMO and it's utterly insane that no one in development thought that it was an issue. I like the collection otherwise but after installing a mod to remove the rolling jump lock, I can't go back. I hope it gets patched out for all you poor poor console players because it really is that bad.
It's even worse for marketing when they treat this as just something they wanted to push out to please Sonic fans. They should definitely let Stealth and them do what they need to do to get this back on track, because I want to get Origins but I feel like I shouldn't because of the criticism surrounding it. The music, for one thing. Blue Spheres and Ice Cap Zone use the prototype tracks we know and love but Carnival Night Zone seems like it's from an earlier prototype or something? Like, what? This is just one of the many things that people are upset about, too.
The physics probably don't feel right because Sonic 3 is literally built on top of Mania, and you can feel it thoroughly since Mania was just kinda built slightly differently than 3&K. Things are ever so minorly off as a result, areas that Mania lifted feel about the same but cases like the Eggman chases will throw you for a loop with the new physics altogether until you adjust. The Insta-Shield being back to what it used to be still makes it real fun to cheese bosses and enemies, though. I found out for the first time by personal testing on my story mode playthrough that I can actually insta-shield through the Big Arm spikes when he's roving the floor, not sure why I never did that before.
My dislike of the game 100% has to do with the horrific performance issues on PC. I don’t want to invalidate anyone else’s opinions (and I also have not played the game yet because I can not afford to drop $40 on a game that many are reporting will not open on PC) but the retro engine versions of 1/2/CD felt great to me and, while I grew up playing 3K, I don’t think I know the game so well that the physics differences will bother me. Especially since I loved how Mania played So tldr I probably agree with you however I think we shouldn’t forget that the performance issues on PC are a major factor contributing to Origins’ perception. While you’re here tho I wanna say that I LOVED your recent video on the 6th console generation. I was younger than you during that era but my views on gaming were shaped by retro game sites and personalities (Retroware TV/Screwattack/Gaming Historian/AVGN) whom I suspect had similar views to u. Given that your video gave me a lot of perspective on my own gaming preferences. Looking forward to your future uploads (especially if you’re still doing a vid on secret rings)
Sonic Origins fixed a bug? Oversight? That really didn't need to be fixed. On the Mega Drive, in Launch Base Zone Act 2, after defeating the Egg Cannon, if you're Super/Hyper Sonic you'll revert back to regular Sonic when you beat the boss. In Sonic Origins, when you beat the boss, you stay in your Super/Hyper form. This isn't a necessary fix, since the original bug actually helps you. Because of the time it takes to get from the level to the Big Arms arena, there's a chance you might actually run out of rings. In the original, due to this oversight, you can preserve your ring count before fighting the boss. I believe this happens in A.I.R. too? I don't know, I haven't played that in a long time. I'm one of those loonies who plays the original Mega Drive version :p
Doesn't really sound like an oversight at all to me. Sounds thoughtful, if anything. Yeah, silly change.
This definitely doesn't happen on the original 16-bit versions. I know because I always used to make it a point to go into the bonus stage (and try to get a shield if applicable), so I could use Super/Hyper Sonic against the bosses. Otherwise I'd usually run out of rings during the cutscene. I think Sonic 3 Complete might have made you drop out of super form automatically there, and AIR definitely did. (And in either case, you had Super cancel in those games anyway.)
I literally went and fired up Sonic 3 & Knuckles and on my end Hyper Sonic reverts back to regular Sonic as soon as I beat the Egg Cannon Need photo proof?
But what about the original Sonic 3? Does Super Sonic revert after beating Egg Cannon and before Big Arm?
In this Sonic 3 & Knuckles longplay, Super Sonic turns back into regular Sonic: 49 minutes 22 seconds. In this Sonic 3 (stand-alone) longplay, Super Sonic remains Super: 1 hour 6 minutes. I assume these are both using unaltered ROMs in Genesis emulators.
Origins has a lot of problems. The Tails bug in Sonic 2 is legitimately atrocious. The sound mixing is very poor. There are a lot of minor glitches and annoyances. But honestly I think what's really happened is on a grander scale. It's 2022 and not 2013. We no longer live in a time where the Whitehead and Headcanon versions of the Classics are the only wide-screen versions. I think a lot of people took for granted that we have Sonic 3 AIR and even something like Sonic 2's Community Cut. In other words, the Whitehead and Headcanon versions are no longer the clear cut definitive versions. And I think it's a good thing that there are more options available. Sonic 2 Community's Cut and Sonic 3 AIR provide a more authentic 'Genesis feel' than the Retro Engine for those that prefer it. Then there are games like Sonic 1 Forever that build upon what the Retro Engine games did and provide a different experience. It's why I didn't buy Origins on PC. I doubt it'll become the best version for mods. There are already versions of the Classics on PC with much more customizability and modding possibilities. I bought it on Switch to experience the Collection in a portable and easy to boot up way when I want to play the Whitehead and Headcanon versions. And despite the bugs, I really do think Origins is a good way to play the Classics in that way.
The confusing bit is that Josh said he got as many rings as he could with Super and Hyper Sonic, which means we're talking about S3&K, not S3 alone. If these are unaltered Mega Drive ROMs, something's not lining up.
It's also totally possible that I got used to the behavior in Sonic 3, and proceeded to spend entirely too many years assuming Sonic 3 & Knuckles was gonna do the same thing, haha. Or that I learned otherwise at some point, but forgot! I've rarely played the original release since Sonic 3 Complete came out, after all. Regardless, I'll fire up my original carts and check, too. EDIT: Yep! It's like those longplays showed. In Sonic 3, you don't drop out of Super form after defeating the boss... ...but in Sonic 3 & Knuckles, you do! And these are both likely to be early revisions... I got Sonic 3 sometime in the summer of 1994, and Sonic & Knuckles the day before the game was scheduled to launch. So that must've been what I was thinking of! To conclude this odyssey, I concur that it IS pretty odd that they'd revert an & Knuckles change like that. The layouts tend to match the full version, right? (1UP in Hydrocity's wall chase, easier Launch Base, etc...) So I doubt this was intentional.
Is it bad that I'm not sure if Hyper Sonic in the intro (after you get all Super Emeralds) is a glitch or not? I think it's cool, so I hope not.
question, where did those extended releases come from? I got the files at some point but don't remember where, and they have names that include "custom 12'' version" on them. Were they released for the 2011 remake or were they released somewhere else first?
