Ken Pontac and Warren Graff are implied to be no longer writing for the series.

Boom is not solely written by them (worth remembering they did SOME stuff for it); rather it’s representative of the era as a whole.

Sega wanted to make Sonic drop everything it was doing to be more of a light situational comedy in the past decade, and Boom (the show at least) is like a pure manifestation of that.

Removing them alone isn’t going to make that go away, but them actively removing them and RCS could be symbolic of them changing their angle. Emphasis on could be.

EDIT: If Maekawa wrote both Riders games then that’s maybe the only game since SA2 he was able to keep it together lol. Removed them from the post for accuracy, because my point still stands otherwise. An extreme shift in tone isn’t necessary.

 

Zootopia isn't Pixar.

 

That’s literally what I’m saying, man.

They aren’t solely responsible for it, but they were hired and pushed to write the way they were for a reason, and that reason was to deliver what Sega wanted.

My argument is that we could do much better than feeling like it needs to be one extreme or the other (since I see people pitting the SA2-06 era vs the Pontaff era), but instead we’re splitting hairs on my phrasing. Lmao

 

yeah like, Sonic can have stakes, but the non-stop melodrama of pretty much all the non-Heroes games til Unleashed was poorly executed and in many ways poorly conceived. I really hope we're not going back to "it is time to give this new character a lengthy and tragic backstory; time to do 30 levels in dull realistic environments!".

we...really didn't. Amy was still an annoying screechy fangirl in that game instead of being a bit more independent in her motives like she said she would in SA1, and that's something that bugged me as a literal child when SA2 first came out. and Knuckles says he'll guard the master emerald at angel island forever at the end of his......which doesn't make an appearance at all in SA2. He just shows up with it in pseudo-egypt arguing with rouge about it with no explanation. It's really bizarre.

 

Knuckles’ story in SA2 starts you off in a cold-open state like Sonic’s where you didn’t see how the story began, as its assumed Rouge stole the emerald and Knux caught up to her at that location. That’s fine by me.

Amy in SA2 is anyone’s guess but it doesn’t bother me. Her growing up some didn’t have to mean her personality and motives completely changed.

It’s only by Heroes when the characters start to lack rhyme or reason altogether, and/or stagnate.

 

we...really didn't. Amy was still an annoying screechy fangirl in that game instead of being a bit more independent in her motives like she said she would in SA1, and that's something that bugged me as a literal child when SA2 first came out. and Knuckles says he'll guard the master emerald at angel island forever at the end of his......which doesn't make an appearance at all in SA2. He just shows up with it in pseudo-egypt arguing with rouge about it with no explanation. It's really bizarre.[/QUOTE]

Shadow's was the point I was trying to make... But even if you ignore Tails' character development, and Amy's to an extent, At least they had growth from SA1 to SA2. I hated Heroes so much because all of the character development in the Adventure games was ignored for "This time there's no way out of marrying me." And with the last decade they've just devolved more and more into 1-dimensional caricatures of themselves. I want consistency of characters across the games.

 

Amy's arc in sa1-sa2 wasn't "I'm not gonna obsess over sonic anymore", it was "I don't need an idol, I can be strong on my own".

A girls version of tails's arc, if you will, but whereas tails focused on stepping out of his hero's shadow to become a hero of his own, amy was about not needing someone stronger to always be by her side, and how she can be an independent go-getter on her own. At least, that's what I picked up. :p

 

Exactly! And that's shown by her being the one to save Sonic from Prison Island, and by her convincing Shadow to help them in their cause at the end.

 

I do agree with everyone though that heroes was a huge step back for amy. Literally her entire tilt is an over the top marriage proposal disguised as a 3d platformer adventure.

I think she was a tad better in 06 though. Still a little sonic happy, but she was back to being strong and independent again, helping silver and elise to no end (until sonic happened again lol)

 

Honestly, while a bit bland in execution, I kinda like how Amy isn't quite as obsessed with Sonic and steps up as a leader in Forces. It feels like a natural progression of the "I'm a strong capable woman" arc that started in Adventure. I think part of that (for me at least) may come from Cindy Robinson's performance being informed by a more serious, less obsessed Amy in Boom combined with the odd if an ultimately good idea to make her a leader in the resistance. I can't say how different it comes across in the Japanese dub, but I think it's a rare instance of positive character progression in Forces.

You have to consider that in CD and most of Adventure, her first response is "Sonic help me" or to go running to Sonic for help. Thereafter, Amy was always doing things for herself (even if Heroes hyper fixated on her fangirl tendencies).

 

This. You put it perfectly in a way I couldn't. I now consider this to be my go-to statement on Amy's arc.

 

I'd rather the writing be good on its own merits, too. I'm not really interested in saving the series's public image or anything, though.
As it is now, I feel that the Adventure games had my favorite writing. I like its odd mix of "something interesting enough to get me invested on a first playthrough" and "really fun to joke about with friends in hindsight". They're endearing, which is more than I can say about Colors-style writing, where characters just stand around in boring locations with boring camera shots, spouting boring lines while boring music plays. Colors had some big stakes but you can't really feel it with just how low-energy everything is.
The "Saturday morning cartoon" approach is something I would like if they could at least make it something exciting. If I were a kid I would never get up in the morning to watch something as tedious as Sonic Colors. I don't have any problem with this series taking itself as seriously as it did in SA1 and SA2.

 

In the context of Sonic, I take this presentation more seriously than shit about Shadow's gritty past or apocalyptic alien invasions, yes.

 

I think Pontaff and Graff were good for the series and that their unpopularity in the fanbase is very unfair.

They were far better than anything that had come before Colors. They wrote characters who talked to each other like people actually do rather than just spout exposition at each other. That's the main problem with the Adventure games, in that the plots were generally good (if very melodramatic in Adventure 2's case) but the dialogue script was absolutely dreadful outside of a few heartfelt lines.

I mean, take Sonic and Tails' meeting in Sonic Adventure:

Spoiler

Tails: Hey Sonic. Long time no see, huh?
Sonic: I'm just glad you're okay. What happened anyway? You're too good of a pilot to just crash like that.
Tails: That was a test run using a new prototype propulsion system. It's got a few bugs to iron out.
Sonic: Why not just use my plane, the Tornado?
Tails: Thanks, but you gotta check out my newest power supply! Ta dahhh! [takes out a Chaos Emerald]
Sonic: WHOA! A Chaos Emerald!
Tails: Yep! I just happened to find one of the 7 Emeralds during one of my test flights. This thing has unlimited powers, ya know... So I figured, why not use it to power my plane. Super charged! You gotta come over my workshop, Sonic! I've got something I've gotta show you! It's in the Mystic Ruins. The fastest way is by train. Let's go!

This is how most dialogue in the Sonic games was until Pontac and Graff came on board. Adventure 2's dialogue is a lot better and more natural, but still falls flat on its face sometimes in spouting exposition:

Spoiler

Sonic: [Looks up] What?

[A black colored hedgehog is seen on top of the defeated Big Foot holding a Chaos Emerald.]

Shadow: [Holding up the Chaos Emerald] It all starts with this...A jewel containing the ultimate power...
Sonic: [Surprised] That's the... Chaos Emerald! [Walking toward Shadow] Now I know what's going on! The military has mistaken me for the likes of you! So...where do you think you're going with that Emerald!? [Starts running toward Shadow] Say something! You fake hedgehog!
Shadow: Chaos Control! [Activates Chaos Control and quickly warps past Sonic]
Sonic: [Surprised] Wow...he's fast! Hey, it's not his speed. He must be using the Chaos Emerald to warp!
Shadow: [On top of a building] My name is Shadow. I'm the world's ultimate life form! There's no time for games...farewell. [Uses Chaos Control to warp away]
Sonic: [Blinded from the light] Kuu! Shadow...what is he?

Pontac and Graff definitely deteoriated in Lost World, but their writing was still chops above the above, presenting genuine characterisation and interplay between the characters' different personalities:

Spoiler

Dr. Eggman: I hone your abilities, I equip you with the most powerful mechs I can create, I even give you a giant sandwich, and you still disappoint me. [Blows on Cacophonic Conch and the Deadly Six fall to the ground] I'm a compassionate man...
Sonic: That shell looks like trouble.
Tails: Hold on a second... Sonic? I think that thing in Eggman's hand is--!

[Sonic jumps up and kicks the Cacophonic Conch out of Eggman's hands.]

Sonic: Gone. Eggman's shell is gone.
Dr. Eggman: That was a mistake.
Sonic: Whatever! When is it a mistake to take your toys away?
Dr. Eggman: When it's the only thing keeping six angry Zeti from controlling my mechs, you moronic hedgehog!
[The Deadly Six take control of Eggman's badniks and make them aim at Eggman. Then they make the badniks shoot.]

Zavok: Strike, brothers! Make the fool pay for our abuse and enslavement!
[Sonic is seen dodging and lasers. Orbot and Cubot are dodging lasers too. Cubot's body gets dis-attached from him and Orbot catches his head. In the process, his voicechip is ruined]

Cubot: Yar! Shiver me timbers!
[Zazz and Zomom jumps onto Eggman's Egg Mobile. As Zomom jumps onto it, Eggman falls out. One of the lasers burns his mustache. Sonic is seen destroying a few badniks while dodging lasers. The rock Tails was hiding behind is destroyed and Tails falls. Sonic comes and picks him up.]

Sonic: I hate to run away from a fight Tails, but I don't want to see you get fried.
Tails: Not getting fried would be nice...
Dr. Eggman: Orbot! Cubot! We are leaving!

The above scene has a perfect example of what is good and bad in Pontac and Graff's writing. It has a strong focus on characterisation but a very unfortunate penchant on awful jokes. But in all fairness, it isn't just spouting exposition and is far above the standards of the Adventure games.

If they do bring in a new standard writing team I hope they were at least better than who worked on Forces, which really was like regressing fifteen years.

 

Eggman had a lot of problems in Adventure to 06. The biggest was how repetitive it was to have his plan usurp him at the last minute. And then of course Adventure to 06 were horribly convoluted and Eggman was often caught in that convolution.

But on the whole I think Eggman worked better in Adventure to 06 when he didn’t have sidekicks for him to dump exposition. It kept his plans a secret and so his plot would unfold over the course of the game, thus providing narrative thrust to the game. One of the biggest problems with Colours onwards, is that his plot is more or less spelled out in the first couple of scenes so the rest of the story is spent killing time until the final boss.

But also I think Eggman works better when there is less of him. He feels more treating that way and then when he does appear, he usually steals the scene. One of my favourite Eggman moments is in 06, when Shadow busts in and Eggman is like "Wouldn't the door have been easier?". It was a simple line but it just oozed Eggman's personality. Ever since he's had his sidekicks to dump exposition on, he's lost a lot of those scene stealing moments. Of course not having sidekicks doesn't mean that he can't interact with any one. He still should interact with other villain characters and even his creations. But just having some sidekicks that have no other purpose than for him to bounce exposition of don’t do the character any favours.