They should delay this. They let Mania, they should let Forces. Going against Mario Odyssey with this is foolish. Push it to April or May to get some better level design and flesh out the OC a bit more, and it may be salvageable.
I mean at the very least the first stage is supposed to leave the best impression. And the Avatar character's Green Hill is supposedly later in the game. So...I mean.
Nice! You know I always forget about this track. Steve Conte is great and it's a shame Sega didn't make use of him more. You could definitely slip this into a normal playlist without much chaos.
I noticed it before coming back to the forum, and hoped no one had answered before I edited the post, but it was too late. I edited it, anyways. EDIT: Just to avoid double post: I agree about some or your points, and I think you should say some things in a different way, but the most important thing I have in mind when I read your posts is: Why is this guy here?". It's obvious that you don't get along well with the points of view shown in this forum, and I don't know if you're fan of the classics, but you're indeed a fan of the modern games, and, still, you're posting in a forum with the name "Sonic Retro". I'm just saying you may be getting unnecessary bitterness for struggling with this fanbase. Don't get me wrong, is OK that someone tries to balance things a bit, it's just that you don't seem to be enjoying this all.
Sonic Retro isn't exclusive to fans of the classic games. If we're going to split people up on what type of Sonic they prefer, I really question the point of the general discussion on this site. I personally prefer a good Modern Sonic game over a good classic game. I just feel that the modern games are good to a point, and it's that one catch that makes it that much less worth it. Sonic Adventure 1, Unleashed, and Colors being my favorite 3D Sonics. I'm more of a Modern Sonic guy myself. I respect what he has to say, it's just that I have a hard time getting where he's coming from in a lot of the arguments given. It's just that some of us disagree with each other sometimes, and we discuss it. The whole point this thread is up is to toss out what comes to mind about the game and its details. Doesn't mean to leave and go to some site where everyone agrees with each other. That just resembles an echo chamber. I personally prefer the everyone disagrees with each other nature of Retro more Discussion tends to have a purpose, and as much as people like to say "Retro sucks", I actually find myself learning little by little in these threads. Worst comes to worst, we just agree to disagree.
I just meant that it looks like he gets nothing but bitterness by being here, I already said it's good to have people trying to balance things from the opposite point of view.
The theme is bad. Not even good-bad. The thing about the classic Crush 40 buttrock was that they themselves thought it was good. It felt like they didn't give a fuck and had fun with each and every song. This one feels like, "Hey kids, I know whats hip." It just feels so dumb. The rhythm is right and has some great parts, but the lyrics and voice leave me so confused. I'll admit, I don't know if Jun Senoue/Crush 40 are even involved in song writing in this game, but if so, what happened? It'd be like if they continued FLCL and asked The Pillows to write a new sountrack, but they decided to have a drunk 70 year old with dementia, who has never heard of The Pillows, write the lyrics with the dictation of "stay true to OUR style and how we sounded 15 years ago... Oh, and make it modern." (also, Hoobastank? Fucking seriously? What's next, Nickelback for Sonic Mania?) The reviews are really disheartening to read, but I'm not shocked. I'd like to see the full 3D style of Adventure/Heroes return than the 2.5D we've had since Unleashed. The "Modern" style doesn't feel very distinct to me when most of the levels just play like Classic with a boost button. What the point? I hope they delay the game. Just go all in with Mania this year, delay Forces to at least early 2018. Hell, delay it till June 2018 just so you can keep it with Sonic's birthday or whatever. But, I do think it may be is time for a new or fresh set of eyes on the 3D/2.5D/Modern/whatever you want to call it style of Sonic.
That's they way it's always been. Half the people who like buttrock Sonic themes like it for the cheese.
I dunno. Doesn't seem so farfetched to me. Forces is expensive as fuck to make because making stages for a boost game has to be, just because of scope. And Sonic Team hasn't seemed to be able to get a real good return on their 3D ventures with other playstyles. Then there's the barely muted...disrespect or whatever SoJ seems to have of SoA products that makes me doubt they'd say "we don't know how to do this. Halp us SoA" and hand over all Sonic responsibilities. I just finished a 14 hour shift and can't sleep so if I'm not making sense, go sit on a cactus and rotate. Edit: Yes Nickelback please. I want this more than my next breath. At least have a vocal track for a stage called Maple Hill Zone by them. And yes, it's Green Hill, but with syrup. I want this now. Somebody make this happen.
I know full well there are people here that hold personal grudges towards each other. It sucks and that's what usually kills discussion and ruins the thread for everyone. There are at least 3 people right off the top of my head on this site that will get insulted simply for saying anything at all, no matter how its worded. I'm somewhat newish here since I come in short bursts and vanish for months; I have no clue what drama goes around. But you'd be making the site better by not letting it become some echo chamber.
Don't get me wrong, that's why I enjoy it too. There's a point when you try too hard and the cheese goes stale. My point was in the past the cheese was there simply because they had fun doing that, or writing songs that way. Now, it feel like it's become a chore or something they HAVE to include.
I don't get you, or you didn't get me, but I said that because of the unhealthy way he seems to be carried away, which results in some things he says sounding quite disrespectful to others' opinions.
^I know, but at the same time peeps here shouldn't take everything personally. I can still think your a cool dood and yet we disagree on a lot, I know a few people where I can't agree on anything with but still talk about dank memes. If he's really getting worked up over this, I'll say this here. It's not worth it, or I'm not worth it if it just feels like your talking to a wall. Chill and do something you enjoy, take a break from Retro, but know that through the internet a whole lot sounds more offensive than it really is, even if benign. There are a couple of jerks, but that's not representative of us all, and most of the people here who come across as jerks hold some kind of drama against that person. I used to go "Oh crud, someone disagreed with me on the internet. Did I say something wrong?" a while ago, but you learn it's really not that big a deal. I disagree with a lot of peeps in real life, doesn't mean that's reason to just stop talking to them, or its suddenly something negative.
That theme is well and truly shit. It was better without lyrics. What the hell is happening with the music in this game?
Law of averages. Every video game series and composer has their share of bad tracks and Sonic has dodged this for a very long time. Karma has come to collect, and it's taken the form of a Tomoya Ohtani who has completely run out of ideas and has resorted to imitating Sonic R. Except he doesn't have Richard Jacques' ingenuity so it comes off as a crappy version of Sonic R.
I wondered if Jun helped out with the vocals and lyrics this time. It seems that even though he wasn't part of the soundtracks like Unleashed and 06 he was still involved with the vocals songs, wasn't he? I'm always been surprised the Modern games under his supervision did not have more vocal songs during levels since they tend to lend themselves to that. Case in point: [media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REZLQRHeAeo[/media]
What helped the Crush 40 themes back then was despite the cheese lyrics, the instruments and their compositions were extraordinary. Open Your Heart made great use of the electric guitar- especially the segment associated with the lyrics "Can't hold on much longer" through "Open Your Heart, it's gonna be alright!" (I guess you can say the refrain). Live and Learn is another great example where the guitar inexplicably paints the picture of space and impending doom. So IMO, as long as the instrumental picks up the slack the lyrics can be as cheesy as they want. "Fist Bump" misses the mark in both lyrics and composition for me. It sounds like a lesser version of Reach for the Stars which I wasn't overly fond of to begin with.
I wouldn't say the issue in fist bump is the vocalist or the composer, I think it's just that the song wasn't designed with vocals in mind from the start. I listen to it and I'm like, "okay, cool, but where does it pick up?". Didn't have that issue with the instrumental, but with the vocals I was expecting it to add that much more to the melody. To his credit, he does vary from the main melody a bit, and that's where I think it sounds the best.
