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Sonic 3 Complete

Discussion in 'Engineering & Reverse Engineering' started by Tiddles, Dec 25, 2009.

  1. Fred

    Fred

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    For what it's worth, we've been considering removing slot continues from the next release altogether -- much like Knuckles turning into Sonic during the fade out, it's due to a direct copy/paste from Sonic 1, and we've been fixing those kinds of oversights where we find them, such as 2P Tails vs. the Metropolis boss and this curious oddity.
     
  2. D.A. Garden

    D.A. Garden

    Sonic CD's Sound Test Member
    Apart from the fact that you shouldn't be able to get Sonic into that path, as it's a Knuckles only route, this is a known issue that is present in the original Sonic 3 and Knuckles as well, although it loads special stage results instead. From what I understand, in that area, it has to replace the background with a new layout to accommodate the rising floor segment. If you go too fast (Super/Hyper running, Hyper Dash, or fire shield dash) across the load point, it can't load the changed background fast enough and instead something goes wrong. I'm not the best at technicalities, but I believe data overflows in RAM, and the game mode is changed. In my hack, I had to change the layout, intentionally slowing you down to prevent it.

    Also, while I'm at, some of the spikes in Hydrocity Act 1 that use Object 6B (Invisible harmful object) can be stood on, due to the way the objects are placed. Here's an example:

    [​IMG]

    This can quite easily be fixed, though.
     
  3. Brainulator

    Brainulator

    Regular garden-variety member Member
    Yes, except I'm talking about a lower point 10.

    Okay, so... how else would I get more continues besides 50 rings in the slot machine bonus stage? Does that mean it's only going to be possible to get 14 continues total?

    Why am I so concerned about those things anyway? Just spin dash in Launch Base Zone alarms and get as many 1-UPs as your heart desires.
     
  4. D.A. Garden

    D.A. Garden

    Sonic CD's Sound Test Member
    It doesn't really matter what Point 10 you are referring to; the glitch is caused by the same issue, so my post still stands. The only thing that's different is the discussion regarding Sonic not being able to access that area, which is now incorrect, so my apologises.

    Also, could you not quote what I say and spell check it? I think that's kind of rude. I can see for myself that I have typed the word shield wrong and it don't think it makes much difference. I have corrected it in my post anyway.
     
  5. Brainulator

    Brainulator

    Regular garden-variety member Member
    Well, okay then. And sorry about being a grammar nazi there: I just tend to mock spelling errors when I see them because I have the time to do pointless, trivial nitpicks like that.
     
  6. Overlord

    Overlord

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    Well, DON'T. Being an arse needlessly won't score you points with the staff.
     
  7. Sid Starkiller

    Sid Starkiller

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    You could always purposely lose Special Stages to farm them. Probably more tedious, though.
     
  8. Brainulator

    Brainulator

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    That is true... unless you've already gotten them.
     
  9. Dark Sonic

    Dark Sonic

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    Honestly the save system made continues completely redundant. I'd just strip them entirely.
     
  10. Felik

    Felik

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    I always viewed the amount of earned continues shown in the file select menu as some sort of penis length measure for how good you are at playing Sonic 3 :v:
     
  11. Clownacy

    Clownacy

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    Isn't that how Nintendo treats lives, these days? I still get a nice buzz from accumulating a bunch of lives in S1/S2, and Mario 3D World rewards you for collecting 1100 of the things, making them a collectable rather than something you actually use.
     
  12. flamewing

    flamewing

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    This looks like one of those frame-perfect bugs I am good at figuring out; has it been fixed? If not, I can take a look at it and see what comes out.
     
  13. Beltway

    Beltway

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    Speaking about the lives system and Mario, has anyone working on S3C thought about a "difficulty" mode that has Sonic 3 Complete play similar to other (contemporary) platformers? Rings aren't tied to S/T/K's health and act purely as currency (aside from the obligatory 100 rings = 1 life rule) and can't be re-collected; and the player loses a life if attacked without a powerup one or two times. (Alternatively, take the Unleashed route and have rings halved every total hit, rather than being unaffected by the player's health completely; with ring loss still permanent.)

    ...admittedly, this is something I've been interested in seeing being implemented into the Genesis games as a whole, not just Sonic 3 Complete in particular. I'd still like to see how such a change alters the difficulty curve for the classic titles as a whole.
     
  14. Fred

    Fred

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    I'll happily point out that S3C hasn't shown lives/continues on the save screen for a while now. :)

    Yes, I fixed it. It actually has to do with the crumbling platform leaving behind dirty object RAM after it deletes itself, and then the animal object spawns on the same slot and ends up triggering some leftover Sonic 2 animal capsule code of all things.

    For what it's worth, I've considered including a "Mario mode" in some shape or form -- rings only buy you lives and you need a shield to take an extra hit. No guarantees it'll make the cut, though.
     
  15. redquebec

    redquebec

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    good news. Can you tell us more about what we can expect from the future release?
     
  16. Brainulator

    Brainulator

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    Yes, but I chose to use the IPS patch to display them mwahahahahaha

    But wait, doesn't Sonic 3 alone/& Knuckles/Complete saves delete your save file if you lose all your lives and continues? I'm not sure, and I don't have the time to check. In fact, continues do indeed help for no save mode.
     
  17. Fred

    Fred

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    Yes, because apparently people won't stop asking. You can expect an emphasis on bugfixes and overall graphical polish, more classic sprite options, a streamlined customiser and whatever else is ready by the time we decide to make a release. We've always had big plans for S3C but following through with them is another matter entirely.
     
  18. Tiddles

    Tiddles

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    No. You go back to 3/0, as in a new game, but you continue from the zone you reached.

    This is presumably why continues let you restart from your last starpost in S3&K rather than the start of the act, because they really would do nothing otherwise. They're still different from 1ups in that your score is erased after using one. But it's not saved in the file anyway, so who cares?

    I dunno, man, 16-bit platformers just tend to retain a bunch of irrelevant arcade conventions. It's not like an attract mode is remotely useful either. That's just how you do it. It's part of the charm I guess.

    But yes, lives and continues being removed from the save screen by default is partly to discourage any need to go on a collectathon to consider your save file complete. It's also because the screen looks like a dog's dinner compared to S3A with all that extra info being added.
     
  19. flamewing

    flamewing

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    Haha, that is a fun bug. Hm. Now I am wondering if it is possible to abuse it in stock S3&K for time gains in a TAS. Not exactly with an animal, but by manipulating another object to spawn on the dirty slot.
     
  20. Brainulator

    Brainulator

    Regular garden-variety member Member
    There is that post Tiddles made back in 2014...
    Thanks. In fact, keeping continues is kind of like keeping pennies as currency: no practical value, but they're so sentimentally lovable that you can't help but keep them. Also, imagine what the save screen would look like with only lives displayed.