Almost 8 hour long video about why Sonic CD is a masterpiece

8 hours, blimey.

If anyone is mad enough to make an 8 hour vid on Sonic CD I'll give it a listen whilst I draw tomorrow.

 

Plot Twist: it's actually a 2 hour video repeated four times with different soundtracking and color grading on each loop

 

Sonic CD would have made an excellent Dreamcast title

 

Call me a simple man. When I play Sonic games, I like to hold Right. CD is not a game that allows me to easily do that. It is, however, an excellent Knuckles game in Origins, but that game gives you no incentive to participate in the games mechanics (at least the 2011 port had achievements to nudge the player towards them). It's easy enough to get 50 rings and do the special stages (Especially thanks to Origins coin retries), but if you were playing the original releases, I could see the value of going after the generators instead of taking a risk with the special stages if aiming for a Good Ending.

Regardless, Origins with Knuckles is the only ever way I'll go back to play this game (Ultrafix mod update coming soon™?). I do wonder how other characters would maneuver these levels. How long until someone attempts to port Chaotix crew into the Retro Engine? Or what about the Mania DLC duo? I bet playing as Ray would be really fun to avoid Wacky Workbench.

 

Well I was born in the late 70's and was on the internet in 96- on the day when Fighters MegaMix launched in Japan (remember it well) and I can't remember much talk of Sonic CD then tbh, other than along with Thunderhawk, it was the only game worth getting on the Mega CD. In those times most talk was of how Mario was so much better than any Sonic 2D games, with the joke of to play a Sonic game, was to hold right on the joypad.

I loved Sonic CD for the time travel element and also the music and unlike the Sonic games before it was a challenge to finish. All that said, I so much rathered Quackshot on the MD to any Sonic game

To be honest I think that was more of the case of Sonic Mania, where it seemed that just a bunch of random stuff from Sonic games was put in there with no planning or proper stage design and just thrown in for the shake of it. I've never got the praise that game gets. I thought Sonic Frontiers levels were very well planned and mapped out.

 

Yeah I’m starting to feel like general video essays need more editing for time constraints versus stream of consciousness. I might be biased because this comes from an academia perspective of having to write a ton of research papers, but if I submitted a 50,000 word paper when the expectation was around 4,000 words, my professor would not read it all.

I also have ADHD so I am never watching these ridiculously long essays. I love Sonic CD! But I don’t need to listen to (or watch) an 8 hour essay to have my opinion validated. I get that there’s a general sense of “the longer the video essay is, the better it is”, and that’s not the case! You can make your point in 20-40 minutes and I’m sure people will stick around for it.

 

Brevity is the soul of wit. I can almost guarantee all of this could be said in an hour or an hour and a half. Max. Haven't read the summaries in the thread (thanks to those that have made them though!), but this is my take whenever anyone does an analysis of this size (or longer).

Alternatively, if (and it's a huge if) you need 8 hours to analyze something, split it up into parts.

As others have said, it's very hard to motivate myself to watch someone praise Sonic CD for this amount of time. And this is from someone who adores Sonic CD. Hum.

 

The video would maybe be more aptly titled if it made reference to the fact that it talks about a kind of general theory of Sonic that has Sonic CD at its center, rather than just praising Sonic CD. He may have to need to make the case that what truly sets Sonic 1 apart from other platformers from the time is what he calls its "emotional world" (the way the levels progress thematically, aesthetically and mechanically giving you a sense of responsibility and emotional attachment to that world, to Sonic as a character and to who you are as the hero of that world) to talk about what he likes in CD, but the sections about Ristar, Nights, Mania and even the comparisons to Sonic 2 and Sonic 3 & Knuckles are absolute unnecessary to this point.

But he ends up talking about a heritage of game design that he likes, but that isn't really confined to Sonic CD. That's why the video is 8 hours long, although I'll argue it's another methodological aspect of the analysis that I can't really agree with, because that heritage, or tradition, seems really important to him, but the articulation pretends to be about CD when it kind of isn't. You could very well have this be one hour long to accommodate the many examples he likes to use for each argument.

 

I got the internet in 1989 and was on compuserve when sonic cd released in the west, and throughout the entire 1993 year leading up to that christmas, you definitely heard a *ton* of talk about it. I dont doubt you didnt see much discussion about the game 3 years later during the 3d boom, but in 1993, the known internet definitely buzzed about sonic cd.

 

I always find it odd when people say that Sonic CD was not very accessible before the 2011 remake that was published for Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3, resulting in cult status.

Sure, the Mega CD was not very popular, no argument there. But millions of copies made it to people who bought a new Windows PC, followed by a retail release the next year. Then in 2005 it got re-released as part of Sonic Gems Collection for both the PlayStation 2 and the GameCube.

Is it because Sonic Gems Collection was a GameCube exclusive in North America, meaning it wasn't accessible to the majority of gamers there? I guess that'd be another example of North America dominating video game discourse.

 

In the case of Gems Collection, it doesn't seem to be a North America thing. The collection just didn't resonate in any market. Its critical reception was mixed with the only praise being strictly for Sonic CD, but buying a game collection just for 1 game seems like it was a tough sale. For the Gamecube NA release, it did eventually get a Player's Choice re-release in 2006, but the requirements for that is a pretty low 250k unit sales. Seems more like a lack of interest than accessibility.

See the attached slides below for details. I also linked the relative reports.

I think being an easy download and the cheap price for 360 and PSN played a larger factor for CD's wider adoption in 2011 than any of the other previous re-releases. That and the fact that it was hyped up as a touched up version with all the improvements.

2006 - Mega Collection Plus makes the list, but Gems Collection did not

​

2005 - Gems Collection not listed. Shadow the Hedgehog and Sonic Riders were the top Sonic games that year.

​

2004 - The earliest report I can find that's archived. Both Heroes and Mega Collection are still selling.

​

Edit
I found a single mention of Gems Collection. It lines up with the previously mentioned Player's Choice milestone.
​

​

 

Online gaming discussion seems to either be console-centric or pc-centric, not both. There are very, very few communities that truly overlap and discuss both equally. Being a primarily console-centric series, it's no wonder that so many who discuss sonic would have a big blind spot to the PC landscape, where Sonic has been a big thing since Sonic CD.

It's similar to when people will discuss the biggest games around currently, and completely miss several chinese online games which playercounts that completely dwarf the best selling games in the west. Out of sight, out of mind.

 

8 hours...!?

Never change, Sonic fandom.

(Edit: To be clear, I'm skimming this video and it's... actually well made...)

This is actually very true. Sonic was more accessible to PC owners in the 90s, while anything Nintendo was not (until Emulation, which didn't take off until around 1999 or later), therefor, if you were a PC gamer in that era who liked PC platform games (Keen, Duke Nukem, Jazz Jackrabbit, ect. ect.)... Sonic titles were your one and really only part of the console world crossover. That was exactly what happened with me, and it made my fandom instantly... well... much different from that of a standard console player. Hence me still being here, decades later.

 

What's truly surprising is the fact that some people need to be talked at for 8 hours to be convinced Sonic CD is good.

 

Like I said I didn't get on the web until 1996. What I do remember was the hype for Sonic CD which was like it was the 2nd coming (that was the case for the Mega CD itself) with the likes of Tom K saying how Sonic CD will show you what the Mega-CD can do and will do for the Mega CD, what Sonic did for the Mega Drive Ect


Then you had some reviews saying how much depth Sonic CD had over Sonic 1 and 2 which were knocked for being easy to finish (which for me is why SOA went nuts on the difficulty in their games) lacking the replay value of Mario IV, which Sonic CD did at least look to address... with the time travel and also time attack parts. But for most mags and gamers back then the Mega CD wasn't very good and Sonic CD wasn't the best Sonic, other than GameFan Which went ape over Sonic CD, until SEGA America changed the music score, which was your typical idiotic SOA decision, but even then I think most mags were of the thinking Sonic 2 was the better Sonic game


For me, the main trouble with the Mega-CD was so few people gave it the time of the day, or even bought one and just said it was an FMV machine Which was why I also thought a remaster/remake for Sonic CD on the Saturn seemed like such a good idea, given how few of the Sonic fan base had played Sonic CD. It would have been great to have an improved version for the Saturn launch in the West, with lovely near full-screen Cinepak FMV from Sonic CD and far better 3D bonus section





In 1996 you had mags like EDGE still saying how much better Mario was over Sonic (and well Nintendo over SEGA) which is when I got online and I remember being on a messageboard that a few of us who shopped at the same import shop used and even then general talk was Sonic 2 was the best Sonic but with the Nintendo lot still banging on about how much better Mario IV and then me saying how Revenge Of Shinobi Gouls N Ghots and Quackshot were the best platform games on the Mega Drive

Even while we were talking of the new consoles talk would also go back to older systems and even trying to get some members to play the likes of Nam 1975 on the Neo Geo LOL They were really good times looking back

 

From personal experience, there was definitely a prevalent "CD is the best Sonic game evah" view in the online fandom in the late 90s - at least among those that had tried it. It was after the remaster's release that people started complaining about the level design and physics at large. Prior to that I felt I was alone in finding CD kinda unpolished and janky (though I didn't dislike it, I just didn't think it was the best thing since sliced bread).

 

Hey can someone make a thread on my SA2 video? It's only 3 hours long and I think is better made =p

But that said, I've not watched the whole video yet, I did however watch the segment on "Choices" and... I think he's a bit misguided.

He's not got the psychology right, but I think he has got the application of it a little muddled when you apply this to games, it sort of changes, at least with my theory.

Take the basic idea, "Too many choices confuses people." When it comes to what he's describing, it's not so much a choice as much as it's 'solutions'.

Let me explain, in something like Bayonetta, a player can have LOADS of moves and combos, they're not that hard to learn or do, but the vast majority won't learn or do them all, they'll have that sense of confusion or paralysis he describes.

But its not like they don't make a choice quickly. They will likely make a choice of 2 maybe 3 combos/moves that just get them through or simply feels fun to use... then try something else once they get stuck and then revert to something else that feels better.

But with something like a Sonic stage, I believe that most of the design is essentially a series of "Problems" or "Obsticles" that you have to overcome. And whilst you may have a clear choice to overcome this problem, you can have multiple solutions/options to do so.

The best games also mean their solution will have some variation since you'll likely never approach the obstacle at the precise angle/speed/approach each time. Meaning no two playthroughs feel the same even if you're doing the same thing.

(Unless you're speedrunning with literal pixel precision/playing a modern boost game oh ho ho ho ho!).

With CD, these problems tend to have solutions, but are instantly followed by another problem that counters your prior solution. This is why I think people dislike CDs level design, it's this constant battle between you and the level design. No that there's too many choices.


Edit: Now... Which one of you maniacs is going to make a thread on my video!? I will pay you 50 fake pounds to do so!

Edit 2: I typed this on my phone originally and now I'm on desktop I'm sorry for all the errors.

Edit 3: Not a psychologist... But I think that this 'choice paralysis problem' really only works if the choice is a fixed thing that has some resource impact on the individual or major consequence, yeah you order an ice cream flavour, you might not like it/wonder what the other was like... But doing so means you lose money.

Yeah you pick some wall paper... But you not only lose money you also have to deal with your new wallpaper.

Yeah you pick the wrong/do a choice in a videogame you... Just quickly restart or lose a life? The choice paralysis/confusion thing doesn't really work as much when in a videogame the consequences aren't that consequential.

 

Nice video, but I didn't like Sonic Adv 2 and it was such a comedown after the amazing Sonic ADV. Since you speak of Bayonetta I really didn't like that too, it was so overrated for me and not a patch on Ninja Gaiden 2, which for me is still the best action game ever made

 

On the subject of video essays being too long, especially in regards to retrospective videos, the appeal of them has always been someone just gush about something they love for long hours, passionately explain themselves and their thought process.
These videos are not so much trying to argue or persuade you to agree with them; In fact it they require of you to agree with the thesis of them to some degree beforehand. They are introspective rather than arguing for some hard truth.

 

Hope he ran to the ER after having that hard-on for Sonic CD for 8 hours.