[Solid SOAP]

Dark Sonic, on 22 February 2012 - 06:49 PM, said:

I don't buy Sonic games for length, I buy them for replay value. When you think about it, Sonic Generations is almost priced the same exact way (4 stages for $15, 9 stages for $50). Generations is a bigger game by all means, but Sonic 4's stages have 3 acts in comparison to Generations 2 + Challenge stages (And while there are many challenge stages, many of them lack replay value and they're all simply the same levels with layout changes).

Granted, Sonic 4 would be more fairly priced at like $10, but anyone who thinks that a Sonic game is going to be a long adventure is just not thinking straight. Sonic 1 and Super Mario World came out the same year, and Super Mario World is by far a much longer game. Yet they cost the same price. Sonic's about replayability people, not long epic adventures (Which is why I welcomed Colors and Generations with open arms. They got rid of the shit that plagued down 3D Sonic games and made them short, sweet, and to the point with plenty of fun to come back to).

I know this, but 4 stages is undeniably lazy. 5-6 should be the bare minimum, I am pretty baffled as to why they went with such a low number when Dimps have produced average-sized 2D Sonic games in the past, such as Sonic Advance and Sonic Rush. I'm hoping that they'll release one more episode simply for the sake of having a normal sized 2D Sonic game again (8 stages + 2 boss acts).

[Dark Sonic]

Solid SOAP, on 22 February 2012 - 06:55 PM, said:

Dark Sonic, on 22 February 2012 - 06:49 PM, said:

I don't buy Sonic games for length, I buy them for replay value. When you think about it, Sonic Generations is almost priced the same exact way (4 stages for $15, 9 stages for $50). Generations is a bigger game by all means, but Sonic 4's stages have 3 acts in comparison to Generations 2 + Challenge stages (And while there are many challenge stages, many of them lack replay value and they're all simply the same levels with layout changes).

Granted, Sonic 4 would be more fairly priced at like $10, but anyone who thinks that a Sonic game is going to be a long adventure is just not thinking straight. Sonic 1 and Super Mario World came out the same year, and Super Mario World is by far a much longer game. Yet they cost the same price. Sonic's about replayability people, not long epic adventures (Which is why I welcomed Colors and Generations with open arms. They got rid of the shit that plagued down 3D Sonic games and made them short, sweet, and to the point with plenty of fun to come back to).

I know this, but 4 stages is undeniably lazy. 5-6 should be the bare minimum, I am pretty baffled as to why they went with such a low number when Dimps have produced average-sized 2D Sonic games in the past, such as Sonic Advance and Sonic Rush. I'm hoping that they'll release one more episode simply for the sake of having a normal sized 2D Sonic game again (8 stages + 2 boss acts).

Admittedly it would have been better if they had 6 levels with 2 acts and a boss, however if Sonic 4 wasn't episodic we'd likely have gotten Sonic 4 episode 1 with more levels, and would we really want that?

[Solid SOAP]

Dark Sonic, on 22 February 2012 - 07:02 PM, said:

Admittedly it would have been better if they had 6 levels with 2 acts and a boss, however if Sonic 4 wasn't episodic we'd likely have gotten Sonic 4 episode 1 with more levels, and would we really want that?

That's true, however, what I think would have been a better idea would be if SEGA were to have released something like "Sonic HD" or "Sonic DL" or something, a 4-stage mini-game with the production values of the current Episode I. See how well that does, then release Sonic 4 as it is in Episode II, plus 2 or more levels. That would have been my ideal scenario had they HAD to make Sonic 4 the way it is now, but it really isn't worth discussing since there's no changing the past.

[Candescence]

The hilarious thing is, episodic content is supposed to be, ideally, released in short intervals to make up for the limited content per episode. Once again, only Telltale can actually pull this off, Sega is almost as bad as Valve was when it came to the gap between HL2: Episode 1 and Episode 2.

Granted, HL2: Episode 1 wasn't so bad that the next episode required a complete goddamn overhaul, but STILL.

[Solid SOAP]

Candescence, on 22 February 2012 - 07:20 PM, said:

The hilarious thing is, episodic content is supposed to be, ideally, released in short intervals to make up for the limited content per episode. Once again, only Telltale can actually pull this off, Sega is almost as bad as Valve was when it came to the gap between HL2: Episode 1 and Episode 2.

Granted, HL2: Episode 1 wasn't so bad that the next episode required a complete goddamn overhaul, but STILL.

The long gap was probably to make up for the fact that they had to fix the whole damn game so much, I think that if they're planning an Episode III, it'll come out much faster than Episode II is set out to.

[Dark Sonic]

Episode 2 was probably put on the back burner while Dimps worked on Generations 3DS since that was more immediate. They also had to rebuild Episode 2 so it's like making an entirely new game that just happens to have the same name.

[steveswede]

I would think that if the whole point of episodic content was to release in short intervals, then wouldn't they already have the zones, bosses, art style all lined up ready to work on? The "Episode" branding in my mind is just that because if Sonic 4 was just released as one title, it might have come across as underwhelming compared to the originals. This way it makes you feel you're playing a part of something more grand.

This post has been edited by steveswede: 22 February 2012 - 08:16 PM

[Lobotomy]

serpx, on 21 February 2012 - 11:01 PM, said:

I have a better idea. Let's remove Episode 1 from market, pretend it never existed, rename Episode 2 to Episode 1, and then bingo, all is good in the world! If Episode 2 is trash, we'll just play this cycle till things are right. In regards to uncurling, I wonder if they added it because of the homing attack for some reason?

This is what's known in the video game industry as a bad idea.

[Ayu Tsukimiya]

Eric Wright, on 22 February 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

And now, Episode 2 sits on the horizon.

"We've revamped the whole game."

"We've listened to your concerns."

"Yes, Episode 1 wasn't up to par."

Come ON people, they'll say anything just to get enough people to lick their feet. Why should this be ANY different? I'm not saying it's impossible to consider that it might actually not suck, BUT it's not worth even wondering about the game until it launches.

If it's good - praise it.
If it's bad - don't even complain because you all should have expected it from the beginning.

I was pleasantly surprised with Generations, despite a number of glaring issues, and the game as a whole was good enough to look past them. I don't expect big things from S4E2 in any regard, I'm not following any hype, I'm not concerned with whatever claims Sega is making about the game's competency. THe proof is in the pudding, we'll see what happens when it launches.

you people shouldn't be so ready to lap up all the crap that Sega has been trying to feed us in the past few years

SEGA should probably know better than to break promises by now. Especially after how they made themselves the laughingstock of the gaming industry after Sonic 06. They got careless with episode 1, and I honestly believe they are learning from their mistakes, if Generations is anything to go by. Besides, why would they waste the new classic engines they just made/got? They have the Taxman one, the Generations one, and the Generations 3DS one.

[Solid SOAP]

I didn't find Episode I's physics to be too appalling, it just needs to fix some things. Those things being Sonic's sluggishness, sticking to walls, and losing inertia while in the air. If they fix that, then I think we'll have a solid game so long as the level design is good. It seems like there are no boosters and that the homing attack has been removed (Keyword; seems), so that's a good start, but you never know. We'll get a good idea of it tomorrow I'm hoping, but if not there's always E3. After the long wait for this episode, as well as SEGA's apparent "fan devotion", there really is no reason for such lazy level design. We shall see.

[Dark Sonic]

steveswede, on 22 February 2012 - 08:15 PM, said:

I would think that if the whole point of episodic content was to release in short intervals, then wouldn't they already have the zones, bosses, art style all lined up ready to work on? The "Episode" branding in my mind is just that because if Sonic 4 was just released as one title, it might have come across as underwhelming compared to the originals. This way it makes you feel you're playing a part of something more grand.

See at first I bet that was the plan, but then the backlash came because they didn't expect that we cared so much. I think they thought that "2D Sonic in levels the recognize = instant love for all." Admittedly it worked once, but it wouldn't work twice, since it wasn't instant love rather nostalgia glasses and annoying ass PR campaigns.

I bet at first they were going to make 3 episodes and eventually release a disc compilation of all three together. But then Episode 1 was balls so they're going to just push that aside and make Episode 2 better. If Episode 3 comes out, that may have lock on capabilities with 2, but I doubt either will have anything to do with Ep 1. In order for that to work, Ep 1 must be remade, and they have better things to do, like make Ep 3.

Sega has learned a lot since then though. They realize that we like classic Sonic for more then just the levels but we like it for how they played and felt. Sonic CD came out and everyone loved it because it was a remake with love. We got Generations which was a first step towards fixing the classic gameplay, and while not perfect, it looked beautiful. Unfortunately these are lessons they should have learned years ago, but hey, a lesson learned is a lesson learned.

This post has been edited by Dark Sonic: 22 February 2012 - 09:05 PM

[Solid SOAP]

They sound very resistant to make another episode, but I'm really pulling out for it if this one winds up being good. Yes, the reality of it is that I'm succumbing to their marketing scheme and buying all of their extremely short games, but you know what? I really like 2D Sonic games, and if this is an honest to God effort I'm going to support it.

[Dark Sonic]

Solid SOAP, on 22 February 2012 - 09:06 PM, said:

They sound very resistant to make another episode, but I'm really pulling out for it if this one winds up being good. Yes, the reality of it is that I'm succumbing to their marketing scheme and buying all of their extremely short games, but you know what? I really like 2D Sonic games, and if this is an honest to God effort I'm going to support it.

They seem afraid because people weren't too happy with Episode 1, but it did make money. Personally I think the best idea would be make Ep 2, and then make a Sonic 5 that's like Ep 2 only non episodic and a real game.

[Solid SOAP]

One thing I'm hoping for is that the presentation is a hell of a lot better. Looking at the classic games, and even new ones like Sonic Colors and Generations, SEGA put an awesome amount of detail into making the menus and title cards look awesome and original. Hell, even Taxman's Sonic CD port/remake did a lot more original things with the menus and title cards for each level. I'm hoping for a more original presentation overall would be nice. I can't find any good pictures, but I presume you all know what I'm talking about correct? Between each level, instead of getting a new and fresh card, we simply got a rehashed one from Sonic 2 just didn't even look as flashy or cool, and was very generic.

[Dark Sonic]

Solid SOAP, on 22 February 2012 - 10:32 PM, said:

One thing I'm hoping for is that the presentation is a hell of a lot better. Looking at the classic games, and even new ones like Sonic Colors and Generations, SEGA put an awesome amount of detail into making the menus and title cards look awesome and original. Hell, even Taxman's Sonic CD port/remake did a lot more original things with the menus and title cards for each level. I'm hoping for a more original presentation overall would be nice. I can't find any good pictures, but I presume you all know what I'm talking about correct? Between each level, instead of getting a new and fresh card, we simply got a rehashed one from Sonic 2 just didn't even look as flashy or cool, and was very generic.

No I know what you mean, and I agree with you. I think there was evidence of a new title card a couple pages back, there was a picture that had some transparent black bars at the bottom as if the title card was fading out. Perhaps we'll see tomorrow.

Unfortunately the title screen will most likely be confirmed balls, since we already have the logo and it's likely going to be the same deal as in Ep 1. Shame the logo looks so ugly, since the rest of the game looks great to me so far.