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Sonic CD (JP) versus Sonic 2 (8-bit) soundtrack I heard they're the same thing. Kinda.

#1 User is offline Jayextee 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:41 PM

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Apologies if this topic has been covered before (a forum search yielded no results for me) or if it's just plain dumb and ill-advised. To cut a long story short, I saw a comment on a YouTube vid somewhere that listed equivalents between the 8-bit Sonic 2 and the JP Sonic CD soundtracks. I can't find it again. Given the composers, it doesn't seem such a leap to me.

The two I remember the most were Aqua Lake Zone -> Wacky Workbench (dat bassline) and the obvious-and-classic Green Hills Zone -> You Can Do Anything (AKA Toot Toot Sonic Warrior). But apparently all of them share motifs from one to the other.

Can anyone shed light on this, one way or another? Alternatively, is this worth further discussion?

If this is stupid, mods feel free to trash. But I'm curious.

#2 User is offline Master Emerald 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:48 PM

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Did you make any research concerning the composers etc?

It normally would point to similarities.

#3 User is offline Jayextee 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 12:54 PM

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View PostMaster Emerald, on 21 December 2011 - 12:48 PM, said:

Did you make any research concerning the composers etc?


Both Naofumi Hataya and Masafumi Ogata are listed on Retro's page for Sonic 2. However, is there anything deeper as to who-did-what, or would this be down to speculation? I remember there was some discussion about who was who regarding the pseudonyms, but I don't think I followed the thread so much. Can't say.

#4 User is offline Miles Prower 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 01:08 PM

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I remember seeing a Youtube video with a Toot-Toot Sonic Warrior + GH 8-bit mashup. Can't find it again either, but yes, there were definitely similarities.

#5 User is offline Afro Thunder 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 01:11 PM

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View PostMiles Prower, on 21 December 2011 - 01:08 PM, said:

I remember seeing a Youtube video with a Toot-Toot Sonic Warrior + GH 8-bit mashup. Can't find it again either, but yes, there were definitely similarities.


I think it was in the original Sonic CD 2011 thread, though you'll have to do some serious searching for it. Outside of that, Toot Toot and Green Hills were essentially the exact same songs minus the lyrics.
This post has been edited by Afro Thunder: 21 December 2011 - 01:14 PM

#6 User is offline Sir_mihael 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 02:03 PM

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Gimmick Mountain Zone had moments of sounding like Collision Chaos Zone, but that's the only one I actually remember by ear.

I too remember someone posting up a list of the similar songs. The only problem was that they didn't supply any reasons WHY or what parts of the songs were similar, so I ended up listening thinking "Nope, I'm not hearing anything..."
It would be interesting for an in-depth comparison to come along at some point. That is if it isn't all just a massive coincidence and we've been reaching too hard because of one instance of a reused song. ;)
(Pointing out the Green Hills / Sonic Warrior connection goes without saying, we can probably put that one to rest.)

#7 User is offline Titan 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 02:14 PM

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E102 posted about it in the 'other knowledge' topic - complete with Youtube links :-)
http://forums.sonicr...63

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Posted 21 December 2011 - 03:54 PM

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View PostTitan, on 21 December 2011 - 02:14 PM, said:

E102 posted about it in the 'other knowledge' topic - complete with Youtube links :-)
http://forums.sonicr...63


Thanks for that. Looks like the list I saw on the YouTube vid... but I'm not really hearing it with most of those. Seriously. Maybe if I listened closer, but nothing is really all that apparent; even the shorter ones (such as Act Clear) seem to be huge leaps of the imagination - other than the general structure, but that is true of most Sonic act clear jingles.

I would welcome anyone pointing out the similarities though, if it's possible.

#9 User is offline Master Emerald 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 04:42 PM

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Yeah I don't hear similarities at all. It's like saying Chemical Plant is similar to Scrap Brain to me x.x

#10 User is offline Ashura2k 

Posted 21 December 2011 - 05:22 PM

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R2 Badnik

Underground Zone boss

Coincidence? Just got me thinking what other stuff might possibly be recycled between the 2 games.

Edit: Changed to URLs so I could queue it to the correct time
This post has been edited by Ashura2k: 21 December 2011 - 05:26 PM

#11 User is online ThunderPX 

Posted 22 December 2011 - 09:27 AM

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I guess if I reeeeeally stretch it, I can hear some similarities in the basslines, but that's about it. I really doubt it's intentional.

#12 User is offline Vendettagainst 

Posted 22 December 2011 - 11:41 AM

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They sound nothing alike. You could make an argument that they could make some good mixes, but they don't have to be the same for that :specialed:

But as soon as one song is the same, people will start drawing out similarities with others. We just can't believe that they could be different compositions! :P

#13 User is offline E102 

Posted 15 February 2012 - 07:58 PM

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Sorry I'm only just getting to this now, but I'm here now to elaborate.


When I originally paired these tracks, I did it with the intention of strengthening my analysis for who composed which Sonic CD tracks. Despite having plenty of evidence beforehand, this served as a finishing touch, making for a perfect cross-referencing. The bonus was that it also made S2GG that much easier to crack. (Honestly, though, I didn't expect that would happen when I started. I just noticed the similarities between TT and Crystal Egg and never looked back. My mind was blown like the others I've shared this with.) [Side note: It turned out I was 100% right on composition credits when the OST dropped, though I was mistaken for the arrangement credits, so these are factual to some degree given their similarities.]

First things first: If you want to hear the similarites, you need to adjust how you hear each song. A CD song won't necessarily sound the same on 8-bit; after all, the latter can only do so much. Anyone who knows a typical Master System port of a Mega Drive or arcade title should know what I mean here. Rather than take the obvious connection between Green Hills Zone and Sonic - You Can Do Anything (the former benefiting from the vocals being the main part), instead take Mecha Green Hill from Sonic Chaos, especially from 0:38 to 1:07 [0:19 is the bridge, 0:42 is the chorus], for it is based off of Green Hills Zone.

What you want to do next is count beats. Once you see how those are similar, you should start to hear the shared melody between the two.

After that, you want to count sections and compare them to their paired CD track. Once you see the similarites in section numbers, you'll see how the composition process is similar.


Act Start vs. Palmtree Panic
-0:00-0:04 against 0:00-0:02 [Not much to say about this one, but the closest part is from 0:01-0:02 (for both tracks)


Sky High vs. Metallic Madness

Beat Comparison: 0:00-0:05 against 0:00-0:04

Sections:
-0:00-0:09 against 0:43-0:49
-0:09-0:29 against 0:56-1:10 [This is perhaps the single greatest piece of shared melody evidence on here]
-0:29-0:48 against 0:30-0:43


Aqua Lake vs. Quartz Quadrant

Beat Comparison: 0:01-0:06 against 0:00-0:04
0:17-0:51
Sections:
-0:01-0:20 against 0:00-0:17
-0:20-0:59 against 0:51-1:07
-0:59-1:18 against 1:07-1:23 [Another good piece of shared melody]
-1:18-1:37 against 0:17-0:51


Gimmick Mountain vs. Collision Chaos

Beat Comparison: 0:01-0:05 against 0:00-0:02

Sections:
-0:01-0:17 against 0:08-0:16
-0:17-0:33 against 0:49-1:05
-0:33-0:49 against 1:05-1:22
-0:49-1:05 against 1:22-1:40


Scrambled Egg vs. Stardust Speedway

Beat Comparison: 0:06-0:13-against 0:00-0:08

Sections:
-0:06-0:13 against 0:00-0:08
-0:13-0:26 against 0:08-0:16
-0:26-0:38 against 0:16-0:32
-0:38-0:44 against 0:39-0:47
-0:44-0:58 against 0:47-1:03


Crystal Egg vs. Tidal Tempest

Beat Comparison: 0:17-0:19 against 0:19-0:21

Sections:
-0:00-0:08 against 0:00-0:10
-0:08-0:17 against 0:10-0:19
-0:17-0:51 against 0:19-0:57
-0:51-1:08 against 1:35-1:53


Invincible vs. Wacky Workbench

Beat Comparison: 0:00-0:02 against 0:00-0:03

Sections:
-0:00-0:05 against 0:00-0:07
-0:11-0:18 against 0:21-0:28


Sonic CD-----------Sonic 2 (8-bit)
-Boss!! and Boss (GG)
-Zone Clear!! and Act Clear
-Game Over and Game Over

NOTE: Will edit soon to include the rest. Please bare with me.
This post has been edited by E102: 20 February 2012 - 08:08 PM

#14 User is offline Vendettagainst 

Posted 16 February 2012 - 02:25 AM

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View PostE102, on 15 February 2012 - 07:58 PM, said:

BUMBUMBUM

You listed seconds based evidence. That's not conclusive at all, sir. I can see what you're trying to do, but I can't see it.

#15 User is offline flarn2006 

Posted 16 February 2012 - 09:20 PM

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Is this what you're looking for?

Quote

Sonic - You Can Do Anything : Green Hills Zone

Palmtree Panic : Act Start

Collision Chaos : Gimmick Mountain´╗┐ Zone

Tidal Tempest : Crystal Egg Zone

Quartz Quadrant : Aqua Lake Zone

Wacky Workbench : Invincibility

Stardust Speedway : Scrambled Egg Zone

Metallic Madness : Sky High Zone

Boss : Boss (GG)


From the comments on http://www.youtube.c...h?v=VDvJNpBEu0E.

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