[Covarr]

W.A.C., on 05 December 2011 - 08:37 PM, said:

possibly definitely modify some all of the level design, etc, it would be a much funner game.

Knuckles Chaotix suffers from one huge problem, bigger than the physics, bigger than the random level selection, bigger even than the premise: the level design.

The levels are far too vertical, and not even good at that; their focus on upward movement is a chore, and running up dozens of quarter pipes for the sake of reaching the next platform gets old real fast. This problem was even apparent as far back as Sonic Crackers. None of the layouts really have any identity of their own, to the point that you could swap the art and music assets in pretty much any two levels and likely not even notice the difference. The levels are extremely sparse, with not nearly as many badniks or objects as seen in pretty much every other Sonic game ever.

It's a shame, really. The art in this game is gorgeous, the music is fantastic, and the concept is unique. But to make it fun would pretty much require brand new level layouts throughout, at which point you might as well be making an entirely new game.

[Shadow Hog]

DimensionWarped, on 05 December 2011 - 08:11 PM, said:

Um, no. That wouldn't help because the stages in Chaotix were terrible. This goes for the Game Gear Sonic games too. The levels were never up to snuff for any of the games out of the main series and Sonic CD, and Sonic CD is entirely hit and miss depending on the person.

Actually, I'm gonna disagree with the GG Sonic stages sucking. For the gameplay styles they were used in, I thought they were generally pretty well-done. I suppose the pipe mazes in Scrambled Egg Zone are an exception, at least. Either way, I really liked the amount of exploration you got from, say, Sonic Chaos or Triple Trouble.

Chaotix's stages are totally unmemorable, though. Great art direction and music for each stage cannot overcome the fact that barring one or two gimmicks like Amazing Arena's lightswitch hunts, they all play like the same bloody stages.

This post has been edited by Shadow Hog: 05 December 2011 - 09:32 PM

[W.A.C.]

Covarr, on 05 December 2011 - 09:23 PM, said:

It's a shame, really. The art in this game is gorgeous, the music is fantastic, and the concept is unique. But to make it fun would pretty much require brand new level layouts throughout, at which point you might as well be making an entirely new game.

Hence why I said "possibly" and "some". It would be awesome if The Taxman could totally redesign the levels and such, but I don't think Sega wants a complete redo on an old game. When it comes to other old games redone that hasn't been mentioned, I'd love to see Sonic 3D Blast get a proper remake. I love that game the way it is on the original PC version, but it would be awesome to have widescreen, flicky collecting optional, soundtrack options, etc. Of course, that would probably be much harder to remake and there's less of a demand for it so it's unlikely to happen. Not to mention there's a bunch of ports of the Genesis version where as Knuckles Chaotix hasn't been ported to anything and SA2's last port was for the GCN almost ten years ago.

This post has been edited by W.A.C.: 05 December 2011 - 09:41 PM

[Dark Sonic]

Master Emerald, on 05 December 2011 - 08:10 PM, said:

But you're suggesting them to rearrange all songs, remake all the art, everything just for the GG games? Why not emulate them all and release a Sonic Game Gear collection?

That'd be awesome actually. It'd make the game gear games play like the Genesis games and give it a different style. It'd feel like a new game (and would be to many since how many people actually played the game gear games?) Seems like a good way to make a somewhat new game to me.

[JaxTH]

W.A.C., on 05 December 2011 - 09:40 PM, said:

flicky collecting optional

But then the game becomes too easy (Which is why I love Sik's hack) and would defeat the general purpose of the game. Can't be 3D Blast without that blasted Green Flicky getting lost in Rusty Ruin Zone!

But yeah, soundtrack option would be awesome. But then there is the fact that there are three different types of specials stages: Genesis, Saturn, and PC. If that was a choice too it would be great.

[E-122-Psi]

Shadow Hog, on 05 December 2011 - 09:31 PM, said:

DimensionWarped, on 05 December 2011 - 08:11 PM, said:

Um, no. That wouldn't help because the stages in Chaotix were terrible. This goes for the Game Gear Sonic games too. The levels were never up to snuff for any of the games out of the main series and Sonic CD, and Sonic CD is entirely hit and miss depending on the person.

Actually, I'm gonna disagree with the GG Sonic stages sucking. For the gameplay styles they were used in, I thought they were generally pretty well-done. I suppose the pipe mazes in Scrambled Egg Zone are an exception, at least. Either way, I really liked the amount of exploration you got from, say, Sonic Chaos or Triple Trouble.

Chaotix's stages are totally unmemorable, though. Great art direction and music for each stage cannot overcome the fact that barring one or two gimmicks like Amazing Arena's lightswitch hunts, they all play like the same bloody stages.

I liked Chaos' levels, but they were also way too short, Sonic at least had some justification since he also had a collecting motive in the game (similar to CD's shorter levels where you must time travel, even they aren't quite as bad as Chaos) but Tails is ridiculously easy till about the final two acts. Triple Trouble's are somewhat better but I remember the physics being somewhat clunkier.

As someone mentioned a lot of Chaotix's level designs are the same 'left up a ramp, right up a ramp and repeat' method. Some varying more vertical stages would have been appreciated, especially in Speed Slider and the likes.

Actually the training levels seem to have more innovations than most of the main levels put together.

[Master Emerald]

I guess we're getting off-topic

[E-122-Psi]

Master Emerald, on 05 December 2011 - 10:02 PM, said:

I guess we're getting off-topic

True. There's not even any implication of Chaotix or any Sonic game being remade right now. We're lucky to get this one.

This post has been edited by E-122-Psi: 05 December 2011 - 10:05 PM

[W.A.C.]

JaxTH, on 05 December 2011 - 09:52 PM, said:

But then the game becomes too easy (Which is why I love Sik's hack) and would defeat the general purpose of the game. Can't be 3D Blast without that blasted Green Flicky getting lost in Rusty Ruin Zone!

Yeah, it would be much easier, but it's an interesting alternative way to play the game. Maybe it could be unlockable after beating the game with flickies. >_>

JaxTH, on 05 December 2011 - 09:52 PM, said:

But yeah, soundtrack option would be awesome. But then there is the fact that there are three different types of specials stages: Genesis, Saturn, and PC. If that was a choice too it would be great.

Oh wow, I didn't even know the special stage music was different on PC. Speaking of the special stages, it would also be cool if you had the option to play whatever version of the special stages you wanted to complete.

Master Emerald, on 05 December 2011 - 10:02 PM, said:

I guess we're getting off-topic

Well, this is a port by The Taxman and we're talking about other ports that could be made, but yeah it's definitely getting off-topic. Maybe someone could make a Sonic remakes thread or something.

[Puto]

W.A.C., on 05 December 2011 - 10:20 PM, said:

JaxTH, on 05 December 2011 - 09:52 PM, said:

But yeah, soundtrack option would be awesome. But then there is the fact that there are three different types of specials stages: Genesis, Saturn, and PC. If that was a choice too it would be great.

Oh wow, I didn't even know the special stage music was different on PC. Speaking of the special stages, it would also be cool if you had the option to play whatever version of the special stages you wanted to complete.

The song isn't different, the stage is. MD has a pathetic special stage, Saturn has a much better one, PC version is some super-gimped version of the Saturn version or something.

[JaxTH]

There really isn't anything more to talk about. We don't have a release date or price.

Unless someone wants to do a Sonic CD run where they destroy all Generators in the past along with Metal Sonic projectors in each level while getting the time stones making sure to get the last one in the Metallic Madness Act 2 to show everyone what that would be like.

[Metal Man88]

JaxTH, on 05 December 2011 - 10:28 PM, said:

Unless someone wants to do a Sonic CD run where they destroy all Generators in the past along with Metal Sonic projectors in each level while getting the time stones making sure to get the last one in the Metallic Madness Act 2 to show everyone what that would be like.

http://forums.someth...hreadid=3433657

Scroll on down. They're making one right there. AFAIK

[Master Emerald]

So will we get Super Sonic with the Time Stones? :D With all the rings the zones have it would be fun!

[W.A.C.]

Puto, on 05 December 2011 - 10:26 PM, said:

The song isn't different, the stage is. MD has a pathetic special stage, Saturn has a much better one, PC version is some super-gimped version of the Saturn version or something.

Whoops, I misread his post. TBH, I've never played the Saturn version. Only the PC and Genesis versions. Anyways, on a more on-topic note, I wonder why Knuckles wasn't also added to the port...unless he is in it and we just don't know yet.

Edit-

Super Sonic would be awesome in this game.

This post has been edited by W.A.C.: 05 December 2011 - 10:46 PM

[Ritz]

Quote

[Interviewer:] Getting back to Sonic CD, the new version expands the field of view to widescreen without distorting the sprites’ proportions. How did you accomplish this?
[Ken Balough:] That's a trade secret.

This question only sounds stupid if you're reading it with Sonic Fan tunnel vision. He's just given us the general public's perception of the game; it isn't readily apparent to anyone but us that the game actually is a remake because every other game that's been billed as one- Street Fighter 2 HD, Golgoth's Toki project, many others- was actually a complete reinterpretation of the source material. Anyone who saw the trailer and stopped there is going to think this is just another emulated release. Now, I figured everyone had gotten all worked up about this because Taxman had finally hit the big time, and it was going to be a boon for the community or some shit, but here the layman is largely oblivious to his role and Sega sure isn't helping. If you're going to sidestep such a simple question, at least do it gracefully like the Japs!

And everyone balking at the notion of a Chaotix remake on the grounds that the original didn't play well is demonstrating some seriously fucking backwards logic. Here we have one of the few games in the franchise that deserves a remake, and the only one that actually needs one. It's a nice bonus, but SCD didn't need S2 physics or Tails. It's insane how much wasted potential went into that game. Fix the physics, make the combi system optional, totally redo the level design to rout the repetition and actually make use of the characters' unique abilities, and then emulate the original just for kicks and I'd gladly pay retail price for Chaotix. All the assets are there, the art and music are the stylistic apex of the entire franchise immediately after SCD and Taxman's done all the hard work already. Now they just need to code all the interesting gimmicks they forgot the first time around and arrange the tiles like they aren't tripping on cough syrup. It'd take a fraction of the effort they put into S4E1, and it'd accomplish the same goal with the panache Sonic Team just doesn't have anymore.

This post has been edited by Ritz: 05 December 2011 - 10:56 PM