Something that caught my eye was that Iizuka-San was used as the person who was responsible in helping keep Classic Sonic true to Classic, but weren't his ideas to basically tie the game into Forces, and make them use the old levels? Two things that weren't really generally popular ideas?
Since someone asked, this entire quote is why I said he was essentially dumbfounded since Mania seems to have shattered their worldview of consumers.
I'd take all that with a grain of salt and go as far as to say that interviews have sometimes been imprecisely translated. Some things get lost in translation and the developer's like 'can't we have a native speaker translating this for me?'. I mean c'mon, WORDS IN VIDEO GAMES. A rather jarring scenario.
It's super positive news that Mania's success had a future-defining impact as Sonic Team indicated it potentially would months ago. Sonic Mania 2 in the near future seems a lock at this point.
We all thought Generations 2 was coming up after positive reviews. Then Lost World and the Boom series came. Nothing's a lock when it comes to the lessons Sonic Team learns. I still think the lesson they should learn is question who they are. Find what talent makes up this team, and utilize it without being shackled to an existing franchise.
Good example and I do suppose nothing is ever concrete and certain until announcement however I feel that Mania's glowing reviews and super success will steer them in the right direction eventually. The interview isn't confirmation of Mania 2 but it is a positive sign that said game may happen someday if they're acutely aware of the game doing well and the insane demand for games like it in the future.
Glowing reviews and success from the fanbase, maybe, but not from reviewers or general consumers. For what are called the best (3D) Sonic games in the series, their aggregate metascores are both around the mid-high 70s; as for sales, Colors also barely crossed 2 million in sales, and Generations came under that at 1.85M. For Sonic standards, maybe that's "glowing" material, but outside that vacuum, it's on the upper crust of what's generally considered an average range of reviews, and sales that are likely just modest at best. I do agree with your point that the performance of games means nothing to Sonic Team, albeit for different reasons; I think Sonic Team is incapable of actually learning anything in a consequential way and has a prolonged history of doing that. Speaking of which... That is exactly what you're going to get and you're going to like it. Actions speak louder than words, and these words are coming from a studio who haven't been interested in, incorporated, and/or reproduced classic Sonic gameplay or consumer feedback into their games in any meaningful manner. A 3D Sonic game inspired by Mania/the classics would also be an antithesis to their entire approach of what constitutes (3D) Sonic game design as it is anyway. Sonic Team would had to literally educate themselves to not be Sonic Team or hire a new set of designers and directors at best, or be overhauled into an entirely different studio at worst, before being even capable of carrying out the task they're floating around. Almost any other team out there has that done; people who actually have made a proper new classic Sonic game (Taxman/Stealth/PWG) included. And while Mania might be a 2D game and their only (official) work to date--it still hits, or comes very close to, the bullseye of a good Sonic game and a good Genesis Sonic game than any of Sonic Team's 10+ years of work at the end of the day. Pair them up with a studio/division who are seasoned in 3D games and interested in Genesis Sonic, and I'm sure the resulting collaborative effort, even at its worst-case scenario, would be a Mario Sunshine scenario--a game that needed more time in the oven and misses some beats, but is still a great game that provides the potential of being outclassed by a stellar sequel.
Exactly. Maybe I've been around here for too long and I'm too cynical, but I thought at the time for both Colors and Generations that we finally got out of terrible games and Sonic Team understood what made Sonic good again. They don't know. The fact that they are surprised that Mania was received well is a red flag. The fact they are going to look at mania and try to implement it in future 3D games is a red flag.
Even if Mania is the last “great” Sonic game, I can die happy. Dropping it from Steam in 10 years still won't erase my memories! If they can't figure out what makes a Sonic game good, it's time to just move on.
Reading this article bummed me out. I don't know what's sadder about this statement... The fact it took them 15 years to realize they should reflect on the games of old, or the fact that even though he made this statement, you KNOW nothing's going to change within Sonic Team. This statement is nothing but admitting that Sonic Team has no fucking clue what they're even doing with their own IP. They can blow smoke and make grandiose sentiment all they want, but it's really time to restructure this whole division of Sega. I can only hope Sonic Forces is enough to make them realize that. Mania is the friend telling you to leave your abusive spouse.
I echo much of the sentiment here in saying that Sonic Team should not be trusted for such a task, even hypothetically at this point. They have proven many, many times over that they fundamentally do not understand the classic gameplay....and that they're not too interested in doing so either. Iizuka is the only remaining mind from that era and it is highly questionable whether or not he even understands the foundation that Naka/Yasuhara/Ohshima established. I'm not upset at them and in recent years have even understood some of their decisions, even while not agreeing. But if SEGA truly does decide to go in the direction of a reinvigorated traditional ("classic") Sonic next and reintroduce him on a large scale.... at minimum, Sonic Team alone should not be allowed to solo the task and should be held by the hand, checked and rechecked by those who have proven they do "get it" to ensure there is nothing lost in translation. But even that seems like a difficult endeavor, having a large studio being directed by a smaller independent team. Why not just give the smaller team the resources they need and get the heck out of the way? There cannot possibly be any excuses to obstruct such an undertaking at this point. We've heard this song and done this dance many times before. I need to see a very different operation from SEGA before I will be intrigued by this idea.
Iizuka had more input on Sonic Mania's development than we might ever be allowed to know. (NDAs and all that.) Some of the cool things in Mania's classic levels you liked might have well been his suggestion. Given that, I think he does understand a number of aspects of what made the classics what they were, regardless of how debatable that number might be in this community. What would be interesting to me, now that Mania has been released and received only the highest marks of praise, is if this whole classic thing went full circle and Sonic Team were given the Retro Engine(s) to make a new classic game themselves. A near-exact replica of what the old Sonic Team had, if not better in every way imaginable. It's certainly a more budget-friendly way to experiment with new ideas for Sonic games before translating them into 3D, and there's less money on the line if it under-performs in sales. Whether you peeps here at Retro think it'd be a good thing, or the next unmitigated disaster in the making, I haven't been able to help myself with imagining the possibilities. It's not like it can't happen, Sonic Team once said we'd never see Classic Sonic again, and now here we are complaining they're using him too often in the 3D games. :v:
I would not trust current Sonic Team with main development of a classic Sonic game, I can't think of a worst thing than that as the team's track record is appalling. Just because part of Sonic Generations showed promise doesn't mean they're good at capturing that magic. I call that a fluke TBH.
Yeah, that interview doesn't give me hope, because he seems to think it was Iizuka who was mostly responsible for the Classic feel of the game, and I sure as fuck bet it wasn't. Unless I see "everyone on Sonic Mania's direct development team has been given permanent job offers to start a new team and Sonic Team have been taken off the Sonic brand", I won't feel positively about the Sonic brand going forward
The day there's a new game to check, the day I'll know what to say about this. Let the Forces show begin and tell them "what to do".
I feel like they should just let the Mania team focus on making more Classic Sonic games and they focus on.. Other things. I'd have said focus on improving Modern Sonic but I don't see that happening.
