[Lanzer]

Andrew75, on 06 June 2012 - 08:55 AM, said:

Man, all these failed community projects always get me down. Project S to Sonic 2 HD.
Mobius engine doesn't look to have a bright future if no one wants to work on it.
Although I think that the generations hacking is proving more of a community project than the others and it wasn't really even trying.

As it stands now there are no super organized sub forums or anything of that nature going on for generations hacking.
( perhaps it would be a good time to start something like that, especially with all the masive amounts of content we have here in this single thread.)

Wait, What happened with Project S?!

That sounds like a good idea but I don't think the admins would go for it. We can probably make our own seprate topics once the project gets big enough to warrant it (Like the Generaions Unleashed DLC project).

More news on an upcoming update to JoeTE's Robo-Sonic skin mod:

JoeTE, on 07 June 2012 - 09:44 AM, said:

I've got some more stuff done with my Sonic Simulator Robo-Sonic mod. (I'm working way too fast.)

Spoiler

I got the models to show up on the following:
1. Title screen
2. The whole 'stomp animation transition from the title to the white space hub'
3. The character Biographies
4. All of the cut-scenes taking place in the White Space Hub.




Robo-Sonic fist-bump FTW!

[Dario FF]

I think the wiki has enough potential to be good enough of a resource, but it seems we all forget to document it(and I admit to being lazy to do my part there as well other than some file specs). The objects in fact should help others make layouts much faster instead of having to experiment and try for yourself all the time.

Objects Wiki Section, I mean instead of using your head to remember the attributes, perhaps it's just better you dump it there instead.

Honestly I've been holding off on writing any massive tutorial that explains throughly how to create custom levels until we got the process nailed down. As it goes I'm just not sure whether I should keep using the Ogre format(so compatibility with Blender and other 3D programs stay), or just go exclusively on Autodesk tools, which is pretty much what Sega did apparently. One might suggest importing Collada files instead, but the sheer complexity and how verbose it is it seems most big 3D editing suites programs just have lots of problems on implementing proper Collada support(Max for example does some really bloated exports unless you use OpenCollada instead).

On the other hand the Ogre format is really easy to implement, and it IS a game format, so it really has most of what Sonic Generations needs.

From what I've seen most people who get the process down right are able to import their levels and try them out without much hassle. I've heard the common complaints, so here's what's being fixed at the moment:

• Double Lights bug, Clearing Terrain Geometry crash are gone
  
• Adding some (partial) spline support for previewing and adapting the objects to them
  
• Support for local and world translation and rotation, should help a lot on placing objects on non-axis-aligned areas.
  
• Collision Previewing boxes for Cameras, Events, etc.
  
• Raycasting to polygon level, for more accuracy instead of relying on AABBs

This post has been edited by Dario FF: 07 June 2012 - 10:13 AM

[Aerosol]

Falk, on 06 June 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

AerosolSP, on 06 June 2012 - 08:24 AM, said:

*I said this*

*Then you said this*

I get what you're saying, but it's idealistic. Someone who just wants to make levels for Generations isn't going to go out of their way to be really unique with the assets. They'll use the assets that are available and make a level with it. And they won't be alone in doing that, either. And none of them will care, because "holy fuck I'm making a level for Generations!!!". And that's fine!

However, I hold that the people that want to make unique levels for Generations that have the drive and skill to see a project like that through would likely make their own assets. Or atleast rip them themselves from a variety of sources without relying on a fan-made "asset pack".

Dario FF, on 07 June 2012 - 10:11 AM, said:

Honestly I've been holding off on writing any massive tutorial that explains throughly how to create custom levels until we got the process nailed down. As it goes I'm just not sure whether I should keep using the Ogre format(so compatibility with Blender and other 3D programs stay), or just go exclusively on Autodesk tools, which is pretty much what Sega did apparently.

Please don't do this. Max is only currently required to export havok collision right? Can we leave it at that? Perhaps, somewhere down the road, the exporter could be ported to Blender (it is open source, isn't it?) and hacking Generations can be done from start to finish without pirating anything.

This post has been edited by AerosolSP: 07 June 2012 - 10:30 AM

[Falk]

Blender is open source; not too sure what the legalities w.r.t messing with Havok to create a plugin for it, but I doubt it could be any 'less' 'legal' than what we're already currently doing, anyway.

[Azu]

AerosolSP, on 07 June 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

*Post Stuff*

You don't have to pirate. You can download 3DS Max and most, if not all Autodesk's tool for free, as a student. You don't even need a student email (unless they changed it since I registered). I was able to use my email address, although, it as my professional one. I'd suggest using something like [email protected]

[Aerosol]

Falk, on 07 June 2012 - 11:19 AM, said:

Blender is open source; not too sure what the legalities w.r.t messing with Havok to create a plugin for it, but I doubt it could be any 'less' 'legal' than what we're already currently doing, anyway.

Well I was talking about Havok being open source, not Blender. You sorta answered my question though.

Azu, on 07 June 2012 - 11:53 AM, said:

AerosolSP, on 07 June 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

*Post Stuff*

You don't have to pirate. You can download 3DS Max and most, if not all Autodesk's tool for free, as a student. You don't even need a student email (unless they changed it since I registered). I was able to use my email address, although, it as my professional one. I'd suggest using something like [email protected]

I'm not a student. Now what?

[Dario FF]

AerosolSP, on 07 June 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

I'm not a student. Now what?

Then you are a student.

[Aerosol]

What, pretend to be a student to get max/softimage/maya for free? The whole point is to remove anything dubious from the custom level creation pipeline, besides hacking Generations itself. Besides, you can't get student versions of older versions of Max, for instance, can you? I thought there were problems with using Max 2012 to export havok collision, and you had to use an earlier version?

EDIT: I'm missing something, aren't I. What am I missing?

This post has been edited by AerosolSP: 07 June 2012 - 12:37 PM

[Dario FF]

AerosolSP, on 07 June 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

What, pretend to be a student to get max/softimage/maya for free? The whole point is to remove anything dubious from the custom level creation pipeline, besides hacking Generations itself. Besides, you can't get student versions of older versions of Max, for instance, can you? I thought there were problems with using Max 2012 to export havok collision, and you had to use an earlier version?

Autodesk's ultimate interest isn't in chasing down who pirates their software or questioning your morality, the fact that the downloads are public and pretty much anyone can get a student license with fake information is just in their intention of YOU getting used to the software(for example, try making a pro-Max user choose Blender instead, and witness the catastrophe), so when the occasion comes that you have to do real, business work, you're gonna have to license it for real. And yes, you can get older versions from their downloads page.

What I proposed wasn't much going about limiting making levels to max, but about the idea of putting more focus into it. Maxscripts to help, making the pipeline easier by using the FBX SDK to import stuff instead, etc. Believe me, I don't like much Max either, but it's on my interest on making the process easier for users if needed. It's just an idea I'm throwing out though, for now the Ogre Exporters work fine.

This post has been edited by Dario FF: 07 June 2012 - 12:46 PM

[Candescence]

Lanzer, on 07 June 2012 - 10:00 AM, said:

Wait, What happened with Project S?!

Project S died years ago, sadly. I should know, I was on the team as story lead. We had Cyborg4r's Blender-based engine, but after a whole bunch of setbacks on actually getting stuff done, and that was after switching from BlitzSonic, even though things were moving, Chris Senn decided enough was enough and simply pulled the plug.

It was a failure, but at the same time, it was a learning experience for me and everyone on the team. We might've actually gone somewhere if Sonic GDK was available back then, but, them's the brakes.

[Aerosol]

Dario FF, on 07 June 2012 - 12:45 PM, said:

AerosolSP, on 07 June 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

What, pretend to be a student to get max/softimage/maya for free? The whole point is to remove anything dubious from the custom level creation pipeline, besides hacking Generations itself. Besides, you can't get student versions of older versions of Max, for instance, can you? I thought there were problems with using Max 2012 to export havok collision, and you had to use an earlier version?

Autodesk's ultimate interest isn't in chasing down who pirates their software or questioning your morality, the fact that the downloads are public and pretty much anyone can get a student license with fake information is just in their intention of YOU getting used to the software(for example, try making a pro-Max user choose Blender instead, and witness the catastrophe), so when the occasion comes that you have to do real, business work, you're gonna have to license it for real. And yes, you can get older versions from their downloads page.

Oh. Well, carry on sir

This post has been edited by AerosolSP: 07 June 2012 - 01:26 PM

[Azu]

Yea, just sign up, I think you can do as far back as 2010 n Max, Maya, and some of their other programs.. They just put up 2013 as well. You just need am actual license to sell your work.

[Lanzer]

Pre-release of Robo-Sonic skin mod 2.0:

JoeTE, on 07 June 2012 - 02:54 PM, said:

I might as well just bring this up now. =D



http://www.mediafire...4p1cx8q4nkytoso

This is a pre-release download of my Sonic Simulator Robot's next update.
It features the Classic Sonic variant of the Robot, cutscene/title-screen models, and better text/HUD edits. However, the Super-form robots still don't appear in the Final Boss Battle, and the recolors aren't included in this pre-release.

This post has been edited by Lanzer: 07 June 2012 - 09:51 PM

[Dario FF]

So given the circumstances and we're reaching closer to the deadline for the Hacking Contest, I feel it's about time to put some important improvements into SonicGLvl to help on making layouts a way more easy task. That's what pretty much this whole update is about...

SonicGLvl v0.5.4 Update:
As always, you can get this new update over at the downloads page.

• New logo! The old one was getting quite outdated.
  
  
  
• With the recent release of an stable version of Ogre 1.8 as the new official branch, SonicGLvl got updated to Ogre 1.8 as well. This offers support for Ogre 1.8 meshes. While there are no immediate improvements, hopefully this version will have a wider range of compatibility with any meshes you export.
  
  
• Some initial work into the GIA Group organization. The generator will now divide GIA groups in a similar way it does to Terrain Groups, to avoid hogging the memory by loading unnecessary textures. Do notice that since a GIA Merger isn't implemented yet, this doesn't mean you can import your large-scale stages with GIA yet. But at least it's one step in the right direction.
  
  
• File open/save dialogs have the filtering corrected. Hopefully this should avoid confusion in what files to actually open(Opening AR stages only allows to open files of the kind #*.ar.00) and what to do in most steps.
  
  
• Corrected the crash when Clearing Terrain Geometry, and also corrected the duplicate lights bug. Now re-importing your scene should go a bit smoother.
  
  
• Starting again with the Objects support, I've removed the old hack that just rotated the meshes 90 degrees so they displayed right. The reason is this old hack was done because back in 2011, we didn't have the ability to properly import meshes in the correct axis on Max yet. Now that this can be done, a lot of resources need to be re-ripped(for example you'll notice most of GHZ resources will be rotated incorrectly). This shall be fixed as the database gets updated and new models are submitted.
  
  
• Most importantly regarding objects, there's two very important updates that I believe layout makers will find extremely useful. The first one is the Option to toggle between Local and World Translatation and Rotation. The next video should be representative of what I mean, and it is indeed quite the change that you might appreciate:
  
  There's both a shortcut and a menu option implemented for it, and I can assure you this is of incredible help whenever you want to design your stage around non-axis aligned areas. Also for having more precision when placing and rotating objects.
  
  
• The other important feature added is the option to Preview collision boxes in objects. This helps a lot for camera changers, event triggers, lots of different kinds of collision triggers, etc. These boxes do not interfer with the object selection, and are only displayed when the object in question is selected. These collision boxes are easily tweakable in the templates, via the following attributes:
  
  

      <PreviewScaleX multiplier="1.0">Collision_Width</PreviewScaleX>
      <PreviewScaleY multiplier="1.0">Collision_Height</PreviewScaleY>
      <PreviewScaleZ multiplier="1.0">Collision_Length</PreviewScaleZ>
  

  
  Where the name in each parameter is the attribute it takes the value from to do the scaling with. If the value isn't defined, it'll use the multiplier instead(useful for making collision planes, like in the picture below).
  
  
  
• Initial work into loading and displaying Paths. Currently there's no splines rendered, only the knots are. It also doesn't support rotations properly yet, but this is only ever used by Unleashed stages actually. But this doesn't mean they aren't functional though. The most useful feature added is currently the option to Snap the selected objects to the nearest path. This is perfect for aligning stuff into Grind Rails, 2D Sections, Quickstep Sections, etc. Simply select your objects, select Snap, and done! The following monitor was created, and snapped to the nearest path to place it perfectly on the QuickStep path.
  
  Spline editing isn't possible at the moment, but it is a planned feature if it ends up working out properly.
  
  
• MultiSetParam window has an addition of its own as well. The "Get from Object" button allows you to get the direction vector straight from the object you have selected. This allows you to easily create MultiSetParam arrays straight from the direction your object is rotated like. This should help quite a lot on making ring trails.
  
  
  
• The mouse raycasting was noticeable to be annoying and inaccurate due to only relying on AABBs. This issue is gone in this update, as the Ray casted from the mouse checks against the polies of the object in question now! This should allow you to more accurately pick the Gizmos, or objects, etc.!
  
  
• There's two new confirmation boxes for users that want to have more control over Stage loading. One will ask if "Do you want to load Terrain Groups?", which allows you to load an AR stage without any Terrain whatsoever if you need to just make a quick layout edit. Particularly useful for editing heavy Generations stages. You can use the Save AR Level function as usual.
  
  The other confirmation box is asking whether you want to clean all the contents of your current stage's cache folder and unpack all the terrain resources. In the case PFD Hashes differ and you don't want to unpack everything, this should allow you to get away with it and just use the current cache's contents.
  
  
• Some users reported that the editor just simply doesn't unpack the terrain's contents. This might be related to some inconsistency in different OS's with the Expand CAB utility. As a little experiment I've included expand.exe, although I'm not sure how much dependencies does it actually need. Regular users shouldn't be affected, and I encourage users that reported the terrain loading didn't work to try this version out instead, in an attempt to track down the problem.
  
  
• Moved the R hotkey to Ctrl+R, for allowing the user to cycle between rendering in Polygons, Wireframe, or Points. Useful if you want to see through some geometry or such.
  
  
• Thanks to Link for updating his Model Importer script for extra support for Unleashed NPCs and other mesh types, plus some other extra features! (Scaling value, etc.) You can find the updated script in the export_scripts folder.

Enjoy the update! If there's anything that's blatantly broken I'll try and fix it on the morning.

[Azu]

Quick question. Do you place on adding the ability to select terrain and export selected terrain(s) as a .dae? Instead of the whole scene? or maybe an option to hover over a piece to tell what the name of it is.