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Sonic Mania (Switch, PS4, Xbox One, PC...Netflix?)

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by TimmiT, Jul 23, 2016.

  1. Frostav

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    The more I play this game, the more I'm convinced that the drop dash is the greatest move ever. I'm honestly stunned that no one came up with it, not even fangame creators, until now. Using it as Sonic adds SO MUCH flow to the stages and cements him as my favorite character to use by far. Being able to quickly drop dash for a burst of speed is like Boost but done well.
     
  2. Blue Spikeball

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    Blue Sphere unlockables are only usable in No Save games. Also, keeping the game harder at the beginning (time limit) and making an easier mode (no time limit) unlockable is counterintuitive. It reminds me of Mega Man Legends, which had an Easy difficulty mode, but for some reason it could only be accessed after beating the game.

    Agreed. I want larger levels that aren't held back by the time limit.

    That wouldn't solve the issue. It would still get in the way of exploration, and would kind of break the scoring system, as it would only take into account how long it took you to beat the boss, rather than the stage as a whole.

    Why do people keep offering alternate workarounds when just removing the imposed time limit is already a perfect solution? Keep the timer for scoring, but don't kill the player when it reaches 10 minutes. That's what modern Sonic games do (with the exception of retro-style games like Sonic 4 and Lost World), and it works rather well.

    No, I want the game to let me play it as normal without a time limit, just like most Sonic games, and games in general. I don't think that's an unreasonable request at all. If it bothers you so much that the game doesn't punish you for exploring and taking your time, they could just make it an option (as long at it doesn't force players to give up saving). Even the classic games had the option, in Sonic Jam.
     
  3. Neowl

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    I guess some people just don't like the "warts and all" approach to emulating the classic style of Sonic games. 1-3K had the time over penalty, so Mania having it too should be a no-brainer, seeing as it's trying to do almost exactly what I mentioned at the start of this reply. Frustrating, sure, but it's by no means a deal breaker.
     
  4. Stimil Rc.

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    This can already sorta be achieved by just using debug mode. Be in object placement mode when the timer runs out, exit, and then the timer resets. Of course, playing like this requires the player to both be able to show some restraint so that they're not cheesing the game and to be okay with no saves.
    To be fair, Sonic could already do something very similar to it in Super Smash Bros.

    The TV Tropes page for Mania suggests that a glitch in Sonic 2 and Lost World (presumably Wii U/PC) also allows for a similar maneuver, but I've done no research into either of those claims.
     
  5. Frostav

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    I cannot think of a single stage in this game that would be improved by being 15 minutes long. Hell, some of Mania's stages are ALREADY pushing it such as Flying Battery 2, and that one took me a "mere" 7 minutes on my last Sonic&Tails run on PC. Three acts would be nice, possibly, but each act needs new gimmicks, a new background, AND a new remix (possibly whole new art besides the background with stages like Press Garden and Studiopolis that completely change between acts), and I dunno if the team can keep that up for 12 zones--that's 36 levels!
     
  6. Overlord

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    What 2D titles haven't had time limits?
     
  7. Blue Spikeball

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    Modern 2d Sonics tend to make the time limit optional.
     
  8. Blue Blood

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    The Advance and Rush series let you disable the timer.

    I haven't heard a good reason to keep the time limit yet. I don't understand why you would want to have it, really. The timer can stay and be used to deliver a time bonus, but why you should die upon it hitting ten minutes eludes me. What does it actually add to the game? If there's a level where a time limit is a necessity as part of its gimmick or plot relevance (think SA2's Green Forest) that's fine. But if all I'm doing is exploring the levels built for exploration then it shouldn't be a thing.
     
  9. Overlord

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    Huh. Didn't even know you could do that, I've never seen a need to.

    Put it this way - Mania was heavily influenced by and built off the 16 and 8 bit Sonics - none of THOSE had no timer.
     
  10. Frostav

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    Honestly I'm baffled by the amount of people complaining about the timer, these levels take like six minutes at best and are often shorter than that. I have never time overed once in a sonic game, I'm pretty sure.

    And I don't get the "I want to EXPLORE though" thing either, Exploring in a sonic game doesn't even make sense when the point is to keep moving forward (note that I didn't say "go fast" before you start bashing out "SONIC'S NOT ABOUT SPEED") which everything from the physics to the level design facilitates. If I miss something I just go back and try again next time through the level.
     
  11. Blue Blood

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    True, but I still don't see why that's an excuse to stick to an archaic design choice. S1 and S2 had much less sprawling designs. There were multiple routes involved, but not exploration. The timer already became a problem in select areas of S3K. And CD was... Well CD was CD. I can actually defend the time limit in that one because time travelling and finding the generators in each level whilst also making it to the goal in time served a purpose. It was a challenge in itself. You could ignore it (or fail it) and the game would be different as a result. That's not the case in Mania though. You're not looking for any one thing, and you don't need to explore every level.
     
  12. Deef

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  13. If you just want to get to the end, sure, but I enjoy going back to see what else the levels have to offer before clearing them.

    Ever since Sonic 1 I liked to explore and see how all the paths connected. I also liked to look for all rings and monitors. It's a perfectly valid way to play, but the 10 minute limit started to get in the way when levels grew the way they did after Sonic 2.

    Yeah, this is fun too, but it's not the same. And if you want to collect everything you have to visit the whole level in one sitting.
     
  14. Deef

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    For most people here with maybe 15+ years experience, 10 minutes is fine.

    For near-new players it's a definite restriction; I've seen this many times in Sonic 3&K and Mania. Remember that finding lives and gathering rings is a fundamental part of some of the game's compulsion. New players playing in the raw/conventional way we've all forgotten easily don't even notice 6 minutes have passed already.

    Not saying the time limit is definitely a bad thing, but it is a thing, and it came from a place where it wasn't a thing (Sonic 1 & 2 ).
     
  15. Lapper

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    Time monitors!
     
  16. DigitalDuck

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    The time limit is part of the challenge and story; Eggman's ruining the world as we speak, gotta put an end to his plans. Wait around and do nothing, and it'll be too late.

    I see no problem with a post-game Explore mode, that allows you to spend as much time exploring the levels as you want (I enjoy exploring the levels myself) but it seems to me that it's not really the main focus of the game (especially not when the game explicitly stops you from backtracking at many points) so I don't see a positive for turning it off in the main game.
     
  17. Covarr

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    I don't think the problem is that there's a time limit. I think the problem is that the time limit is too short for the size and complexity of the stages. Fifteen minutes would be a lot better.
     
  18. Rudie Radio Waves

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    Many a game.
    Hell, why stop at fifteen? Have levels with different timers that go anywhere from 5 to 20 minutes.
     
  19. Stimil Rc.

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    How would you make this rationalization work for Sonic CD?
     
  20. Deef

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    It's a tough call to say the game's focus should be shifted more towards the timer like that. That's pretty much the only reason I don't jump at Lapper's suggestion of time monitors; either they matter enough and the game has a different feel altogether, or they don't matter enough. Likewise with tuning level timers to the levels.

    I almost wanted to suggest (as I dream about even longer levels) to leave the 10 minutes in place but insert capsules at suitable intervals, without bosses, and reset the timer with each. So the conceptual impetus is still there, but the lack of actual pressure is also still there, while allowing levels to still grow, while also allowing new players to relax a bit more.

    Then I realised that's borderline acts without mini bosses.