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Opinion of the Mega Drive Sonic Trilogy - Europe vs North America

Discussion in 'General Sonic Discussion' started by BlackHole, Nov 6, 2016.

Which game do you think is the best? (Keep North American and European votes separate, please and th

  1. EUR - Sonic the Hedgehog (1991)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. EUR - Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (1992)

    7.9%
  3. EUR - Sonic the Hedgehog 3 and Knuckles (1994)

    31.7%
  4. NA - Sonic the Hedgehog (1991)

    1.6%
  5. NA - Sonic the Hedgehog 2 (1992)

    7.1%
  6. NA - Sonic the Hedgehog 3 and Knuckles (1994)

    51.6%
  1. winterhell

    winterhell

    Member
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    I don't think the lock on itself made the game less popular. If you think that meant people spent higher % of the time with the S&K cartridge playing Knuckles in Sonic 2 or Blue Sphere, instead of 100% of the time being S&K only, it could be seen the other way, as an advertisement for the game since its longer 'in your face' on top of the console.

    Personally I was on a pirate version of S&K for the longest time and didn't know about the lock on until years later. The unlit Super Emeralds in Hidden Palace Zone had a huge 'mysterious' feel and only sparkled imagination. Same with Sonic 3's blocked off paths that were exclusive for Knuckles. I don't think that feeling can be replicated nowadays.
     
  2. Sir_mihael

    Sir_mihael

    DON'T TRUST THIS MAN Member
    No new opinion here. I'm basically echoing what Yash wrote.

    Part of the problem is that the average person back in the day wasn't thinking along the lines of Sonic 3 and Knuckles being one amazing game.
    They knew Sonic 2.
    They knew Sonic 3.
    They knew Sonic & Knuckles.
    They knew there was some cool gimmick where "you could like- plug in the games and play as Knuckles in like... sonic 1 or 2 or something?", but that was about it.

    Personally, I still think Sonic 3 and Knuckles is the gold standard of Mega Drive Sonic, and 2D Sonic in general. Great levels, great music and a good narrative told through very basic cutscenes. Knuckles having his own unique bosses and level progression was great. I feel like it tops Sonic 2 in too many ways.

    That being said, Sonic 2 didn't have the problem of being split into two games. You got one great experience in one cart, and the jump from Sonic 1 was phenomenal. It's easy to see why Sonic 2 became the popular more memorable game. Sonic 3 & Knuckles required a bit more effort to play back in the day and that probably put off the more casual Mega Drive player, especially one who was disappointed with Sonic 3's solo offering.
     
  3. CosmicEternity

    CosmicEternity

    Member
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    No
    Probably Sonic 2, since it introduced Tails and had better level design than Sonic 1 in my opinion.
     
  4. Pexs

    Pexs

    Otherwise known as Spex Member
    NA Here.

    For me, Sonic 3/K is too vertical. It's usually not about going fast, more about traversing the level and figuring out where to go. It doesn't have enough of what I like about Sonic 2 for me to play through all those levels. Sonic 1 is fast, but it isn't about going fast. There's lots of platforming to break up that speed.

    I can go faster in Sonic 2, quicker. And going fast is fun. The exploratory levels in Sonic 2 don't show up until way down the line, so it's easier to pick up and play.

    Also, unlike Sonic 1, I don't have to sludge through any of the "bad" levels. I don't like Sonic 1's style of level design, a style that becomes more apparent after GHZ.

    Also helps that I played Sonic 2 before the other two, and I never beat Sonic 3 as a kid because of the CNZ Barrel until years down the line in Mega Collection.


    Tl;dr: Sonic 1 is disappointing and Sonic 3 is slower, so Sonic 2.
     
  5. Laura

    Laura

    Brightened Eyes Member
    I honestly thin Sonic 2 and Sonic 3AK are equal. 2 has a faster, more approachable pace, better sprite art, multiplayer and more unique tropes. 3AK has more sophisticated level design, more interesting setpieces, better implementation of characters and, crucially, a save feature.

    3AK is my favourite and the one I'd recommend, but I consider 2 more iconic.
     
  6. Beltway

    Beltway

    The most grateful Sonic fan of all time this week Member
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    Sega of Darkest Peru
    Artwork and classes
    Generally agreed with the comments about the public being more aware of Sonic 2 due to various factors (holiday release, long campaign / massive promotion, height of Genesis popularity, not being split into two games). I also agree about the Genesis pack-in element too, though internet searches seem to indicate there actually were Genesis bundles for the games--one for Sonic 3 (Europe), one for Sonic & Knuckles (NA and Europe), and even one with both Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles (NA). That said, all these bundles seem to be ultra-rare (rather telling that the sources I've found for the sheer existence of these bundles are only their presence as auction bidding listings or Sega enthusiast websites--some of them not even in English!), and --based on the Genesis models used-- look like they were budget bundles released in the twilight years of the console's life, if not well after the fourth generation outright (during N64/Saturn/PS1 times). I'm not really even sure if some of them are even official bundles from Sega as it is. A far cry from the heavily promoted Sonic 1/2 bundles that were released during the console's peak and when those games were still hot on the market; to say the least.

    European Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles bundles:

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    NA Sonic & Knuckles and Sonic 3 + Sonic & Knuckles bundles:

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    According to The Magic Box's Platinum US Chart for Videogames, that was exactly the case for that territory, though it's not by a significant amount. Sonic & Knuckles moved 202,000 more copies than Sonic 3 did.

    Also this. Lock-on was mentioned quite a bit with Sonic & Knuckles' promotion, but it was more about bonus content like the aforementioned Knuckles in Sonic 2 or Blue Sphere rather than how it made Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles one intended cohesive experience. You can see this reflected in the reviews too at the time of release--most reviewer's praise its inclusion of the game more for the additional features rather than how it connected Sonic 3 as a game.

    That of which kinda leads into a bigger point I've felt for a while, in that Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were never really played up as two (episodic) parts of one big game--they were marketed and viewed as back-to-back sequels, and you can see this reflected in reviews. A fair amount of reviews at the time about Sonic & Knuckles fault it for being too similar to Sonic 3, though it's still praised for being a good game. Sonic 3 didn't get hit with this quite as much, though there are also negative points about the numbers of zones and the multiplayer component in comparison to Sonic 2. Most of these complaints (except multiplayer) are squashed when they're viewed as one big Sonic 3.

    Really is a shame the game was never released as one big title and given a similar marketing push as the previous two IMO. Likely would had sold significantly better, and everyone --rather than just dedicated Sonic/Sega fans-- would be contesting it on whether it or Sonic 2 is Sonic's highest point, if not be in wide agreement it eclipsed Sonic 2 outright. Sorta like how common consensus can't decide if Mario 3 or Mario World is the Mario series' best (2D) game.

    All that aside, to answer the question--NA (US in particular) person here, and as much as I love and hold a big spot for Sonic 2 (one of the first games, if not the first game, I ever played, let alone my first Sonic game), I think Sonic 3&K edges it out as the superior game. Part of it is for its further expansion of the formula (bonus stages, character-exclusive abilities and routes, elemental shields) and having more overall polish put into it (stuff like save states and the overall presentation). Only a few things I'd fault Sonic 3&K compared to Sonic 2 that aren't cosmetic (I'm more fond of Sonic's sprite design and music jingles from Sonic 1/2 as opposed to those from 3&K) is the multiplayer component, the CNZ barrel (yeah, I was one of those who got stuck with it lol), and to an extent, even the level design to some extent.

    I think Sonic 2 has the upper hand on 3&K in terms of having more varied level structure. The collective map structures for zones like Casino Night, Mystic Cave, and Wing Fortress can be said to be less similar in general level path direction in comparison to Carnival Night, Lava Reef, and Flying Battery. Levels in Sonic 3&K feel more like they are, with some exceptions, largely designed around an "ant colony" mindset, and this applies from beginning to end; while Sonic 2 starts off simple and gets more busy, while also having more unique level setpieces. With that said, I also do think Sonic 3&K totally has Sonic 2 beat with its overall more sizable level design scope, and larger emphasis on exploration (including character-specific routes and hidden rooms for Special Stages). A even share of the two level design philosophies or a third philosophy that finds a "sweet spot" between them, would be the best route to take for future Sonic games in my opinion. (I think Sonic Mania may be hitting this "sweet spot" bit in particular--judging from what I've seen from the shown levels so far, it looks like it has Sonic 2's varied level structure approach adapted to Sonic 3&K's giant level sizes, with Sonic 3's character-specific routes and hidden Special Stage routes added to the mix).