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I want your maps

#46 User is offline Ralakimus 

Posted 18 April 2018 - 07:47 PM

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Ahh, yes. Sorry about that. Fixed my post and on the wiki.

EDIT: Also quickly got the CNZ maps since they don't have objects that need to be defined in SonLVL.

Posted Image
Posted Image

Also now on the wiki.
This post has been edited by Ralakimus: 18 April 2018 - 08:32 PM

#47 User is offline MainMemory 

Posted 18 April 2018 - 10:12 PM

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Just so you're aware, I plan on writing a program to export palettes, tiles, blocks, chunks, and full maps for all the levels in Sonic 1 (both revisions), Sonic 2 Final (REV00+REV01), Knuckles in Sonic 2, and Sonic 3 & Knuckles. It could also be used for Sonic CD, but I don't have access to the data for that.

I don't know how much of that would be needed on the wiki, or how I'd get it all on there, so I'll probably just upload ZIP files to my website and link them here.
This post has been edited by MainMemory: 18 April 2018 - 10:14 PM

#48 User is offline BlazeHedgehog 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:44 AM

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This thread is also good timing for me, because I was looking for full-size level maps for an upcoming video for my Youtube channel. I figured I'd just have to fudge some numbers, though, because what I'm really looking for are full-size maps of Sonic 3 & Knuckles stages. There's plenty of full-size Sonic 2 maps out there. but everyone always scales down S3&K maps.

#49 User is online Neo 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 03:12 AM

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Since everyone else is throwing their hat into the ring, I'm the someone MainMemory mentioned was working on the SonLVL object definitions for S3K. I've been badgering him to add features so I can do stuff like properly render objects which load their own palette, as well as the paths of moving objects, and that's coming along nicely but slowly. I have some time off next week, so I'm hoping I can get basic definitions for the all the levels, which would allow us to export proper, full-size maps for the entire game.

#50 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 08:02 AM

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Well, if we're all calling out what we're working on, my level editing application can handle Knuckles Chaotix and possibly Crackers, which MM said SonLVL cannot. Also, yesterday I began working on a differencing function. You can load two different tilesheets, block definitions, chunk definitions, and level maps, and it'll render whichever you choose while highlighting the differences. Example, if map 1 is a protype of map 2, and say map 2 changes the very first chunk of the level, then when rendering the level, that first chunk in the level map is highlighted in red. Going further, I'll highlight individual block and tile changes within chunks as different colors, too. THat way, at a visual glance, you'll be able to spot the differences between level layouts as prototypes progressed. I figure, with the Knuckles Chaotix prototypes, this would be a neat way to plot the evolution of level layouts.

#51 User is offline Ralakimus 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 09:52 AM

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I have been working on object definitions for the Simon Wai prototype for SonLVL. Problem is that due to the way the disassembly is set up, I had to make quite a number of changes to the disassembly.

For example, there's a separate set of block data for animated art tiles for each level that haven't been split off. A lot of object mappings have not been split into their own files either.

#52 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 11:37 AM

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View PostRalakimus, on 18 April 2018 - 07:47 PM, said:

Ahh, yes. Sorry about that. Fixed my post and on the wiki.

Wood Zone has some guff on the far right too. And I think Hidden Palace Zone does too IIRC.

While it means half the map is taken up by a giant void, it's good to be as accurate as possible. I also gives a bearing on just how big the void is (which might give clues about how big the level was planned to be).

EDIT: I've been informed there's a technical reason behind this, i.e. it's not part of the map proper - ignore me if I'm wrong.
This post has been edited by Black Squirrel: 19 April 2018 - 12:10 PM

#53 User is offline Ralakimus 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 12:10 PM

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My issue on that is that it's not truly an extra section of level data at the end, but rather it's a loopback due to a bad max horizontal camera boundary.

EDIT: Nevermind, just saw the talk page on the wiki. Though, I disagree on the "which might give clues about how big the level was planned to be" part, seeing as the value used looked to be just a placeholder (seeing as it's also used in quite a number of other levels), and thus shouldn't be used to judge the planned size of the level.
This post has been edited by Ralakimus: 19 April 2018 - 12:22 PM

#54 User is offline MainMemory 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 12:47 PM

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View PostRalakimus, on 19 April 2018 - 09:52 AM, said:

For example, there's a separate set of block data for animated art tiles for each level that haven't been split off.

Sonic 2 final has this same problem. I've been thinking of having SonLVL's project files include binary files for those blocks, to be patched over the normal blocks in display only. Similarly for the animated art, though that would just use the regular art files.

#55 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:40 PM

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View PostRalakimus, on 19 April 2018 - 12:10 PM, said:

My issue on that is that it's not truly an extra section of level data at the end, but rather it's a loopback due to a bad max horizontal camera boundary.

EDIT: Nevermind, just saw the talk page on the wiki. Though, I disagree on the "which might give clues about how big the level was planned to be" part, seeing as the value used looked to be just a placeholder (seeing as it's also used in quite a number of other levels), and thus shouldn't be used to judge the planned size of the level.

Placeholder or not, it's good to document what's actually there as opposed to what we think should be there.

There's massive gaps in Metropolis Zone, which is already a long stage. I don't doubt that these levels probably weren't going to be as big as what we see in the Simon Wai proto, but the fact the dimensions haven't been set to a more sensible value suggests that maybe, at some point, they envisioned it being longer. That might not be true, but I don't want to make the call.


"This is what the level looks like, errors et al."
This post has been edited by Black Squirrel: 19 April 2018 - 01:40 PM

#56 User is offline Ralakimus 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 01:59 PM

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Alrighty, if that's what you want, I gotcha covered. Just give me a few.

EDIT: Done! (Warning, large images)
Spoiler

Direct links:
CNZ1
CNZ2
MTZ1
MTZ2
MTZ3
WZ

These good? Also note that I didn't do HPZ because I didn't make that map. I will most likely make my own sometime that includes objects and the loopback.
This post has been edited by Ralakimus: 19 April 2018 - 02:29 PM

#57 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 April 2018 - 03:47 PM

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Excellent.

The other reason for this is if we're to find other prototypes that start to address this issue, we can see if anyone ever gave a damn about Wood Zone or Hidden Palace past the Wai beta.

#58 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 20 April 2018 - 03:16 PM

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RE: Palettes

http://info.sonicret...plate:MDPalette

Between myself and Hivebrain, we've developed a way of displaying Mega Drive palettes on the Sonic Retro wiki. You feed it a bunch of 0BGR values.

It might change, but if you're wanting to store Mega Drive palettes on the wiki somewhere, this is a way to do it.

#59 User is offline MainMemory 

Posted 20 April 2018 - 05:36 PM

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So, should I have my program output text files with MDPalette templates?

#60 User is offline Rlan 

Posted 21 April 2018 - 01:22 AM

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The weirdest thing for me is someone who makes a whole map of somethign... and then it's cut in half the size. There are maps for the levels in 3D Blast out there, but it's like they didn't the whole thing, then shrunk in to 1/3 the size :(

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