Sonic and Sega Retro Message Board: Sonic X-treme Textures and Defs - Sonic and Sega Retro Message Board

Jump to content

Hey there, Guest!  (Log In · Register) Help
  • 30 Pages +
  • ◄ First
  • 17
  • 18
  • 19
  • 20
  • 21
  • Last ►
    Locked
    Locked Forum

Sonic X-treme Textures and Defs General Discussion & Hacking

#271 User is offline SegaLoco 

Posted 15 December 2009 - 11:23 PM

  • W)(at did you say?
  • Posts: 999
  • Joined: 16-August 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Corpus Christi, TX
  • Wiki edits:79
QUOTE (Tweaker @ Dec 14 2009, 07:22 AM)
QUOTE (olaf @ Dec 14 2009, 08:01 AM)
it's taking you guys way too long to make playable versions of these maps.

I apologize profusely for people being unable to liberally pull game engines out of their asses.

Now THAT would be a spectacle. I am curious, I know what Andrew is working on, but are there any other decent Xtreme remakes going on. I haven't checked on Senntient's fan stuff part of the site, but iirc there are only 1 or 2 fan games going compared to the 9000 that started. =P

#272 User is offline Mad Echidna 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 01:53 AM

  • Gone
  • Posts: 5219
  • Joined: 13-January 03
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:4
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.
This post has been edited by Mad Echidna: 16 December 2009 - 01:53 AM

#273 User is offline Energy 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 04:20 AM

  • Posts: 64
  • Joined: 14-December 09
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lincs, UK
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 16 2009, 06:53 AM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.


My plan is to eventually make an engine that will allow you to play the DEF files, and also an editor to make custom maps etc... I've started on something but I have no idea how it will turn out so I'm not promising anything to the community yet. It just wouldn't be fair.

I have quite a few ideas running in my head though so just be known at least one (and I'm sure more) are looking at it, but it's not like the DEF files are a known format so you're gonna have to give it time for the community to work it out. Until we got the paths working too the levels would be completely unplayable anyway as you'd get stuck very quickly in most levels smile.png

Then you need to build a decent physics and a playable sonic, then implement items and enemies.

Then if you want to make a game that will actually be fun to play you're going to have to start filling in the gaps and doing a lot more work. This wont happen over night smile.png

#274 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 08:19 AM

  • NotEqual Tech, Inc - VR & Game Dev
  • Posts: 4120
  • Joined: 06-April 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:9
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 15 2009, 10:53 PM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.


Thats what I'm doing.

#275 User is offline Andrew75 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 10:50 AM

  • Technical Artist
  • Posts: 1822
  • Joined: 12-December 09
  • Gender:Male
  • Project:Project AXSX(Sonic Xtreme) + Misc Projects
Hey guys ,im not the only persion working in project ASAX. (Andrew Xeniczone Sonic Xtreme)
Xeniczone is doing the engine im just the art and 3d modeler guy.
togeather were a team,
This post has been edited by Andrew75: 16 December 2009 - 10:51 AM

#276 User is offline Skeledroid 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 11:08 AM

  • Posts: 227
  • Joined: 17-November 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:1
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 16 2009, 12:53 AM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.

As long as they keep all the original level layout/textures, I don't care. It's still the same levels regardless of the format. v.png

#277 User is offline ICEknight 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 12:04 PM

  • Posts: 10479
  • Joined: 11-January 03
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Spain
  • Wiki edits:18
QUOTE (olaf @ Dec 16 2009, 11:08 AM)
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 16 2009, 12:53 AM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.

As long as they keep all the original level layout/textures, I don't care. It's still the same levels regardless of the format. v.png
By reverse-engineering the format, you'd have all the levels in less time than the first one will be completed.

#278 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 12:07 PM

  • NotEqual Tech, Inc - VR & Game Dev
  • Posts: 4120
  • Joined: 06-April 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:9
QUOTE (ICEknight @ Dec 16 2009, 09:04 AM)
QUOTE (olaf @ Dec 16 2009, 11:08 AM)
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 16 2009, 12:53 AM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.

As long as they keep all the original level layout/textures, I don't care. It's still the same levels regardless of the format. v.png
By reverse-engineering the format, you'd have all the levels in less time than the first one will be completed.


Eh, it's a legitimate project. I don't see it any differently than when Tax recreated EHZ in the Dreamcast version of Retro Sonic.

Energy and I are communicating with info about what we find with the level defs anyways, so it's not like no work is being done on the level formats. I appreciate what Andrew is doing at least.

#279 User is offline Skeledroid 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 02:02 PM

  • Posts: 227
  • Joined: 17-November 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:1
QUOTE (ICEknight @ Dec 16 2009, 11:04 AM)
QUOTE (olaf @ Dec 16 2009, 11:08 AM)
QUOTE (Mad Echidna @ Dec 16 2009, 12:53 AM)
I think it's a shame Andrew is only making a total remake instead re-engineering it. Hopefully more coders take a stab at the DEF format. C4 is pretty but this game was supposed to run on pentiums for goodness sake.

As long as they keep all the original level layout/textures, I don't care. It's still the same levels regardless of the format. v.png
By reverse-engineering the format, you'd have all the levels in less time than the first one will be completed.

not necessarily, you'd have to rewrite the engine to use that format. and who's to say that the DEF format is even a good format? anyway, as long we get playable levels true to the original -- regardless of time, who cares? we've waited since 1996, we can wait X amount of more time to play it.
This post has been edited by olaf: 16 December 2009 - 02:03 PM

#280 User is offline Andrew75 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 04:05 PM

  • Technical Artist
  • Posts: 1822
  • Joined: 12-December 09
  • Gender:Male
  • Project:Project AXSX(Sonic Xtreme) + Misc Projects
As the original raw format of DEF is concerned ,
Reverse engineering it wont be as beneficial to game performance.
because it uses separate cubes or portions of cubes to build the levels.
the more separate models u have will hit performance no mater what engine your on.
if you combine them to single model or reference them, sure you'll get a better performance.
but u still have more polygons, and more vertex, vs. the method I'm using to rebuild the level.

I'm doing a totally closed model which cuts down on polygons and vertex more than 60% from the original Def format.

imagine the each cube inside the def format.
I have no idea how many cubes are in jade gully lets say its about 100 cubes. I know theres gata be more than 100.
now imagine that each sides of the cube ,
lets say it has 4 sides, 2 being deleted (back and bottom)
each side is not connected to the other, they are 4 separate planes. thats 8 triangle polygons
and each side holds 4 vertex each. 4 x 4 = 16... now thats 16 vertex for all 4 sides
so
100 x 16 vertex = 1600 vertex.
and
100 x 8 = 800 polygons

lets compare that to the way I built the model
since I didn't use cubes,, just sides of cubes , and since there all welded. 1 side connecting to the other does not have double vertex per side when by side. each vertex is shared
100 cubes worth of mass.
1 cube Worth of mass on my model is = to 1 side each cube mass....which is 2 triangles, which is 4 vertex total.
so
100 x 4 = 400 vertex..... than minus a percent of shared vertex (which I have no clue on the numbers and theres even less than 400 vertex.)
and 100 x 2 = 200 polygons



, I may be a little off with the math , but ahh well.
This post has been edited by Andrew75: 16 December 2009 - 05:31 PM

#281 User is offline ICEknight 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 06:07 PM

  • Posts: 10479
  • Joined: 11-January 03
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Spain
  • Wiki edits:18
...Those levels built with cubes could run in computers from the mid-90's. How could performance be an issue nowadays?

#282 User is offline Cooljerk 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 08:06 PM

  • NotEqual Tech, Inc - VR & Game Dev
  • Posts: 4120
  • Joined: 06-April 06
  • Gender:Male
  • Wiki edits:9
Not to mention my engine is already eliminating extraneous sides.

#283 User is offline Andrew75 

Posted 16 December 2009 - 08:08 PM

  • Technical Artist
  • Posts: 1822
  • Joined: 12-December 09
  • Gender:Male
  • Project:Project AXSX(Sonic Xtreme) + Misc Projects
QUOTE (Cooljerk @ Dec 16 2009, 08:06 PM)
Not to mention my engine is already eliminating extraneous sides.

awsome!
, hey can it weld vertex as well for neighboring cube faces?
this would be a great perforence boster! trust me.


QUOTE
...Those levels built with cubes could run in computers from the mid-90's. How could performance be an issue nowadays?

very close draw distances were used often back in the mid 90-s
keep in mind alot of people have these older systems.
we want them to be able to enjoy this game as optomized as can be.

sorry if I'm nitpicking but
when it comes to optimizing my models for best performance, I'm a perfectest.
every ounce of performance matters even on super systems like my own .
This post has been edited by Andrew75: 16 December 2009 - 08:33 PM

#284 User is offline Energy 

Posted 17 December 2009 - 04:28 AM

  • Posts: 64
  • Joined: 14-December 09
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Lincs, UK
QUOTE (Cooljerk @ Dec 17 2009, 01:06 AM)
Not to mention my engine is already eliminating extraneous sides.


Nice smile.png Mine's still at infancy, I've had a very busy week. Christmas coming and all. Saw Avatar last night as well (technically wow, very epic, but story is in no way perfect bit too formulaic). So mine's literally just doing the very basics atm.

Oh and yeah Andrew75 and his teams version will be great too - they can be more flexible, add more special effects, their own levels and textures. I think Cooljerk and I are more in it for the learning and technical challenge of recreating the levels from the raw files. Making them playable is a side-effect. smile.png
This post has been edited by Energy: 17 December 2009 - 04:32 AM

#285 User is offline zeldarocks 

Posted 17 December 2009 - 04:34 AM

  • Posts: 5
  • Joined: 10-May 09
  • Location:Parallel Universe, playing Sonic Xtreme
You guys are each working on different engines/viewers? Why not just pitch in and aid in the development of a a single Xtreme recreation?

  • 30 Pages +
  • ◄ First
  • 17
  • 18
  • 19
  • 20
  • 21
  • Last ►
    Locked
    Locked Forum

2 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 2 guests, 0 anonymous users