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Sonic Crackers is not a Beta, it's a joke Crackers is a joke among developers/pirates

#31 User is offline OcelotBot 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 12:20 PM

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Sonic "Clackers". That does make a lot more sense, haha.

Whatever you do, do not look up the Australian meaning for Clackers XD

#32 User is offline infinity 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 01:07 PM

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View PostLaura, on 19 February 2017 - 11:44 AM, said:

We still have some unanswered questions though. Who are Morgoth and Gandalf, how come they have no digital trace?

And how come they got their hands on such an early prototype of Chaotix only a few months after the game's launch?


They are Lord of the Rings character names and they seemed to run a warez BBS back in 95 which is why they keep advertising 'The Evil Empire' so hard.

The actual source will be in Europe (possibly Britain because they had Sega connections). Because to upload the game to the BBS you'd have to call up, and you don't want to be calling up international.

The Clackers thing is actually hilarious, but you realize the Japanese don't deliberately put R's where L's belong? So doesn't it prove it is a joke? Either by Sega-affiliated dev in Europe or someone in SoA.
You are making a joke about a Japanese made Sonic game so you call it Crackers cause they can't say Clackers. That seems to be actually the main joke. Probably by a dev who was not impressed with Chaotix i bet.

I still willing to bet you it was made AFTER Chaotix using it's code to just make the joke about the game being bad. Otherwise who put the joke title and why was it distributed in the warez scene for people to laugh at?

#33 User is offline big smile 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 01:23 PM

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View Postinfinity, on 19 February 2017 - 01:07 PM, said:

The Clackers thing is actually hilarious, but you realize the Japanese don't deliberately put R's where L's belong? So doesn't it prove it is a joke? Either by Sega-affiliated dev in Europe or someone in SoA.
You are making a joke about a Japanese made Sonic game so you call it Crackers cause they can't say Clackers. That seems to be actually the main joke. Probably by a dev who was not impressed with Chaotix i bet.


As I understand, Japanese doesn't have the letter l in their alphabet. So they have to substitute with another letter and they often use R. (E.g. London is often misspelt as Rondon).
So for a Japanese speaker who doesn't know much English, Crackers would be fine for Clackers.

That's why Metal Sonic is sometimes spelt as Metru Sonic in Japanese books. Going by the Japanese alphabet, Ru is actually a fine substitute for 'al', even though it's wrong in English.

#34 User is offline Taylor 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 01:28 PM

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I think it's a tad funny you use "wow look how silly and immature this pirate group acts" as evidence, considering the history of the Sonic hacking scene.

Anyway, the lack of info on Morgoth and Gandalf seems to be more of, in general, we don't have much info on that time period. There's too many connections between Crackers and the Chaotix prototypes to call it a hoax, even an "official" one.
This post has been edited by Taylor: 19 February 2017 - 01:30 PM

#35 User is offline S0LV0 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 01:30 PM

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View Postbig smile, on 19 February 2017 - 08:45 AM, said:

I wouldn't read too much into Crackers being a silly name. It was probably made by a Japanese development team, who might have thought the word meant something else. A bit like how Donkey Kong was supposed to mean stubborn monkey.

Or, also, Genocide City. :v:

View Postinfinity, on 19 February 2017 - 01:07 PM, said:

The Clackers thing is actually hilarious, but you realize the Japanese don't deliberately put R's where L's belong? So doesn't it prove it is a joke? Either by Sega-affiliated dev in Europe or someone in SoA.
You are making a joke about a Japanese made Sonic game so you call it Crackers cause they can't say Clackers. That seems to be actually the main joke. Probably by a dev who was not impressed with Chaotix i bet.

EDIT: This is a ridiculous argument, as DigitalDuck explains below, and I know the L/R mixup is common because I work with the Generations engine where a lot of internal files have it.
Spoiler

So... yeah, it's an actual thing. :specialed:
This post has been edited by S0LV0: 19 February 2017 - 01:42 PM

#36 User is offline DigitalDuck 

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View Postinfinity, on 19 February 2017 - 01:07 PM, said:

The Clackers thing is actually hilarious, but you realize the Japanese don't deliberately put R's where L's belong? So doesn't it prove it is a joke? Either by Sega-affiliated dev in Europe or someone in SoA.
You are making a joke about a Japanese made Sonic game so you call it Crackers cause they can't say Clackers. That seems to be actually the main joke. Probably by a dev who was not impressed with Chaotix i bet.


No, that's not the case at all.

Japanese don't deliberately put Rs where Ls belong, but they can (and frequently do) do it accidentally, as ラ゛, リ゛, ル゛, レ゛, ロ゛(la, li, lu, le, lo) are rarely used, instead sticking with ラ, リ, ル, レ, ロ (ra, ri, ru, re, ro); many Japanese people do not distinguish between an English R and an English L, as the nearest sound to both in Japanese is the ら-set of syllables. As a result, Crackers and Clackers are both pronounced the same in Japanese: クラッカーズ (kurakkaazu) (Cluckers is also pronounced this way).

It's not because "they can't say Clackers" at all; it's that the two words are pronounced the same in Japanese, and if you don't speak English (as is common for Japanese people, being, y'know, Japanese) you might think that because it's pronounced the same it's also spelt the same. They call it Crackers because Crackers is a word that sounds exactly the same to the word they want to use.

#37 User is offline Overlord 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 01:52 PM

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View Postinfinity, on 19 February 2017 - 01:07 PM, said:

The Clackers thing is actually hilarious, but you realize the Japanese don't deliberately put R's where L's belong?


Posted Image

http://geekologie.co...ling-mistak.php

At a high-profile trade show, of all things. And this isn't the only time this has happened.

#38 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:08 PM

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Posted Image

The correct sound is something between "l" and "r". It's one of the most common symptoms of dodgy Japanese -> English translations.

Posted Image

#39 User is online Blue Blood 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:12 PM

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The R/L phenomenon with East Asian dialects is perhaps the best known example of common translational mixups. As pointed out by others, it happens constantly. It's no coincidence that Sonic and Tails are tethered like a pair of clackers, and the game is called "crackers". If anything, it only acts against your argument.

#40 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:18 PM

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p.s. I'm doubtful I can dig up much for the reasons I've already described but here's CVG pointing out that development of Chaotix started in January 1994:

http://retrocdn.net/...160.pdf&page=32

I think it's conceivable that Crackers represents about three months of effort. From what I can gather, game development around this time took between 8-12 months on average, though in this case there's a platform change to take into account and the very real possibility that it was only a pitch (as opposed to a fully staffed and funded project) in April 1994.

#41 User is offline Ritz 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:23 PM

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Clackers?! CLACKERS?!?!

Posted Image

Really wish these magic German hackers had set a foot in our community so that we could've seen some quality fan projects a decade sooner- they evidently threw together a fair bit of professional art and animation (without Sega's proprietary digitizer tablets?) in a very short time, all for a laugh.

#42 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:30 PM

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Just to prove the name wasn't completely unexpected:
Posted Image
Crime Crackers, December 1994.

May even have been the reason the name was changed!

#43 User is offline Ritz 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 02:47 PM

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I've also heard in passing that Crackers was mostly handled by STI, is there anything to corroborate that? It wasn't unusual for those guys to pour months into pitch development. The visual style of those stages (industrial with muted colors) is totally in line with the art we know for sure that Americans were responsible for (Oil Ocean, Metropolis, all of Spinball), and it may also justify the unconventional ASCII title screen and relative lack of coding skill (EDIT: Also explains why they would've been working with Sonic 2 as a base, being the last Sonic they would've had access to).
This post has been edited by Ritz: 19 February 2017 - 02:52 PM

#44 User is offline Dark Sonic 

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View PostBlack Squirrel, on 19 February 2017 - 02:30 PM, said:

Just to prove the name wasn't completely unexpected:
Posted Image
Crime Crackers, December 1994.

May even have been the reason the name was changed!

Well that name makes some sense. Judging from the title they crack crimes, like they cracked the case or something. Sonic Crackers though I can't really think of an explanation for that one.

#45 User is offline Black Squirrel 

Posted 19 February 2017 - 03:08 PM

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http://retrocdn.net/...29UK.pdf&page=8

Quote

Since the add-on's launch Sega have admitted to having two possible Sonic games in production, but unsure which, if any, would become a completed product.


From what we have, it appears that Sega were a little reluctant to show off Chaotix because its control scheme was a little... bold. When it was finally shown in early 1995, most of the work had been done, save for special stages and extra layers of polish (consistent with our prototypes, really).

Not that there's a set time period for when games should be shown off, but Sonic 1 and 2 debuted early and we got a good look at some really really early Saturn titles (of the 5-10% complete, barely playable variety). There wasn't much confidence in Chaotix (and tbh it shows).




I wouldn't want to draw a specific connection to STI but it's fully possible that as 32X console development was American-led, software was mostly US-based too. Virtua Racing Deluxe was an in-house Japanese-led product, but most other things were sent off to external studios or produced stateside. The focus was on the Saturn.



also
http://forums.sonicr...79



and that other 32X Sonic game? My money's on Sonic X-treme.
This post has been edited by Black Squirrel: 19 February 2017 - 03:09 PM

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